How would you vote in a General Election?

[Brian]

Getting behind Remain and a second referendum might revive Labour’s prospects in Scotland but I’m doubtful- particularly when it comes to the crunch and Leonard comes back saying ‘well I tried my best but Len, Jeremy and Suemas said no, it’s a GE or nothing’. Voters here also remember Dave telling us the only way to stay in the EU was to reject the SNP and Independence. It earned the Tories 13 Westminster seats but you can only pull that deception once. On Brexit I trust neither Westminster dinosaur nor do more and more in my country. Both of them are playing it purely for party political gain.

What Labour wants is to avoid a no deal brexit by the removal of the tories from govt, if that is not possible, Labour wants a second referendum on whatever deal the tories come up with. A Labour govt will stop a hard brexit. If it is correct that remain would be the majority in a second referendum, this will also stop a tory hard brexit, however there is a risk leave may be the majority again.

The most sure way of stopping a tory hard brexit is a Labour govt.

This is easy to understand. It is the intelligent way of dealing with the mess created by the tories and offers the best prospect for a majority of people in the UK.

 

[SteveG]

What Labour wants is to avoid a no deal brexit by the removal of the tories from govt

What Corbyn wants is Brexit at pretty much any cost, hence the removal from any form of support for anything that allows for Remain as an option. Labour are a leave party just as much as the Tories, UKIP and Brexit. They differ slightly on the form of that Brexit, but not much else. They also differ in a very major way though in that their support for Brexit is out of line with the majority of people that voted for them. If you voted Tory or UKIP then you knew you were voting for a Brexit party. It'll have come as a surprise for many Labour voters to find that they were actually voting in favour of a key Tory policy.

 

[Seanm]

What Corbyn wants is Brexit at pretty much any cost, hence the removal from any form of support for anything that allows for Remain as an option. Labour are a leave party just as much as the Tories, UKIP and Brexit. They differ slightly on the form of that Brexit, but not much else. They also differ in a very major way though in that their support for Brexit is out of line with the majority of people that voted for them. If you voted Tory or UKIP then you knew you were voting for a Brexit party. It'll have come as a surprise for many Labour voters to find that they were actually voting in favour of a key Tory policy.

Reckless, populist fantasy.

 

[maxflinn]

If you voted Tory or UKIP then you knew you were voting for a Brexit party. It'll have come as a surprise for many Labour voters to find that they were actually voting in favour of a key Tory policy.

Labour's 2017 election manifesto was very clear; it respected the result of the Brexit referendum and sought to leave the EU in a manner that best protected jobs, workers rights etc.

Why would Labour voters have been surprised about this after voting Labour?

 

[Sue Pertwee-Tyr]

I think it's fair to say that Labour is a victim of the Tory line that 80% of people voted for a pro-Brexit party at the last GE - it is a Tory line, after all, but the problem is that Labour can't refute or counter it, because at the time of campaigning for the GE, the Labour position was to honour the outcome of the Referendum.

 

[Stunsworth]

Labour's 2017 election manifesto was very clear; it respected the result of the Brexit referendum and sought to leave the EU in a manner that best protected jobs, workers rights etc.

Why would Labour voters have been surprised about this after voting Labour?

Maybe that’s why their support has plummeted. What happens when a party is out of step with its supporters?

 

[jackbarron]

Reckless, populist fantasy.

Where has Corbyn said (a) he supports a second referendum any deal (b) it will include a Remain option and (c) doesn't involve voting Labour into power first?

Please feel free to quote him.

Jack

 

[Tony L]

Labour's 2017 election manifesto was very clear; it respected the result of the Brexit referendum and sought to leave the EU in a manner that best protected jobs, workers rights etc.

The manifesto was clear, and is part of the reason Labour are in such a mess and crashing in the polls, but even that fudge isn’t being implemented by Corbyn. At every possible opportunity he evades, stalls and refuses to be drawn on the question of a second referendum or even making the argument that any form of Brexit will inevitably bring huge economic hardship and instability. Much to my surprise and disappointment Corbyn is yet another slippery and evasive Labour chancer in the mould of Blair. A man of many faces and little integrity.

 

[Vinniemac]

Labour's 2017 election manifesto was very clear; it respected the result of the Brexit referendum and sought to leave the EU in a manner that best protected jobs, workers rights etc.

Why would Labour voters have been surprised about this after voting Labour?

Someone said that Labour’s “jobs first Brexit” was the equivalent to a “buildings first earthquake”. Labour wants us out of the single market, so it’s supporting a hard Brexit. The difference between them and the Tories on this is negligible.

 

[Brian]

What Corbyn wants is Brexit at pretty much any cost, hence the removal from any form of support for anything that allows for Remain as an option. Labour are a leave party just as much as the Tories, UKIP and Brexit. They differ slightly on the form of that Brexit, but not much else. They also differ in a very major way though in that their support for Brexit is out of line with the majority of people that voted for them. If you voted Tory or UKIP then you knew you were voting for a Brexit party. It'll have come as a surprise for many Labour voters to find that they were actually voting in favour of a key Tory policy.

