You don't do trains do you? Especially trains in the north of England. The cross Pennine service is a complete antiquated joke. Manchester to London is actually quite fast (2 hours) but the trains are packed, at peak time it's standing room only and the existing track has no more capacity. Leeds to London is less well served speed wise and the trains are not as good as the West coast line, but the biggest problem is again capacity. HS2 was never the right answer, but extra capacity is definitely needed.
HS2 - levelling up... LOL
- Thread starter tiggers
- Start date
You don't do trains do you? Especially trains in the north of England. The cross Pennine service is a complete antiquated joke. Manchester to London is actually quite fast (2 hours) but the trains are packed, at peak time it's standing room only and the existing track has no more capacity. Leeds to London is less well served speed wise and the trains are not as good as the West coast line, but the biggest problem is again capacity. HS2 was never the right answer, but extra capacity is definitely needed.
Jamie
pfm Member
Guess what?.....
HS2 West Midlands-Manchester line to be scrapped
Rishi Sunak is to announce the scrapping of HS2 high-speed rail line from West Midlands to Manchester tomorrow, the BBC understands.
www.bbc.co.uk
Space is the Place
pfm Member
"But i thought the train was going to be High Speed Mr Jones?!"
"Don't blame me Mrs Davies, the Primeminster has diverted all the money to the constituents of Tunbridge Wells"
"What have you got to say about it Ivor? I bet your disappointed your not getting that new engine you were promised so you can reach the sunlit uplands eh?"
"Churrrrch Co Churrrch Co...Churrrch"
An so... Mr Davies returned home, she never saw her son in London again, as she died the next day when the aerated concrete roof of the village school collapsed, as the Headmistress of the school she was loved and respected by all. A day after her death OSTED arrived and branded her school Inadequate.
Mr Jones and Ivor went back to their dilapidated shed, at speed not exceeding 20MPH because of the wobbly track and wondered what it would be like to live in Tunbrige Wells.
That night Mr Jones curled up and slept inside Ivors firebox, because since splitting with his wife Carol (after she'd run off with Rhys the Butcher) Mr Jones couldn't afford to buy a house or rent a flat.
That night Mr Jones fell into a deep sleep, he dreamed of the village baker Miss Myfanwy Evans, her Bara brith the juicest in the valleys. As Mr Jones dreamed, Myfanwy was standing, legs akimbo, shoveling coal into Ivor's firebox, Mr Jones had never seen such a lovely sight.
Ivor at full steam, Myfanwy by his side, as they race through the sunlit uplands, flying down the tracks at high speed, a sign whizzed past ....Tunbridge Wells... it said.
THE END
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Ponty
pfm Member
Used to regularly do London - Manchester and London - Birmingham. Fiendishly expensive (to the point I’d often fly instead) but journey times were certainly not an issue. No experience of east - west services but they sound like hell on earth from all accounts.
Bob McC
Living the life of Riley
Morocco has more than we do.
paulfromcamden
Baffled
Nuts isn't it. How can a service that requires burning enough fuel to keep a bloody great aeroplane in the sky be cheaper than pushing a train along some rails?
robs
should know how this works by no
I'm intrigued to know what the BBC front page will be headlining tomorrow at 3pm. HS2? Venice? Paris bedbug panic? VAR? Braverman blah or Boris as the Covid fallguy. I'm guessing the latter...though Paris might well be up there...
Place your bets...
HS2 will be disappeared by Thursday...(not just in the press)!
Place your bets...
HS2 will be disappeared by Thursday...(not just in the press)!
Ponty
pfm Member
It is crazy. This is why I’m wondering who can afford to use HS2 anyway. It’s not going to be exactly cheap.
sean99
pfm Member
Usually when things apparently make no economic sense there will be a bunch of costs borne by the taxpayer that are not accounted for in one mode of transport. I wonder about government subsidies for airport, ATC etc compared to rail.
Nic Robinson
Moderator
Don't forget the aviation fuel.
Ponty
pfm Member
Yes, agreed. Flying is still far, far too cheap. That’s before one considers compensating for the environmental impact.
foxwelljsly
Me too, I ate one sour too.
I love trains, but there is no business case for HS2 and there never has been. It has always been a vanity project for the politicians that initiated it and a big fat cash udder for all the usual culprits.
You will find that a significant number of the population of Liverpool, Manchester, Hull and all the towns and cities in between would very much like to travel on efficient trains. So that's Liverpool, population about half a million or so, Manchester, another 3M, Bradford, 250k or so, Leeds, 1M, Wakefield, Hull, that's a few million people in the infamous Northern Powerhouse, all of whom travel about and large numbers of whom would travel on trains if they existed and weren't totally bloody useless.
paulfromcamden
Baffled
Quite.
Aviation reportedly receives £7 billion per year in subsidies in the UK. This is one of the most harmful sectors to our climate, yet Great Britain is subsidizing it as if it’s saving dolphins and whales. In fact, whereas countries like the USA, Canada, Australia, Japan, Thailand, and Vietnam tax fuel use for domestic flights, the UK doesn’t. Whereas 23 EU countries apply VAT to domestic flights and the USA, Australia, Canada, and others also tax domestic flights, the UK doesn’t.
Aviation’s £7 Billion Subsidy Per Year In UK Needs To Be Dropped
paulfromcamden
Baffled
I dunno. The nearest parallel I can think of is my experience of living in Japan. The shinkansen services aren't cheap either. But they're a joy to use, on many routes run every ten minutes or so, are reliable within a couple of seconds, and always have plenty of passengers. You'd be crazy to use anything else.
I guess the obvious difference is we won't have Japanese rail companies running the service so we'll have a High Speed Rail Replacement Bus every other Tuesday.
Ponty
pfm Member
Yes, I get that from an east - west perspective. But to London? The trains from Manc / Brum to London are already fast (and v expensive unless you can travel 3 weeks on Tuesday lunchtime). I just can’t see that there are hoards of people waiting to pile onto HS2 trains, particularly post covid. I suspect the Brum link will be like the M6 toll, fine if you can afford to use it.
canonman
pfm Member
Latest plan revealed