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Brexit: give me a positive effect... X

Discussion in 'off topic' started by kabayiri, Jan 13, 2021.

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  1. kabayiri

    kabayiri pfm Member

    And once levelled up, people will return back to their home.

    So where do our fruit and veg pickers come from then? Was it all a temporary fix?

    When I was last in Poland the complaint was about the cheaper Ukrainians coming in for jobs. It seemed rather ironic.

    I can understand why Poland joined the Union though. They have been a country pulled around for the last 150 years by their neighbours.
  2. Conan

    Conan Loop digger

    If that's how you want to play it,
    Portugal 8384
    UK 84750
    Sonority likes this.
  3. notaclue

    notaclue pfm Member

  4. stevec67

    stevec67 pfm Member

    Except they don't go home. Some do, sure, but plenty stay. They have a decent life, they like it here. Home becomes Leeds, or London, or Manchester. Our fruit and veg pickers will always come from elsewhere. When I was a kid in the 80s it was the itinerant Irish potato pickers who came for the season and became the village publican's best friends for a month or 6 weeks. Before that it was the Windrush generation, and the Indian and Pakistani mill workers. Before that it was Hungarian and Polish miners and steelworkers who replaced the men killed in WW2. Before that, in the 19th century, it was the Dutch rutters who dug the drains in East Anglia and Lincolnshire to reclaim the land. People move for work, and they make a life where they land. It's been happening in Europe for 2000 years. It's not going to stop now.

    Oh, and let's not forget the Boys From The Blackstuff gastarbeiters of the 80s who left 3 million UK unemployed behind to work in construction sites in Germany. It's not all one way.
    i_should_coco, Spike, russel and 4 others like this.
  5. Nick_G

    Nick_G pfm Member

  6. stevec67

    stevec67 pfm Member

  7. Colin Barron

    Colin Barron pfm Member

    This could be part of the reason along with grants, cheap loans and western European companies moving production to Poland.
  8. stephen bennett

    stephen bennett Mr Enigma

    tuga and TheDecameron like this.
  9. Stunsworth

    Stunsworth pfm Member

    tuga and Sonority like this.
  10. Seeker_UK

    Seeker_UK I had amnesia once or twice...

  11. stephen bennett

    stephen bennett Mr Enigma

  12. Colin L

    Colin L LOU Attitude Adjuster

    Cause or effect Colin. Try to think past zero-sum economics.

    Low wages attract jobs and the EU is funding Poland to help infrastructure and development, raising standard of living and wages which means they then become a good market for the EU. A rising tide lifts all boats..
  13. kabayiri

    kabayiri pfm Member

    Exactly !

    And after Brexit, they will come from the next up and coming place. So, people from Hong Kong might indeed come and find a decent life here. There will still be work and life and trade in years to come.

    It makes sense really.
  14. russel

    russel ./_dazed_and_confused

    It's almost as if they think The Marshall Plan was a good idea and worked, it didn't obviously and we would have all been better off with austerity like after WW1 which lead to peace and prosperity throughout Europe.
    eisenach likes this.
  15. kabayiri

    kabayiri pfm Member

    Using the same logic then, why didn't the EU offer the UK a harmonious transition and trading deal, thereby lifting our boats and helping us buy even more BMWs !
  16. kabayiri

    kabayiri pfm Member

    That doesn't look levelled up to me. Some of those countries have been the EU for donkeys years. They should have had enough time and assistance to become positive contributors, if we use the levelling up concept.

    Maybe it's more complicated.
  17. Sue Pertwee-Tyr

    Sue Pertwee-Tyr Well, I can dream, can’t I?

    Because any such offer requires something in return, and the UK rejected the things the EU needed, such as guarantees we wouldn’t undermine the ‘level playing field’, or commitments to agreed dispute resolution mechanisms, that sort of thing. If we’d been less hard line, we’d probably not be in quite such a buggers muddle now.
    Nick_G likes this.
  18. Sue Pertwee-Tyr

    Sue Pertwee-Tyr Well, I can dream, can’t I?

    I guess it depends what you mean by the ‘levelling up concept’, and what plans you would suggest are implemented to achieve it. And don’t underestimate the disruptive effect of bringing in new member states whose economies are not as mature as the established members. Rapid change is more likely to introduce stress and instability. The EU has always preferred to play a longer game.
  19. Stunsworth

    Stunsworth pfm Member

    Do many from Hong Kong have much experience of potato picking or warehouse work, or the food industry?
    stephen bennett likes this.
  20. Colin Barron

    Colin Barron pfm Member

    Then we have Italy who are on a cliff edge making a positive contribution of 6.7 billion Euro; well not really it is ECB loans going round in a circle.
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