ks.234
Half way to Infinity
That is not a fix. It is a lie More deflection. Starmer is a supporter of neoliberalism, Starmer is a supporter of genocide, you are a supporter of Starmer. Own it, instead of deflecting all the timeFIFY
Labour Leader: Keir Starmer VII
- Thread starter Seeker_UK
- Start date
- Status
Sue Pertwee-Tyr
Accuphase all the way down
And while this country struggles with so many problems, and Ukraine and Gaza suffer terribly against militarily superior forces, the House of Commons now spends its time arguing semantics about an arcane rulebook rather than doing something useful or decisive.
Spraggons Den
pfm Member
To put Starmer in the same ball park as Pinochet is just ridiculous and needs calling out.
Let's be clear: Starmer has never been in government, hasnt commanded the apparatus of the state and hence has not been in a position to harm his fellow countrymen; in contrast Pinochet was responsible for (from wiki):
"From 1973 to 1990, Chilean armed forces, the police and all those aligned with the military junta were involved in institutionalizing fear and terror in Chile. the number of direct victims of human rights violations in Chile accounts for around 30,000 people: 27,255 tortured and 2,279 executed. In addition, some 200,000 people suffered exile and an unknown number went through clandestine centers and illegal torture .......included gruesome acts of physical and sexual abuse, as well as psychological damage. "
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
More deflection
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
Poor Hoyle. He asserts in the face of no confidence statements that he was only trying to keep MPs safe after being shown material apparently sent to Lab MPs. This is becoming something of a thing.
In Glasgow, same time line, Paul Sweeney the unseated Lab MP, former soldier, now MSP, called the police after publicly claiming his constituency office “had been attacked by Gaza protesters and his staff were inside terrified”. The police arrived anticipating violent disorder. This is an actual picture of the event-
q
This kind of cynical game playing would be distasteful at the best of times but against the back drop of Gaza, these clowns playing it for sympathy and manufactured outrage is pretty disgusting. They’ll be attracting likes from Allison Pearson, Ben Habib and Tice and his mistress.
In Glasgow, same time line, Paul Sweeney the unseated Lab MP, former soldier, now MSP, called the police after publicly claiming his constituency office “had been attacked by Gaza protesters and his staff were inside terrified”. The police arrived anticipating violent disorder. This is an actual picture of the event-
This kind of cynical game playing would be distasteful at the best of times but against the back drop of Gaza, these clowns playing it for sympathy and manufactured outrage is pretty disgusting. They’ll be attracting likes from Allison Pearson, Ben Habib and Tice and his mistress.
I don’t really engage on these threads anymore. A quick up page confirms my decision but who was that self- righteous SNP tosser giving it large in Parliament yesterday? I only caught a bit of it on the Today programme & it just summed up everything that is wrong with Parliament.
It’s just a game to these public school types, such larks while people are suffering at the hands of their policies.
They should all be working out of a serviced office & be far more humble in their actions.
It’s just a game to these public school types, such larks while people are suffering at the hands of their policies.
They should all be working out of a serviced office & be far more humble in their actions.
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
Looks like 50 letters of no confidence in Hoyle have gone in, with political hacks widely saying his “I was protecting the safety of MPs” didn’t pass the smell test with anyone.
Somafunk
pfm Member
Your post highlights an ignorance of parliamentary procedure with regard to opposition motions, the SNP party have 3 motions per parliamentary year, the Labour Party have 17.
Last edited:
Spraggons Den
pfm Member
KS,
You have been writing and reading and believing your own bullshit for too long me auld son.
I know you mean well and you are a valued contributor here but your fights of fancy and hysteria, such as this one i.e. Starmer is like Pinochet, do you no favours.
Have a word with yourself.
ATB
Spraggs
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
Ad hom. The first refuge of those with no integrity who are unable to articulate a reasoned argument
gez
pfm Member
Yeabut.. don't you realise that the whole world is "touchy feely" now and the only thing that matters is a persons feelings. If they felt threatened you're not allowed to do anything but say "it's a disgrace they were made to feel uncomfortable, threatened etc". It matters not one jot the reality of the situation or if there was any malice or intent involved, only how the "victim" feels. It's enough to get people sacked quite easily these days, especially if the person complaining happens to a specific set of minorities.Poor Hoyle. He asserts in the face of no confidence statements that he was only trying to keep MPs safe after being shown material apparently sent to Lab MPs. This is becoming something of a thing.
In Glasgow, same time line, Paul Sweeney the unseated Lab MP, former soldier, now MSP, called the police after publicly claiming his constituency office “had been attacked by Gaza protesters and his staff were inside terrified”. The police arrived anticipating violent disorder. This is an actual picture of the event-
q
This kind of cynical game playing would be distasteful at the best of times but against the back drop of Gaza, these clowns playing it for sympathy and manufactured outrage is pretty disgusting. They’ll be attracting likes from Allison Pearson, Ben Habib and Tice and his mistress.
Ironically, it's the left that have created that victim culture.
For the record, I see nothing wrong with what the protesters were doing and the response of the MP was clearly a massive overreaction, but part of me does kind of feel "you made your bed, now you have to lie in it" about the situation.
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
“Those briefed on the meeting said the Labour leader warned Hoyle that Labour MPs’ security was at risk. Many had been deluged by criticisms, threats and abuse since abstaining on a similar SNP motion in November. With hundreds of protesters congregating outside parliament, they worried worse might be to come”
First the Labour right came for their leader
Then they came for their own members
Now they come for voters
Starmer and what he stands for is profoundly undemocratic and genocide adjacent
How Keir Starmer averted Gaza ceasefire vote crisis
A last-minute intervention proved crucial as Starmer faced the biggest rebellion of his leadership
mentalp
pfm Member
"With hundreds of protesters congregating outside parliament, they worried worse might be to come”
Hundreds of constituents queing in the rain for hours for an opportunity to lobby their MP in person. My wife was stewarding there yesterday and said people were pretty determined to speak to their MP's, after receiving no reply to letters or emails. They came from far and wide. She said there was an elderly lady who had travelled down from Scotland, only to get to the front of the queue as they stopped letting any more people in.
