Winter election III

[ks.234]

Corbyn stands for a much needed change of direction in our politics. That’s it. I understand many people don’t want that change, but I’m puzzled by those that want change but have this antipathy to the man and anyone who supports him, much of it unfounded and even if it’s not, feelings about Corbyn the man are not important.

We’ve had 10 years of austerity and we’re staring down both barrels of a gun that will herald a Brexit disaster and the further dismantling of our public services. Corbyn is the only politician with the integrity to do all he can to bring about change to that prospect.

Calling him and his supporters names is unfounded and in any case only likely to increase the chances of yet more Johnson with a main course of Brexit and privatised public services

If you don’t want change, vote Johnson. If you do, you’ve only got one choice. And probably only this one last chance. Don’t do the Daily Mail’s work for them.

 

[Woodface]

Corbyn stands for a much needed change of direction in our politics. That’s it. I understand many people don’t want that change, but I’m puzzled by those that want change but have this antipathy to the man and anyone who supports him, much of it unfounded and even if it’s not, feelings about Corbyn the man are not important.

We’ve had 10 years of austerity and we’re staring down both barrels of a gun that will herald a Brexit disaster and the further dismantling of our public services. Corbyn is the only politician with the integrity to do all he can to bring about change to that prospect.

Calling him and his supporters names is unfounded and in any case only likely to increase the chances of yet more Johnson with a main course of Brexit and privatised public services

If you don’t want change, vote Johnson. If you do, you’ve only got one choice. And probably only this one last chance. Don’t do the Daily Mail’s work for them.

That is beneath you, I don't have to like him. He is an ineffectual Leader. I am still voting Labour but I reserve the right to have a proper moan about him.

 

[Minio]

I've not heard anyone say that Johnson or Swinson are that great leaders.

So Im not sure why Corbyn is singled out.

 

[maxflinn]

The BBC is biased against the left. Don’t take my word for it, just take a moment to watch this superb video from
@alexnunns and@EL4JC- and then give it a retweet.

Rachel Swindon - Twitter

 

[Woodface]

I've not heard anyone say that Johnson or Swinson are that great leaders.

So Im not sure why Corbyn is singled out.

I personally don't care about the LDs or Cons but, by definition, Corbyn is not being singled out as I've yet to hear anyone say that BJ or Swinson are great.

 

[Stunsworth]

I've not heard anyone say that Johnson or Swinson are that great leaders.

So Im not sure why Corbyn is singled out.

Swinson isn’t the leader of a party that could potentially form a government.

I fear this election is going to be 1983 all over again. I’d love to be proved wrong, but I’m not optimistic.

 

[Minio]

It seems that Remainers and Brexiteers alike pick on the ambiguity of Labour's approach to Brexit as being a lack of leadership.

Some see it as a sensible enough policy, maybe a bit convoluted, but not a leadership issue as such.

As for AS, although despicable, I imagine the average voter is more likely to be concerned about him doing his top shirt button up.

 

[sean99]

I feel like Rimmer from Red Dwarf - There are probably infinite fatmarleys out there in parallel universes and I'm the worst one

Better than being the cat !

 

[Tony L]

I fear this election is going to be 1983 all over again. I’d love to be proved wrong, but I’m not optimistic.

Its far, far worse than that IMHO. Thatcher’s government were moderates compared to the ERG take-over of the party. This shower are far worse than John Major’s “bastards” too; a GUI based on Enoch Powell, the Daily Express and UKIP, and a back-end of dark-money asset-stripping and tax fraud.

 

[ff1d1l]

This is the problem Labour have. They think of those who don't have Momentum in their blood as ignorant/thick/racist.
Those people are the voters.

No, I wouldn't agree with that, but there is plenty of evidence supporting the brexit voter base as being gullible, racist, and not too bright. Voting against something so patently not in your interests unless your conned or brainwashed supports that analysis, hmmm?....tories, however, are motivated by naked self interest. Apart from working class tories who occupy Venn diagram circles alarmingly close to the brexit voter.
Unsurprisingly.

 

[Mullardman]

I personally don't care about the LDs or Cons but, by definition, Corbyn is not being singled out as I've yet to hear anyone say that BJ or Swinson are great.

Seriously? All of the lies about Corbyn?

 

[Woodface]

Seriously? All of the lies about Corbyn?

It is what happens, I don't keep score. As the opposition they have to engage, to win the arguments, this is nothing new.

Corbyn is a relatively easy target

 

[Dave H.]

It is what happens, I don't keep score. As the opposition they have to engage, to win the arguments, this is nothing new.

Corbyn is a relatively easy target

I disagree. The sheer level and quantity of outright lying from the Tories is unprecedented in U.K. politics.

