Muslim women are not allowed to wear Burka at the shore in France

[ariegur]

....

p.s. before i forget yet again, i want to note how touched i am by arie's concern for the rights of oppressed muslims.

You don't see my problem with this issue: I see in the streets of Haifa and in the beach many Muslim women with Burka, which is OK, I don't see in the beach young French girls with topless.

Arye

 

[russel]

Last time I checked France was not a tropical country. You need a certain amount of sun on your skin to synthethize vitamin D.

Brittany has enough sun to make me need to cover up and use lots of suncream.

 

[gintonic]

it became offensive as soon as the cognitive capacity for language acquisition evolved and we sublimated sexual urges into various aspects of civilization.


vuk.

It is not in the slightest bit offensive. Being nude and seeing nude is natural.

 

[wacko]

Cultures, by definition, are different from each other.
Seeing brown skin as 'low class' and using rip-off 'whitening' creams is historic brain-washing.
Many people who cover up too much all the time have Vitamin D deficiency.

 

[gassor]

It is not in the slightest bit offensive. Being nude and seeing nude is natural.

I don't want to see your dangly bits and I'm sure you don't want to see mine. With very few exceptions everyone looks better with their clothes on.

 

[Cloth-Ears]

Are there many bees, down at the beach ?

 

[Seeker_UK]

'boo' bees?

 

[DonQuixote99]

I don't want to see your dangly bits and I'm sure you don't want to see mine. With very few exceptions everyone looks better with their clothes on.

Those are opinions.

Almost everyone everywhere wants some stuff covered up at least sometimes, but opinions vary a lot as to just what and when. Despite the variance, people feel strongly about it, and think any decent person ought to see it their way.

In the France case, we've got competing group identities and some upsetting violence complicating the whole thing.

Gassor, imagine if the government said you had to let your dangly bits hang out, if you wanted to enjoy the beach. That's essentially similar to the position some Muslim women are being placed in, from their point of view.

Burkinis should be fine, and persons who don't like it enough to harass people should be arrested and given a lesson in who their enemies are, and are not. Women who aren't bothering anyone fall into the 'are not' category.

 

[gassor]

Gassor, imagine if the government said you had to let your dangly bits hang out, if you wanted to enjoy the beach. That's essentially similar to the position some Muslim women are being placed in, from their point of view.

Burkinis should be fine, and persons who don't like it enough to harass people should be arrested and given a lesson in who their enemies are, and are not. Women who aren't bothering anyone fall into the 'are not' category.

I'm with you on this, as I said before on here no-one would mind if a group of nuns kept all their clothes on while at a beach. I think people should respect the religious feelings of others in a tolerant society. It doesn't seem like a lot to do.

 

[Mullardman]

I don't want to see your dangly bits and I'm sure you don't want to see mine. With very few exceptions everyone looks better with their clothes on.

B0££0ck$

 

[Mullardman]

Being naked is offensive especially in a zone with mixed people including kids.

Arye

This idea is largely irrelevant to the debate about Burkinis.

It is also just plain wrong to describe nudity as offensive. It is a very subjective and culturally dependent issue.

 

[gintonic]

I don't want to see your dangly bits and I'm sure you don't want to see mine. With very few exceptions everyone looks better with their clothes on.

It is not about 'want to see', it is about not being offended if one were to see, personally I don't care one way or another. Once on a long walk in Northern Spain, my wide and I came upon a beautiful beach for our picnic. The umbrella renting booth quickly told us it was a nudist beach........ we wanted to stay for lunch as it was a lovely spot, so we whipped off our clothes, sat in the shade had our lunch and then carried on with our walk. There were other naked people on the beach of all genders and ages. I don't care one way or another about nudity or the nudity of others...... it certainly isn't offensive or repulsive in my book.

With regard to a Burkini what is the difference between a swimming in a Burkini and a wetsuit with dive hood....... would one get arrested for sitting on the beach in a wetsuit with dive hood

 

[gintonic]

Those are opinions.

Almost everyone everywhere wants some stuff covered up at least sometimes, but opinions vary a lot as to just what and when. Despite the variance, people feel strongly about it, and think any decent person ought to see it their way.

In the France case, we've got competing group identities and some upsetting violence complicating the whole thing.

Gassor, imagine if the government said you had to let your dangly bits hang out, if you wanted to enjoy the beach. That's essentially similar to the position some Muslim women are being placed in, from their point of view.

Burkinis should be fine, and persons who don't like it enough to harass people should be arrested and given a lesson in who their enemies are, and are not. Women who aren't bothering anyone fall into the 'are not' category.

Good post..... live and let live

 

[gassor]

I don't care one way or another about nudity or the nudity of others...... it certainly isn't offensive or repulsive in my book.

My dangly bit is the last thing I want sun-burned.

 

[Steven Toy]

Article 2

The Union is founded on the values of respect for human dignity, freedom, democracy, equality, the rule of law and respect for human rights, including the rights of persons belonging to minorities. These values are common to the Member States in a society in which pluralism, non-discrimination, tolerance, justice, solidarity and equality between women and men prevail.

http://www.lisbon-treaty.org/wcm/th...ts/title-1-common-provisions/2-article-2.html

A Treaty breach is a serious matter and warrants the suspension of France's EU voting rights.

 

[gintonic]

Article 2

The Union is founded on the values of respect for human dignity, freedom, democracy, equality, the rule of law and respect for human rights, including the rights of persons belonging to minorities. These values are common to the Member States in a society in which pluralism, non-discrimination, tolerance, justice, solidarity and equality between women and men prevail.

http://www.lisbon-treaty.org/wcm/th...ts/title-1-common-provisions/2-article-2.html

A Treaty breach is a serious matter and warrants the suspension of France's EU voting rights.

Excellent, a forced Frexit, rather than a self-imposed Brexit

 

[Steven Toy]

Excellent, a forced Frexit, rather than a self-imposed Brexit

No, just a temporary suspension of voting rights until the ban is lifted.

This should be effective.

It could also bring about a self-imposed Frexit if it generates more support for the Front National, already running at ~30%.

 

[wacko]

It is not about 'want to see', it is about not being offended if one were to see, personally I don't care one way or another....
With regard to a Burkini what is the difference between a swimming in a Burkini and a wetsuit with dive hood....... would one get arrested for sitting on the beach in a wetsuit with dive hood

The difference is the burkini is seen as a overt religious statement. But also if thousands of, say, nuns went to the beach and stared it might well make others uncomfortable.
Playing Devils Advocate some might also mention that Western women cannot dress as they would in Europe in many Islamic countries.
I guess it is a question of whether multiculturalism has failed where sections of society do not want to assimilate into their new country.

 

[John]

The difference is the burkini is seen as a overt religious statement. But also if thousands of, say, nuns went to the beach and stared it might well make others uncomfortable.
Playing Devils Advocate some might also mention that Western women cannot dress as they would in Europe in many Islamic countries.
I guess it is a question of whether multiculturalism has failed where sections of society do not want to assimilate into their new country.

I would think as majorities begin to happen in various coastal cities in France and control of local government changes, laws similar to many Islamic countries could be passed affecting what women could wear on their local beaches. The existing Burqini ban appears to be a local law AFAICT.

 

[davidsrsb]

Playing Devils Advocate some might also mention that Western women cannot dress as they would in Europe in many Islamic countries

Russian women wear bikinis in Malaysia. There are some alarming sights

I guess it is a question of whether multiculturalism has failed where sections of society do not want to assimilate into their new country.

Assimilation to invisibility is monoculturalism. I think you will find that many of these French Muslim women have been there for several generations