I can imagine they will all be prettty disgusted with the shambles that took place
Hundreds of constituents queing in the rain for hours for an opportunity to lobby their MP in person. My wife was stewarding there yesterday and said people were pretty determined to speak to their MP's, after receiving no reply to letters or emails. They came from far and wide. She said there was an elderly lady who had travelled down from Scotland, only to get to the front of the queue as they stopped letting any more people in.
I can imagine they will all be prettty disgusted with the shambles that took place
I couldn’t care less.
Somafunk
pfm Member
So you dont care when parliamentary procedures are bent to fit an opposing narrative and protect the opposition party from a rebellion?, In that case I guess you also didn’t care when Johnson prorogued parliament back in 2019.
Lets forget about parliament, those who can shout the loudest shall be heard above all others.
Lets forget about parliament, those who can shout the loudest shall be heard above all others.
Tony L
Administrator
The more I look at this the more firmly I believe Lindsay Hoyle should go. I just don’t think he has behaved in anything even approaching an impartial way.
I’d like to see an investigation into why the hell the Speaker of the HOC, a position where impartiality is basically the job description, thought it was acceptable to go to Israel as a guest of the far-right Likud party. That one really needs answering. His father, Labour MP Doug Hoyle, helped found Labour Friends Of Israel. As such I’d argue his tribal position here is pretty clear. Had he acted impartially and with professionalism I’d happily ignore it. He didn’t. His intervention resulted in a hopelessly watered-down Labour bill being passed without vote and the SNP’s bill not getting a look in. This got both Labour and the Tories off the moral hook and diluted this country’s position on a potential genocide and ethnic cleansing. Not acceptable.
He needs to go right now IMO. His position is untenable.
PS I’ll post this again as citation for my position. How is this impartial? This visit took place in November, long after Oct 7th and while Israel were in the process of erasing huge parts of Gaza. What was he doing there? Who was he representing? He shouldn’t be there in peacetime, let alone at this time. He is the Speaker. His job is to keep order in the HoC without any bias or agenda. This is totally inappropriate behaviour:
I’d like to see an investigation into why the hell the Speaker of the HOC, a position where impartiality is basically the job description, thought it was acceptable to go to Israel as a guest of the far-right Likud party. That one really needs answering. His father, Labour MP Doug Hoyle, helped found Labour Friends Of Israel. As such I’d argue his tribal position here is pretty clear. Had he acted impartially and with professionalism I’d happily ignore it. He didn’t. His intervention resulted in a hopelessly watered-down Labour bill being passed without vote and the SNP’s bill not getting a look in. This got both Labour and the Tories off the moral hook and diluted this country’s position on a potential genocide and ethnic cleansing. Not acceptable.
He needs to go right now IMO. His position is untenable.
PS I’ll post this again as citation for my position. How is this impartial? This visit took place in November, long after Oct 7th and while Israel were in the process of erasing huge parts of Gaza. What was he doing there? Who was he representing? He shouldn’t be there in peacetime, let alone at this time. He is the Speaker. His job is to keep order in the HoC without any bias or agenda. This is totally inappropriate behaviour:
ks.234
Half way to Infinity
Agree, but it is the Labour Party behind this disgusting erosion of parliamentary democracy and genocide backing.
Starmer’s Labour Party are no better than Boris Johnson and a lot worse than Thatcher,
Seanm
pfm Member
Media-politics class seems to have arrived at a consensus about yesterday’s events and it turns out to have been the public’s fault. I’m ashamed we made our representatives soil themselves like that. It may be time for our leaders to dissolve the people and elect another.
Just thinking about Johnson’s proroguing fiasco and it strikes me that the main difference - apart from the hacks rending their clothes over that while declaring yesterday’s shenanigans trivial, arcana, not worth bothering about - is that Johnson subverted parliament in the name of The People, while Starmer claims to have done it to protect politicians *from* the people. It’s a sort of managerial populism, an unpopular populism, standing precisely for nothing.
Really feels like we have to be bottoming out here. Surely it can’t get any more stupid and insulting than this.
Just thinking about Johnson’s proroguing fiasco and it strikes me that the main difference - apart from the hacks rending their clothes over that while declaring yesterday’s shenanigans trivial, arcana, not worth bothering about - is that Johnson subverted parliament in the name of The People, while Starmer claims to have done it to protect politicians *from* the people. It’s a sort of managerial populism, an unpopular populism, standing precisely for nothing.
Really feels like we have to be bottoming out here. Surely it can’t get any more stupid and insulting than this.
Somafunk
pfm Member
When he submitted the Labour motion on Tuesday he mentioned “outdated protocols“ as to why he allowed it to be brought forward, no mention at all of possible violence against labour members.
So two versions of his story, what to believe?.
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
Westminster is heading in the direction of the State Duma. Hoyle & Friends, Admiral Mordaunt and Sunak will want the likes of your wife and the elderly woman from Scotland in the back of a Met minibus. The mischaracterisaction of these peaceful demonstrations started with “they dont respect British values” going to blatant accusations of organised violence when they couldn’t stop them.
The more disturbing feature is that the leader of the Labour Party is showing himself to be every bit as zealous an authoritarian as his colleagues on the Tory benches.
- Status