Manipulation, twisting the truth, unfortunately we’re used to that sort of thing. But now we’re subject to a deluge of bare faced, total fabrications. That’s new. There’s a good piece on it here - https://mainlymacro.blogspot.com/2019/11/will-uk-voters-really-vote-for.html?m=1

The lies are about virtually everything, and that includes Corbyn (Marxist, racist, terrorist etc). Corbyn isn’t a Marxist, for example, that’s just simply wrong. Whereas BJ genuinely and demonstrably is a liar, comes out with racist and classist language and so on. Just because you think it’s somehow balanced doesn’t mean it is - ‘not great’ is not the same as ‘borderline communist catastrophic and existential threat’. But there’s a bigger picture to the lying than just smearing party leaders.

 

[stevec67]

Swinson isn’t the leader of a party that could potentially form a government.

I fear this election is going to be 1983 all over again. I’d love to be proved wrong, but I’m not optimistic.

I don't think it will be quite that bad, but I think we'll end up with a small Con majority, enough to sweep through Brexit, then the shower can start with what they really want, cutting costs, taxing the poor, and best of all a 2 tier health system. They won't sell off the nhs, no absolutely not, they'll just offer an alternative to those who want to pay for something better. Just like they do for education.

 

[Seanm]

I disagree. The sheer level and quantity of outright lying from the Tories is unprecedented in U.K. politics.

Manipulation, twisting the truth, unfortunately we’re used to that sort of thing. But now we’re subject to a deluge of bare faced, total fabrications. That’s new. There’s a good piece on it here - https://mainlymacro.blogspot.com/2019/11/will-uk-voters-really-vote-for.html?m=1

The lies are about virtually everything, and that includes Corbyn (Marxist, racist, terrorist etc). Corbyn isn’t a Marxist, for example, that’s just simply wrong. Whereas BJ genuinely and demonstrably is a liar, comes out with racist and classist language and so on. Just because you think it’s somehow balanced doesn’t mean it is - ‘not great’ is not the same as ‘borderline communist catastrophic and existential threat’. But there’s a bigger picture to the lying than just smearing party leaders.

Yep, I think there has been a step change in terms of attacks and lack of scrutiny. Telegraph and The Times are acting straightforwardly as Jonhson’s mouthpieces: it’s not enough any more to talk about coordination, CCHQ are basically writing the headlines and the articles. The BBC’s compliance is heroic. Peston, ITV’s chief political correspondent, is writing hit pieces in The Spectator.

Why wouldn’t the Tories just straight up lie about everything? They’ve learned they can do so with impunity. They’re getting more scrutiny from Google than they are from highly paid professionals whose whole reason to exist is to hold power to account.

Important to recognise though that this isn’t a break with Thatcherism but an extension of its basic logic into the media: it’s about destroying social bonds, destroying relations of trust. It’s another way of telling us that we’re on our own and that we should trust no-one because everyone is trying to shaft us.

 

[ks.234]

Andrew Marr is useless. He’s just allowed Johnson free reign to blather for the entire interview without answering a single question.

What is Marr paid his very substantial salary for if it’s not to ask questions and get answers?

 

[Rockmeister]

They're all at it...who dug up the Boris quotes about the characteristics of certain social types recently?You can't tell me that the left are not as active in digging and flinging shit as the right are? It's very easy to prove. Those with most to gain attract the most shit. Note that neither the press, not social media (and anyone who believes what is written there is more gullible that a gull with extra gully pieces) have wasted any time dumping poo onto the leaders of the Lib/Green party, because there are not enough votes there to worry anyone. If there were, I have £1000 that says that some would be found who once 'knew' Jo S and she said, in 1992 that the black guy living opposite was smelly!!!!!!!
It's only done because the majority believe it all. Sad that it all gets debated here more than the things that actually matter...the details of policy change.

 

[cooky1257]

I thought Marr exposes the twat rather well.

 

[cooky1257]

They're all at it...who dug up the Boris quotes about the characteristics of certain social types recently?You can't tell me that the left are not as active in digging and flinging shit as the right are? It's very easy to prove. Those with most to gain attract the most shit. Note that neither the press, not social media (and anyone who believes what is written there is more gullible that a gull with extra gully pieces) have wasted any time dumping poo onto the leaders of the Lib/Green party, because there are not enough votes there to worry anyone. If there were, I have £1000 that says that some would be found who once 'knew' Jo S and she said, in 1992 that the black guy living opposite was smelly!!!!!!!
It's only done because the majority believe it all. Sad that it all gets debated here more than the things that actually matter...the details of policy change.

Johnson’s vile comments are a matter of record not idle gossip.

 

[Tony L]

Andrew Marr is useless. He’s just allowed Johnson free reign to blather for the entire interview without answering a single question.

What is Marr paid his very substantial salary for if it’s not to ask questions and get answers?

I’m about 20 minutes behind on iPlayer, but to my mind the Bullingdon oaf is coming across as the absolute arsehole he so clearly is. He is the very embodiment of arrogance and entitlement and looks remarkably ugly in content, behaviour and body-language. Lying, blustering and deflecting at every step, and with that smug elitist mindset on show that only highlights he thinks he can get away with it. If the UK public fall for this charlatan class-warrior the country genuinely deserves to fail.