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Oh Britain, what have you done (part ∞+16)?

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gavreid said:
What I see there is perhaps a slight movement between leave and don't know. You're supposed to be proving that we can be 'reasonably confident' - I'm unconvinced.
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So lets stop messing around with polls. This is too important. It is nearly 3 years since people voted for something so theoretical that any lie seemed plausible. There is now at least a vague understanding of Brexit and if we are not allowed a vote on it this will fester.
 
droodzilla said:
I see enough of a trend in the polling to suggest a small Remain lead on a straight Remain-Leave question. But the political situation is extremely volatile now and I certainly wouldn't bet my house on a Remain victory in a second referendum. It's sobering to recall the final polls before the original referendum showed a Remain lead of anything from 1% to 10%. And yet...

This isn't a reason not to try a second referendum, of course. But it does suggest that people expecting an easy Remain win might be excessively optimistic.
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Quite, and anything less than 60 / 40 would leave the losing side saying "we wuz robbed" , just as now.
 
I don't think we can argue with this...

"emily m‏Verified account @maitlis
Before Xmas I was told by one senior cabinet minister that Mays plan was to keep delaying vote until there was no option left but her deal. Nothing I’ve seen since has made me think she’s come even an inch off course.The trips to Brussels /chats with labour are window dressing 1/
The only thing May’s watching is the calendar. When I asked if that could mean a vote right up to last week of March there was a hollow laugh and no denial. She is happy to indulge the “fantasies” of others. But don’t be fooled into thinking anyone is changing her mind.. 2/2"

And why wouldn't she carry on doing it when she can see nobody is stopping her? Once she was found in contempt and nothing happened, then delayed the meaningful vote and nothing happened, then suffered the biggest Government defeat ever and nothing happened, she must realise she's pretty much immune.
 
wacko said:
So lets stop messing around with polls. This is too important. It is nearly 3 years since people voted for something so theoretical that any lie seemed plausible. There is now at least a vague understanding of Brexit and if we are not allowed a vote on it this will fester.
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I'll just magic one up. It isn't going to happen - at the moment at least...
 
wacko said:
Sadly you are right. Just wishful thinking. When did a UK politician last do 'the right thing'. Probably Robin Cook in 2003.
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True. The reason the polls are 'interesting' is to try to understand what Corbyn is doing, other than that he's this or that kind of four letter word. He'll have access to detailed polling information and regular updates - what we are seeing is the limit of our kind of parliamentary 'democracy'. I suspect that we haven't seen the last from Bercow if May tries to run out the clock from here.
 
^^ Bercow is quite ebullient atm. I imagine he can be threatened with some sort of sexual offences investigation if he gets too uppity.
A Brit friend of mine retired to France is totally stressed out. Real lives are being destroyed by this vote. No Brexiteer could explain a single problem derived from EU membership.
 
Crack negotiating team? Or drunks in a bar?

Olly Robbins talks loudly in a bar. Is heard.

"We now know her chief negotiator – who works directly for her – appears to be expecting a delay. A delay which she has always said was an option that was not on the table."
“The issue is whether Brussels is clear on the terms of extension,” he was overheard saying. “In the end they will probably just give us an extension.” https://www.itv.com/news/2019-02-12...rns-mps-the-choice-is-mays-deal-or-extension/
 
BBC 6pm news not a mention of Brexit or May's non statement. Acting on Government orders perchance? This is one reason we don't have people on the streets.
 
slavedata said:
BBC 6pm news not a mention of Brexit or May's non statement. Acting on Government orders perchance? This is one reason we don't have people on the streets.
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TBH it was all a non-event. PM said nothing new, leader of the opposition complained a bit but didn't really oppose. The clown car is still heading towards the cliff - both party leaders happy.
 
notaclue said:
And why wouldn't she carry on doing it when she can see nobody is stopping her? Once she was found in contempt and nothing happened, then delayed the meaningful vote and nothing happened, then suffered the biggest Government defeat ever and nothing happened, she must realise she's pretty much immune.
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Yes, this is the most bewildering part. She realised at some stage that she could do absolutely anything and there would be no consequences. Maybe Windrush? That's when she discovered she could literally kill people and the worst she'd have to endure would be a few negative headlines and the loss of a cabinet ally, who in any case was back within 6 months and nobody batting an eyelid.

I know everyone will say, Well where's the opposition! It's the opposition's job to oppose! But the fact is that the opposition has done what it could with the tools immediately available to it - parliament itself, and electoral support: it's prevented the Tories from implementing most of its awful manifesto, and it's forced the government to at least make some leftish gestures. It can't do much more without the support of the media, it needs them to help them apply the pressure, and I think that's what's missing here.

Why aren't the Sensible establishment papers - Guardian, FT - calling for her resignation, relentlessly? Why aren't they demanding that Soubry and co back up their bluster? Why aren't their headlines, every day, "May Runs Down Clock to Appease Party of Psychos"? Where is the constant pressure?

I've said it before, but it's got to be Stockholm syndrome. They know this is an existential crisis for the Tories and they cannot imagine life without them.
 
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