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MDAC First Listen (part 00011111)

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Bigbobby666 said:
Yup, makes sense! I guess my judgements are based on 'end product' as I have little (very very very little) understanding of the make up / process of the inner workings. However I also produce products (in a very different landscape) and generally I like to understand the strengths and weaknesses of my last project so that they can be improved in any subsequent product in the same field/application. It's these general musings I'm curious about.

Tho I guess you have to be careful about describing the qualities of something that is not real yet, which is what your saying Chris :D

BTW great sounding DAC the MDAC have been enjoying playing around with it for the past week, it's just made me curious to know what are the sonic differences that you guys are aiming for?
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Bob,

just a quick post to say that I'm not ignoring you, I've got my head down designing the MDAC2 clock circuit... once I've perfected it :) I'll reply to your SQ question :)

Glad your happy with the MDAC - for an improved sound stage I suggest trying V0.90 software (and let the unit run-in for a day or two)... :)
 
JohnW said:
Bob,

just a quick post to say that I'm not ignoring you, I've got my head down designing the MDAC2 clock circuit... once I've perfected it :)
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John
What clock/oscillator are you planning to use for the MDAC2? I will of course understand if you feel that this information is commercially sensitive.
 
JohnW said:
Bob,

just a quick post to say that I'm not ignoring you, I've got my head down designing the MDAC2 clock circuit... once I've perfected it :) I'll reply to your SQ question :)

Glad your happy with the MDAC - for an improved sound stage I suggest trying V0.90 software (and let the unit run-in for a day or two)... :)
Click to expand...

No problem John, much better to have you working than answering my ambiguous questions!!! ;)

I have Software Revision vA.10 on the MDAC i have - is it worth flashing it with V0.90?
 
Bigbobby666 said:
No problem John, much better to have you working than answering my ambiguous questions!!! ;)

I have Software Revision vA.10 on the MDAC i have - is it worth flashing it with V0.90?
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If everything was black and white we would all drink Guinness..

Until you try you will never know.

A.10 has better 'featureware' - screen dimming. left channel bug fix, input naming.

0.90 has better/different SQ.

In my opinion.
 
This is a quick subjective impression of my Fusion M-DAC that I have just received back from John W after being at the tail end of the queue.

However, why might anyone be interested in my preliminary assessment of this upgrade given it is no longer available and I am no reviewer?

My purpose is simply to report what I can, so as to illustrate what John W has managed to do with this update of the analogue stages, as it may give some insight as to the direction the MDAC2 will be taking in terms of sound quality.

While my MDAC has been on its holiday, I have been using a PS Audio DL III DAC. Today having some free time, I have now spent a while listening to quite a lot of different music, after allowing the Fusion to warm up for a day.

The difference is not subtle. The Fusion sounds better than the PS Audio to me and better than my recollection of the original MDAC.

I am wary of using too many clichés but I think the Fusion shines in two main areas in my system (see end of post for description): transparency and coherence.

Transparency is evident in listening to some close mic-ed recordings of Beethoven Violin sonatas (Kreutzer) where the recording now sounds ‘clean’ but full of string attack rather than harsh. This is also noticeable on things like the vocal on ‘Sweet Jane’ by the Cowboy Junkies where a touch of sibilance has been replaced by clear, if conspicuous pronunciation of the “s”s. Ella Fitzgerald on the 50s Verve recordings also now has wonderfully clear consonants as well as the period recording sound balance.

Coherence is evident in things like the Christopher Hogwood ‘small forces’ recording of Handel’s Messiah from a few years back – the echo and decay of the voices of the boy treble singers in a chapel is reproduced in a way that sounds much more realistic than before. The improvement is evident in the low level details and the way piano notes decay as well (Barry Douglas, Pictures at an Exhibition, for example).

And things I have listened to over many years on a range of systems since they were first released – Neil Young’s After the Goldrush, for example – are better recorded than I recall.

The detail and dynamics in a good recording/performance like the SCO/Ticciati Symphonie Fantastique is worth a listen.

OK – so I haven’t done an A/B comparison with an un-modded MDAC, although I may do in the future. I haven’t organized a blind comparison. This note is subjective and lacks an immediate comparator. It is reasonable to assume that I would want the Fusion to sound better given the money spent and the time waited, so you might reasonably doubt my detachment.

But to my 58 year old ears in my moderate system (Sonos, bitperfect tested, playing FLAC files into Fusion 0.90 SW (OTXD filter) through optical; controlling volume using the MDAC; balanced output into Krell AV 400xi with preamp bypassed and driving a nice old pair of Sonus Faber Electa Amator II speakers in a small listening room) the sound is beguiling.

My view is that John W is finding notable ways to improve playback from a DAC that work for me in my system. This promises well for the MDAC2, though I am happy with the Fusion to be honest.

When I got the Fusion back, I had planned to do all sorts of comparisons to prove to myself that the difference was worthwhile. I may do that at some point hence but at the moment it just seems a waste of time as the improvement seems so noticeable. As it is, I am convinced that the difference is not small and it works for the kind of music I like in the kind if system I have. So - to me it is worth the money and worth the wait.

Thanks to John W for his handiwork and his applied knowledge.

