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General Election 2024

gavreid said:

How the Tories pushed universities to the brink of disaster​

[Let's remind ourselves that it was Labour who reneged on the universal principle of the "progressive introduction of free education" and the LDs who capitulated]

Over the past 14 years, the Conservative dream of a free market in higher education has collided with the harsh reality of austerity and the cultural resentment of the radical right – driving some institutions close to bankruptcy

www.theguardian.com

How the Tories pushed universities to the brink of disaster

The long read: Over the past 14 years, the Conservative dream of a free market in higher education has collided with the harsh reality of austerity and the cultural resentment of the radical right – driving some institutions close to bankruptcy
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
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It'll be worth reading this backgound for context rather than blindly buying into yet more hard left, agenda driven bitter Labour bashing.

Labour supposedly reneging is a typical tory type of misrepresentation. Serious people look at the big picture. The state of education in 1998 rests squarely with the tories after 19 years of mismanagement, just as it is now after 14 years of tory mismanagement. You have to start somewhere to sort out the trashing of everything by the tories and sometimes the world isn't perfect.
 
Brian said:
It'll be worth reading this backgound for context rather than blindly buying into yet more hard left, agenda driven bitter Labour bashing.

Labour supposedly reneging is a typical tory type of misrepresentation. Serious people look at the big picture. The state of education in 1998 rests squarely with the tories after 19 years of mismanagement, just as it is now after 14 years of tory mismanagement. You have to start somewhere to sort out the trashing of everything by the tories and sometimes the world isn't perfect.
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Give over - the UK is fully signed up to the various United Nations declarations on Education and Higher Education.

I debated Bill Rammell the HE Minister in public back in 2008. He told me afterwards that these responsibilities are covered by the Foreign Office and so are divorced from the Education remit completely!
 
Tony L said:
The case has been made. Labour ignored it. As such Labour will be losing some seats they could have won. FWIW I’m in one, and I will not be voting to save Labour here even though I detest the independent. I’m throwing my vote on Green. I’ll get nothing for it beyond being counted on the national total and knowing my hands are clean.
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My post was about making the case to voters.
 
gavreid said:
Give over - the UK is fully signed up to the various United Nations declarations on Education and Higher Education.

I debated Bill Rammell the HE Minister in public back in 2008. He told me afterwards that these responsibilities are covered by the Foreign Office and so are divorced from the Education remit completely!
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You need to give over. The hard left Labour bashing is as tiresome to sensible people as the Labour right attacks on Corbyn.
 
Barrymagrec said:
A second Reform candidate jumps ship:-

“I am in no doubt that the party and its senior leadership are not racist. However, as the vast majority of candidates are indeed racist, misogynistic, and bigoted, I do not wish to be directly associated with people who hold such views that are so vastly opposing to my own and what I stand for.”

www.standard.co.uk

London Reform candidate defects claiming party is 'racist and bigoted'

Georgie David, standing in West Ham and Beckton, said she was suspending her general election campaign in the east London seat
www.standard.co.uk www.standard.co.uk

She joins a racist party and is surprised that the members are racist, perhaps not the sharpest knife in the drawer.
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I see the "dark forces" excuse has been rolled out again.
 
Brian said:
You need to give over. The hard left Labour bashing is as tiresome to sensible people as the Labour right attacks on Corbyn.
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Since when is it "hard left" to support the principle of Free Education enshrined in the UN treaties? Is the SNP "hard left"? It's a central component of Human Rights generally - or have you given up on that too in the name of Project Starman?
 
Kirk said:
My post was about making the case to voters.
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I think it has been made. Look how Labour’s voteshare has increasingly dropped over recent weeks in all the polls. Look at Starmer’s -11% approval rating. Obviously everyone wants shut of a vile corrupt venal and incompetent Tory government given the catastrophic damage they have caused, but there is no enthusiasm or optimism towards Starmer’s Labour. This is an entirely negative election. The political right are still selling fascism as it is all they have left after failing on every single economic or social metric. Labour are selling absolutely nothing and winning by default. Gaza isn’t a decider as there is nothing between Labour and Tory here, both are in the pocket of Netanyahu. All voters can do is vote for minor parties or independents, and they are in quite large numbers.
 
Tony L said:
I think it has been made. Look how Labour’s voteshare has increasingly dropped over recent weeks in all the polls. Look at Starmer’s -11% approval rating. Obviously everyone wants shut of a vile corrupt venal and incompetent Tory government given the catastrophic damage they have caused, but there is no enthusiasm or optimism towards Starmer’s Labour. This is an entirely negative election. The political right are still selling fascism as it is all they have left after failing on every single economic or social metric. Labour are selling absolutely nothing and winning by default. Gaza isn’t a decider as there is nothing between Labour and Tory here, both are in the pocket of Netanyahu. All voters can do is vote for minor parties or independents, and they are in quite large numbers.
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Yep, to say Gaza’s having no impact on the electoral landscape really is bizarre, given that it’s already created one independent MP and might well create others - remarkable at a time when most people’s overriding priority is to get rid of the Tories. Labour really shouldn’t be losing any MPs over this or to their left more generally. A sign of things to come if they don’t change tack.
 
