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Pre/power vs Integrated

With separate pre/power, I can have source components at one end of the room, a 10m cable from pre to power, with power amp and speakers at the other end of the room. Maybe it's just me, but I like the source components close to the listening position, not close to the speakers.
 
Regardless of brand or type (tube or SS) I have learned that personally my head says Integrated but my heart says Pre/Power combo.
Not that I can hear a difference necessarily but I am a shallow fellow.
That is why the new 33/303 is sooo tempting.
And can be bridged to!
 
SteveG said:
Interesting. Most of my current integrated amps (other than my Oto) are considerably more powerful than my pre-power combination was.
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It’s my unsubstantiated opinion based on A/B amps and me thinking higher power means bigger power supplies and more internal noise.
 
Hario.ca said:
It’s my unsubstantiated opinion based on A/B amps and me thinking higher power means bigger power supplies and more internal noise.
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My most powerful amp by a fair margin is a Krell integrated of which it says: "All circuitry up to the driver stage is pure class A" whatever that means. It doesn't seem to suffer from being an integrated.
 
Hario.ca said:
It’s my unsubstantiated opinion based on A/B amps and me thinking higher power means bigger power supplies and more internal noise.
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Higher power generally means more gain stages and possibly higher circuit complexity.
Neither of which are considered to be good for clarity and transparency.
Thats why low power valve or transistor amps can sound so good into efficient speakers.
 
Jazzer said:
Higher power generally means more gain stages and possibly higher circuit complexity.
Neither of which are considered to be good for clarity and transparency.
Thats why low power valve or transistor amps can sound so good into efficient speakers.
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My Audionote Oto sounds great into the Triangle speakers I bought to go with it (which are not super efficient at 90 dB/W/M) and despite only having a few watts can go plenty loud. Just a shame it blows up so regularly - and why it's currently up the loft until I decide to send it back to Audionote again.
 
SteveG said:
My Audionote Oto sounds great into the Triangle speakers I bought to go with it (which are not super efficient at 90 dB/W/M) and despite only having a few watts can go plenty loud. Just a shame it blows up so regularly - and why it's currently up the loft until I decide to send it back to Audionote again.
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Ouch…that must be very frustrating. What keeps failing?
 
SteveG said:
I'm not really sure to be honest - I can't recall if Audionote said went back to them the last time. I'll be sure to ask the next time though!
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It’s a good idea to ask.
i would have thought a valve amplifier should be very reliable.
 
Jazzer said:
It’s a good idea to ask.
i would have thought a valve amplifier should be very reliable.
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I have had it for quite a while (15 years maybe?) and I think it's been repaired 3 or 4 times so far. Given that most of my other kit at the time was from Naim (and other than a CD3.5 that's failed recently everything I've had from them has been reliable) it's perhaps just a comparative thing. It's definitely failed more often than any other amp I've owned though.
 
SteveG said:
I have had it for quite a while (15 years maybe?) and I think it's been repaired 3 or 4 times so far. Given that most of my other kit at the time was from Naim (and other than a CD3.5 that's failed recently everything I've had from them has been reliable) it's perhaps just a comparative thing. It's definitely failed more often than any other amp I've owned though.
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That’s a shame.
Audionote have a reputation for good sound, although I have never heard one.
 
As has been said, there's no one definitive answer. It all comes down to the electronics in question. E.g. I have an old Musical Fidelity Pre/Power combination (I have two different pairs actually, but I'm talking about the cheaper of the two), that both my old Krell integrated and now my Hegel integrated just blow in to the weeds. Of course both the integrateds were circa £4.5k when they were new and the pre/power combination cost me about £1k back in the day.

I have come to the conclusion that irrespective which way you end up going, there is a definite benefit to having a "dual mono" architecture to both the preamp and power amp stages. By which I mean physical separation (preferably on either side of the case and a good 10" between them) of each channel from input to output stage (IMO separated transformers for each channel isn't necessary). I've found it makes a noticeable difference in the reproduction of stereo width and depth.
 
Even if my speakers weren’t active there are certain features that are usually quite hard to come by on integrateds but rather trivial to add to a pre. Namely an adjustable high pass for the mains. And then also a decent headphone output is usually an after thought.

Very happy with my SPL Phonitor X which does great as a pre as well as with HP duties. I did have to add an active analog crossover to split the signal for the subs but the benefits far outway any cons one might perceive(none to my ears).
 
A few reasons to have separate amplifier boxes:
  1. You like boxes, and have rack space that need filling
  2. You don't mind cable-dressing, and maybe secretly enjoy keeping the front and back equally tidy
  3. Your speaker cables are bloody expensive and you'd like to keep them as short as possible by locating the power amp(s) close to speakers
  4. You like to mix and match e.g. combining valve/tube allure and solid-state muscle in equal measure
  5. You think separates equates to a more grown-up audiophilia and earns you more respect
  6. You have money to burn
  7. You find it easier to hide upgrades from the wife with certain brands and their visually identical boxes
  8. You believe separate boxes or monoaural construction sounds better than a one box solution
  9. There isn't an integrated that has all the features you want
  10. You have actively filtered loudspeakers and therefore need more than one stereo amplifier.
Reason to have an integrated amp:
  1. None of the above applies to you.
 
Very difficult to choose. I have had many integrated and they have giving me much enjoyment and easy to place in the living room without all the cables and boxes. Right now I have many boxes. Phono stage, mono amps,pre and dac/streamer. It looks great and plays with power and actually easy to use. But always tempted to try new things no matter how good my system is.
 
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