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Oh Britain, what have you done (part ∞+22)?

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maxflinn said:
How do the Tories not either win a majority, or gain the biggest vote share and are thus tasked with forming a coalition, if, as you expect the Lib Dems and Greens do very well at Labour's expense?
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The Tories might well end up with the biggest vote share but the only parties they've any chance of doing a coalition with are Brexit and the DUP and I don't think that'll be enough. Labour on the other hand could be in a position to form a government with support from the SNP, LibDem and others (who are likely to have a lot more seats - the SNP alone might have 50 or so). Labour will have to pay a price for that though - e.g. support for a 2nd referendum with Remain on the card, and hopefully a change to a leader who isn't hell-bent on Brexit at any cost.
 
Swamp Thing said:
Tish. These media type.

I expect Boris bathes in the stuff. Referencing Hydna and Scylls of Scione, or Cleopatra. Although I shudder to think were he might get asses milk...
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Boris claimed a white powder which may or may not have been cocaine, didn’t enter his system because he sneezed it out. It appears someone may have accessed the urn containing the ashes of Margaret Hilda.
 
puddlesplasher said:
Our politics seems to have become more Right wing and and Left wing and neither making any sense.
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It hasn't made sense, if it ever did, since Labour were blamed and seemed to accept the blame for the 2008 world-wide financial crisis.
Just imagine if the current or previous Tory government had been charged with sorting that out at that time.
 
ks.234 said:
I think that’s being unfair Jack. Gardiner was saying that it’s all very well being in favour of a second referendum but only the government has the authority to set one up. Therefore Labour would need to win a GE first in order to get the authority to set up a referendum.
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That's fair enough. I personally wouldn't trust Corbyn or the current Shadow Cabinet to set up a referendum if they got into power though.

Jack
 
SteveG said:
Nonsense. It misses out the most likely option i.e. that neither Tory/Brexit or Labour get an outright majority and the SNP/LibDem and others (with maybe getting towards 100 seats) will force Labour to hold a 2nd referendum with Remain being one of the options. So voting for SNP, LibDem or Green in seats where they can win is going to be by far the best option for those who still see remaining in the EU as the safest option. Voting for Labour in seats where they could win and the remain parties couldn't may make tactical sense however - as long as it's not giving Labour an outright majority which would of course be a disaster.
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Not as great a disaster as enabling a tory government.
 
puddlesplasher said:
Our politics seems to have become more Right wing and and Left wing and neither making any sense.
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To me it feels like politics has just become more right wing with the left not fully recovering from its Blairite neoliberal dalliance. The current Labour administration is still very much a centrist party with policies that are quite happily right wing. The media likes to present Corbyn as some sort of Marxist Trot in a ushanka — but in fact he’s just another slightly left neoliberal opportunist lightweight.
 
Hey, we're now on a post-Brexit roll! Now we are free to import everything from South Korea, including their cars and ships.

Do they need any weapons?

PYH2019061005340031500_P4.jpg
 
ks.234 said:
But the article is pre referendum. I know the miracle of 20/20 hindsight is common amongst many a pfmer on here, but I for one have learned much about Brexit that I didn’t know in 2016. It’s possible that St Corbs has too?
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You mean changing the opinion he reportedly held for at least 41 years (that’s counting from when he voted to leave in 1975) in the last three? I suppose anything is possible...
 
Having just resigned from the Labour Party. Come the GE the only way to get the Tories out is to vote Labour, irritating as that will be it is what I will do.
 
Marchbanks said:
Who knows for certain? Tariq Ali thinks he does.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...eader-says-long-time-ally-tariq-a7032736.html
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Here is a Tariq Ali quote from The Independent article, which came out on 16 May 2016:

"Jeremy Corbyn is “completely opposed to the EU” and would be campaigning for a vote to leave if he was not leading the Labour Party, one of his oldest political allies has claimed."

One time International Marxist Tariq Ali was 100% right.

Corbyn has turned out to be as much of a con artist as Theresa May, Cameron, Boris Johnson and the rest of them.

Corbyn did hardly any campaigning for Remain prior the Referendum and is an out-and-out Brexiteer.

This is why he still won't agree to a second referendum on any deal, which would include a Remain choice.

Tariq Ali voted to Leave. I saw him do a Q/A session after a documentary about left-wing politics in the Sixties and Seventies a few years ago. He was great.

As it says in Wiki "He has been described as "the alleged inspiration" for the Rolling Stones' song "Street Fighting Man", recorded in 1968. John Lennon's "Power to the People" was inspired by an interview Lennon gave to Ali."

Jack
 
Marchbanks said:
You mean changing the opinion he reportedly held for at least 41 years (that’s counting from when he voted to leave in 1975) in the last three? I suppose anything is possible...
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The key clause in Ali's argument is "if he were not the leader". Some might prefer to just put accidental things like that to one side in order to concentrate on what really matters which is what is in Corbyn's heart, but both Corbyn and Ali are more interested in how things actually work and what can actually be done. The idea that Corbyn is prepared to jeopardise his shot at ending austerity and transforming both this country and its foreign policy (WRT to things he really cares about, such as the Middle East) in order to push a personal agenda on a single issue, in the teeth not just of the PLP (fine) but the membership and support base, is IMO fanciful. Even if he were unequivocal in his belief that UK would be better off out of the EU he's just not a single issue crank, or an autocrat.
 
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