Tony L said:
I think it has been made. Look how Labour’s voteshare has increasingly dropped over recent weeks in all the polls. Look at Starmer’s -11% approval rating. Obviously everyone wants shut of a vile corrupt venal and incompetent Tory government, but there is no enthusiasm or optimism towards Starmer’s Labour. This is an entirely negative election. The political right are still selling fascism as it is all they have left after failing on every single economic or social metric. Labour are selling absolutely nothing and winning by default.
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Apparently not, judging by voter interests - a failure by the left to communicate and convince (a long-term problem). The left really need to start making a positive (and credible) case for change to the voters instead of just bashing every living (and dead) human being in Britain who doesn't agree with them.

I'm not sure you're first and second sentences are as closely related as they appear - and it's natural/commonplace for the polls to narrow as an election gets closer. I'm surprised it hasn't happened sooner and I am surprised Labour is still so far ahead. Starmer's electoral approval ratings are higher than Corbyn's btw. And yes, the Tories are bad, so vote Labour.
 
gavreid said:
Since when is it "hard left" to support the principle of Free Education enshrined in the UN treaties? Is the SNP "hard left"? It's a central component of Human Rights generally - or have you given up on that too in the name of Project Starman?
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Project Starman...How daft.

Hard left - I'm referring to the constant flow of anti Labour bitterness from hard left types.

SNP - The SNP isn't even left wing let alone hard left. Nowt like being hood-winked. They are as neoliberal as the other mainstream parties. There is no left wing party anymore. We need one but nobody want to create one because it won't get elected. That's reality in 2024. It will be a decades long crawl back to a centre left place, imo.

Fees - Student fees/loans shouldn't exist, I blame the tories and LibDems for it.

General education - Should be free at all levels but fewer should go to university. The trouble began when tory beancounters decided numbers going to uni could be used in political point scoring as showing better education. It shows nothing of the sort. What we actually need and always needed is greater emphasis on apprenticeships, trades, quality training paid for and provided by employers as well as university education provided free by the state. Until the private sector pays its way with proper training relevant to what they need from employees, general education won't improve, imo.
 
Crazy stuff here: not sure if this is Starmer's voice or Preston's but someone, I guess both of them, is drawing exactly the wrong lesson from the (always inevitable) implosion of Macronism:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1807747201373729107

"Starmer agreed. He told me that trust in [mainstream] politics is broken. So if he and Labour take power at the end of this week, he says his over-riding priority is “to address the everyday concerns of so many who feel disaffected by politics”. There is the challenge. If he governs only for party loyalists and activists, especially at a time when all the polls show he may be respected by voters but certainly not loved or even especially trusted, any victory he achieves may be pyrrhic."

Like, "party loyalists and activists", the few that still exist, want more public spending, better working conditions, more democracy. Is that what did for Macron, do we think? Or was it binning all that off in favour of corporate interests and high handed authoritarianism?
 
Tony L said:
I think it has been made. Look how Labour’s voteshare has increasingly dropped over recent weeks in all the polls. Look at Starmer’s -11% approval rating.
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I reckon a lot of "average" voters look for "charisma" these days, not a quality Starmer has in spades.
 

Owen Jones visits the crazy world of Norfolk. It shows, quite disturbingly, how much traction Farage’s vile racist Trump-fascism is gaining with the inbred Tory types. Predictably the only person talking sense is from Liverpool.
 
Tony L said:
I think it has been made. Look how Labour’s voteshare has increasingly dropped over recent weeks in all the polls. Look at Starmer’s -11% approval rating. Obviously everyone wants shut of a vile corrupt venal and incompetent Tory government given the catastrophic damage they have caused, but there is no enthusiasm or optimism towards Starmer’s Labour. This is an entirely negative election. The political right are still selling fascism as it is all they have left after failing on every single economic or social metric. Labour are selling absolutely nothing and winning by default. Gaza isn’t a decider as there is nothing between Labour and Tory here, both are in the pocket of Netanyahu. All voters can do is vote for minor parties or independents, and they are in quite large numbers.
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Any drop off in popularity for Starmer is more likely due to how much he's been on tv in recent weeks rather than the Labour party position of calling for a both sides ceasefire in Gaza. Starmer comes across very poorly, imo, even worse than Corbyn a lot of the time.

Labour can't do anything about what is happening in Gaza, only the US can influence Israel in any way at all. I believe here in the UK a majority probably feel this way so have other issues on their mind ahead of the GE on Thursday.
 
Tony L said:
The case has been made. Labour ignored it. As such Labour will be losing some seats they could have won. FWIW I’m in one, and I will not be voting to save Labour here even though I detest the independent. I’m throwing my vote on Green. I’ll get nothing for it beyond being counted on the national total and knowing my hands are clean.
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But it will make a difference, only a fag paper maybe, but hey, what”s good for the goose…..?
 
Just been for a long walk around my area in the Macclesfield constituency. It has returned a Tory at every election since 1918.
I have yet to see a Tory poster anywhere whereas the place is plastered with Labour ones.
Perhaps the prediction of it turning Labour will prove correct after all on Thursday.
 
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