Tony R
PS it makes the Radio 3 HD stream sound better too, both in the studio and in the musical pieces…
 
jamjar784 said:
John would be best to advise the entire MDAC story - maybe there's a book in there? There have been issues with locking on some dodgey inputs which other DACs seem to handle (some firmware versions available address this), the left channel Sabre bug (ESS to blame), change in SQ with different firmware, slight loss of SQ at low volume (>40dB) when driving into high gain amps. Attenuators seem to affect SQ so this was found not to be the ideal solution (to be resolved by 'gain structure' feature in MDAC2). ......

These issues have arisen in a minority of cases and it is worth stating that the original MDAC didn't win a multitude of awards for nothing: it was a truly excellent product at a very good price.....
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Thanks Jamjar; that seems to me a very good summary as I remember things, and I have been following this monster thread from very early on.

I have a query about the locking issue, which I think came up quite a long time back so I don't remember details. I have now had my MDAC for nearly two and a half years, and I remember smugly thinking "My DAC doesn't do that" when the locking issue first surfaced.

Pride before a fall. I am now getting locking drop-outs fairly often, but strangely, only from one computer! I have been trying to compare the effect of modifications to two Mac Minis, a 2010 and a 2012. They have each had the same treatment, but only the 2012 has the locking problem regularly, and only on the USB input. Using USB connection to a Musical Fidelity V-Link connected to an Optical input I have yet to have a problem from either computer. I can cure it by switching the DAC off and on, and then I can be ok for several hours, but it's annoying, to say the least.

I have stubbornly remained with V0.90 after some early tries with later ones, which to my ears had definitely inferior SQ. I think the earlier locking issues were mainly with this version, but my memory doesn't stretch that far.
Any reminders, comments, or even solutions would be very welcome!
 
ajr37 said:
why might anyone be interested in my preliminary assessment of this upgrade given it is no longer available and I am no reviewer?

My purpose is simply to report what I can, so as to illustrate what John W has managed to do with this update of the analogue stages, as it may give some insight as to the direction the MDAC2 will be taking in terms of sound quality.
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Very useful, and exactly what i have been wondering about!

Thanks Tony!

Rob.
 
Bigbobby666 said:
Very useful, and exactly what i have been wondering about!

Thanks Tony!

Rob.
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Hopefully there will be some 'bind' evaluations done between the Std, Toy and Fusion versions before final individual decisions have to be made?

It's not in anybodies interest for decisions to have to be made on pure conjecture.
 
John
PS Audio have brought out an interesting new DAC that converts everything into DSD. If you follow this link you can then click on a video of a presentation by the designer Ted Smith ( who clearly plays in a ZZ Top tribute band on his days off) which I am guessing you will find interesting. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts after you have watched it. Is it bull or have they broken new ground ?
Ian

http://www.psaudio.com/directstream-dac/
 
Ian,

A "DAC" that converts PCM to DSD is nothing more then 1Bit DAC converter - Philips "Bitstream" DACs back in the early 90's operated at x128 or x192 so faster then DSD x64 modulator rates.

In this case PS Audio is confusing the use of "DSD" - DSD advantage is when the 1Bit Modulator output from the ADC is replayed via a 1 Bit DAC without any Digital filtering or remodulation - this is not the case with PS Audio and a PCM stream - its nothing more then a 1Bit Modulator.... Its not a bad thing, Dacapo was a 1 Bit DAC, its just not something new or unique...

PS Audio is trying to ride on the wave of the current DSD Fad....
 
ajr37 said:
This is a quick subjective impression of my Fusion M-DAC that I have just received back from John W after being at the tail end of the queue.
[snip]
When I got the Fusion back, I had planned to do all sorts of comparisons to prove to myself that the difference was worthwhile. I may do that at some point hence but at the moment it just seems a waste of time as the improvement seems so noticeable. As it is, I am convinced that the difference is not small and it works for the kind of music I like in the kind if system I have. So - to me it is worth the money and worth the wait.

Thanks to John W for his handiwork and his applied knowledge.
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I can only echo this sentiment, although in my case I settled on the Toy L2 variant on mine. It's difficult to imagine anything it can do better than it already does, so I could live happily ever after with TL2 if MDAC2 didn't materialise (which it will of course). I haven't posted my thoughts yet - work, family commitments etc. have conspired against this - but this pretty much sums up my thoughts too :)

john
 
Received my mine back from John a few days ago, but only just now had a proper opportunity to listen today.

I don't know if it's an L2 Toy or some other version (whats the difference between an L2 and non L2?), but I can say I'm thoroughly enjoying myself today :D

I started with Radioparadise, intending to do other things, but once a few familiar songs were played, my attention was caught and I started to listen properly.

Now about 4 hours later I thought i'd better take a break and have some food & catch up on here
 
Hey, I paid two installments 100 pounds each, how do I complete the payments and why M I not written on the monthly installments pledges?
 
dadab12 said:
Hey, I paid two installments 100 pounds each, how do I complete the payments and why M I not written on the monthly installments pledges?
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I asked the same earlier dabdab. That list isn't up to date. The list is internal now. If you received an email from Renata who's managing the subscribers on Lakewests side, that is the confirmation that you need.

Rob.
 
dadab12 said:
Hey, I paid two installments 100 pounds each, how do I complete the payments and why M I not written on the monthly installments pledges?
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dadab12,

I confirmed with Renata that your on our internal list - recently we crossed referenced every incoming PayPal payment with our own internal list so we can be doubly certain that everyone who has sent funds via PayPal is the upgrade list.

Oddly there are 3 or 4 people who sent the first installment but not the second... We received no response to our Emails so I guess they dropped out from the project, they are also not active PFM users...
 
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