What's the truth about the LP12?
- Thread starter Monkey
- Start date
I only apologised for adding an unnecessary lingo as it transpired. I didnt know the radikal made it redundant. The lp12 now has so many kludges ... sorry I mean upgrades ... that I get lost in all of this scam.
You own an lp12 right?I bet you wouldn't recognise a proper scientist if one bit you on the nose
Real scientists tend to do the basic research to get things straight so as to avoid publishing factually inaccurate and misleading assertions. At least the ones who are any good do.
I'm afraid that I regard the motives of anyone who misleads folks in this way as being so questionable as to totally invalidate their arguments.
Regarding prices I'd say pretty much any new turntable of this kind of ilk is ridiculously priced these days to most normal people. Doesn't matter whether it's an LP12, SME, Townshend, Michell, Brinkmann, TNT .... By definition we are not normal as we are all enthusiasts
No-one is misleading anyone I was just unaware the radikal meant the lingo was no longer required. I just looked at the price and totted up the options. My mistake has been noted and corrected and I am suitably shame faced in this regard. However, it makes a small difference to the top spec linn cost that does not affect any of my arguments. No need to be pedantic
People are prepared to pay that much and at that level relative performance means the lp12 is very over priced and an archaic design
People are prepared to pay that much and at that level relative performance means the lp12 is very over priced and an archaic design
htm_1968
pfm Member
Another gem of a post! The point of all my recent jibes was that your ability to measure is not to be relied on. Price is a very poor measure as it measures cost with no reference to benefit. Price is a one-dimensional metric that is easily misinterpreted or abused.
For example, we have had 20 odd years of service from the LP12, and with some small outlay on service will get 20 more years. It has seen 2 sets of upgrades and I suspect has cost something in the region of £8000 or £400 per year (in real terms) and ignoring the cost of cartridges. If I were to sell it (which I won't) I'll get £6-7K for it and more if we split it up. So net historical costs are in the region of £2000 over 20 years or a bit less than (£2 per week). Add to that the Linn fact that Linn continue to service, support and upgrade the LP12 means that the net value of the deck is unlikely to slide much.
We have owned various other T/Ts over the journey (Thorens, Rega, Mitchell and Roksan inter alia) but the keeper was the LP12. Our choices and/or values do not invalidate the choices of others, With a single exception, I simply wouldn't be rude/abrasive enough to post in a "What's the truth about about the [insert name of deck]" thread unless (i) I had owned the deck for a lengthy period of time and (ii) I knew what I was on about. The exception is if I were tyring to be spectacularly funny, something managed by many of he posts on this thread......not this one though.
Its nothing to do with any ability to measure it is just a slight ignorance regarding the latest lp12 upgrade. Something I don't pay great attention to. You and Neil are clutching at straws.
What about a turntable that costs the same sounds better and doesn't require constant fettling and nurturing and tweaking and upgrading? Isn't that better still?
If I was to sell my deck now I would likely get more than I paid for it and with no service costs whatsoever over ten years.
My point is that for the same outlay you can get vastly better sound and build quality with less BS. Or you can get the same sound for much less money than an lp12. Take your pick.
What about a turntable that costs the same sounds better and doesn't require constant fettling and nurturing and tweaking and upgrading? Isn't that better still?
If I was to sell my deck now I would likely get more than I paid for it and with no service costs whatsoever over ten years.
My point is that for the same outlay you can get vastly better sound and build quality with less BS. Or you can get the same sound for much less money than an lp12. Take your pick.
No-one is misleading anyone I was just unaware the radikal meant the lingo was no longer required. I just looked at the price and totted up the options. My mistake has been noted and corrected and I am suitably shame faced in this regard. However, it makes a small difference to the top spec linn cost that does not affect any of my arguments. No need to be pedantic
People are prepared to pay that much and at that level relative performance means the lp12 is very over priced and an archaic design
Intriguing, a whole extra para appears in the quote that doesn't show on the IPad when viewing the thread.
I'd argue that if you are looking at value you need to be comparing the min spec decks where there are varying spec versions. You certainly shouldn't be looking at anniversary limited edition costs.
John
Rack’em Up!
Just to reinforce the real prices that were mentioned upstream.
htm_1968
pfm Member
Its nothing to do with any ability to measure it is just a slight ignorance regarding the latest lp12 upgrade. Something I don't pay great attention to. You and Neil are clutching at straws.
What about a turntable that costs the same sounds better and doesn't require constant fettling and nurturing and tweaking and upgrading? Isn't that better still?
If I was to sell my deck now I would likely get more than I paid for it and with no service costs whatsoever over ten years.
My point is that for the same outlay you can get vastly better sound and build quality with less BS. Or you can get the same sound for much less money than an lp12. Take your pick.
OK. No well set up LP12 requires constant fettling nurturing, tweaking and/or upgrading. This is a myth, possibly exacerbated by the sheer quantity of 30/40 year old poorly maintained decks available on eBay.
How do you quantify "better sound quality"? How can you talk about "better build quality" if you don't know what the current specifications (i.e. those in the last 3-5 years) are on an LP12.
Beltingly funny stuff this...........
John
Rack’em Up!
They claim if you add enough phases it will work with anything
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Jek, how could you have even tried a Mana support with your turntable, it's too wide to even fit?
It's nice to find out that Jek, who has been slagging off Mana users for years, based on his attempt to use his non-suspended deck on phase two. I know where to file that information.
I had a suspended deck before and it was that deck I bough the mana for. Lets not jump to conclusions
One very minor mistake.
You forgot the machined from solid option which I included
Sorry for my confusion but from what you previously said I was led to believe you were using your non suspended deck when drawing conclusions about the Mana support.