Corbyn understands the importance of democracy so he realises it is essential to honour the majority outcome in a referendum. You don’t appreciate or understand either of those things.

 

[Tim Jones]

The manifesto was clear, and is part of the reason Labour are in such a mess and crashing in the polls, but even that fudge isn’t being implemented by Corbyn. At every possible opportunity he evades, stalls and refuses to be drawn on the question of a second referendum or even making the argument that any form of Brexit will inevitably bring huge economic hardship and instability. Much to my surprise and disappointment Corbyn is yet another slippery and evasive Labour chancer in the mould of Blair. A man of many faces and little integrity.

Blair got more things done for the poor and dispossessed than (I'll bet) Corbyn will ever get done.

 

[russel]

Blair got more things done for the poor and dispossessed than (I'll bet) Corbyn will ever get done.

If you remove the ones he blew up and made poor in Iraq from the equation, there was also the huge opportunity cost in treasure of having a war as well as the blood.

 

[SteveS1]

Corbyn understands the importance of democracy so he realises it is essential to honour the majority outcome in a referendum. You don’t appreciate or understand either of those things.

Corbyn sees an opportunity to leave the EU with the Tories blamed. Nothing deeper than that, his interest in democracy is already being tested with a Labour conference mandate that he is desperate to avoid. Trouble is, it will cost him a large slice of membership and votes. He won’t win an election without their support and no amount of crying “Tory enablers” will change that. It’s a big enough task without pissing off the majority of your members/support.

 

[Tony L]

Blair got more things done for the poor and dispossessed than (I'll bet) Corbyn will ever get done.

The sheer idiocy of Iraq and of siding with a highly dodgy Republican POTUS was his downfall for sure, and rightfully so. That aside Blair was unquestionably the most successful and effective PM of my political lifetime (I’m too young to remember much about Wilson). That is a pretty low bar for sure, and there was much to criticise away from Iraq (PFI, the creeping authoritarianism of Blunket, Straw, the rank corruption and expenses-trough-feeding etc), but still a far better legacy than Thatcher, Major, Callaghan, Heath etc. Judging by the ten shysters and buffoons shortlisted today there is unlikely to be any competition anytime soon.

 

[Tim Jones]

If you remove the ones he blew up and made poor in Iraq from the equation, there was also the huge opportunity cost in treasure of having a war as well as the blood.

Feel better?

 

[ff1d1l]

Corbyn understands the importance of democracy so he realises it is essential to honour the majority outcome in a referendum. You don’t appreciate or understand either of those things.

In the same way the tory gammon hark back to a mythical perfect time somewhere between the nineteen-fifties and Moggs seventeen-fifties, corbyn is of the opinion that perfect democracy only occurred on the 23rd June 2016, all manifestations since being simalcrums and to be spurned.

 

[russel]

Feel better?

Merely pointing out that I would expect an intelligent person to look at the negatives as well as the positives and an unnecessary war with lots of dead, lots of homeless people that cost an awful lot of money is quite a big negative, YMMV of course.

 

[Brian]

Where has Corbyn said (a) he supports a second referendum any deal (b) it will include a Remain option and (c) doesn't involve voting Labour into power first?

Please feel free to quote him.

Jack

a) I guess you mean ‘on any deal’. If so, Labour has said it supports a second referendum on the deal the tories come up with if Labour can’t get a General Election. That’s clear.

b) The govt gets to set the question in a referendum. Labour can’t ‘include remain as an option’. That’s clear.

c) Is this a serious question? Labour has made it clear they want a GE. That’s clear.

What is it you’re finding so difficult to understand?

It is not a lack of clarity from Labour, it’s that you don’t support Labour policies. Just accept it and stick with whatever waste of time you’re into right now before your next change of mind.

Carry on enabling the tories, Jack. Just don’t complain about brexit and any of their policies when the penny drops.

 

[Guest432]

Corbyn understands the importance of democracy so he realises it is essential to honour the majority outcome in a referendum. You don’t appreciate or understand either of those things.

Sometimes a govt has to make a decision that goes against the majority or that people don't like, especially when anyone with an ounce of sense is saying that Brexit will be a disaster for the economy and jobs.

The original referendum was a stupid grasp by Cameron but I'm unclear as to why a majority of turkeys voting for thanksgiving means it has to happen.

If Corbyn had an ounce of sense he would be saying this but he wants Brexit so is staying quiet in the hope this chaos results in a GE that he wrongly thinks labour would win.

 

[ff1d1l]

Sometimes a govt has to make a decision that goes against the majority or that people don't like, especially when anyone with an ounce of sense is saying that Brexit will be a disaster for the economy and jobs.

The original referendum was a stupid grasp by Cameron but I'm unclear as to why a majority of turkeys voting for thanksgiving means it has to happen.

If Corbyn had an ounce of sense he would be saying this but he wants Brexit so is staying quiet in the hope this chaos results in a GE that he wrongly thinks labour would win.

Nail, head.