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How good is Well Tempered Simplex

Listening to Doobie Brothers on my Amadeus GT with Blackbird arm right now - magical. Time to repeat that I would never want to put anyone off a Well Tempered deck - sorry if anyone ever got that impression. My musings on the technicalities of the arm geometry were academic.

It's reassuring to know that I have a spare motor which cost £3, and an unlimited supply of belts. I could probably DIY a new bearing for this deck too, when the time comes, if I live that long (unlikely).

At the Deluxe Audio Show this last weekend a fellow turntable nut complained that the nylon filament belt on his deck (not a Well Tempered) had a tendency to slip. I thought about this problem and it came to me that rosin for violin bows might be a good way to mitigate it. I'm planning to try this, although I doubt I'll hear anything as I've never heard any speed instability on my Amadeus. Still, a suggestion worth sharing, possibly.
 
Darren said:
Because it looks like someone's science project and the Rega P1 looks far better finished?
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Had a top flat sondek during the 90/00 EKOS Aro Ittok 2 Lingo And DV Karat listened to the WT ref and sold it all soon after fitted my DV onto a Rega and was happy. Now have a Simplex and new karat and I’m delighted. My Naim amps got the boot as well although the NAC 82 was decent with the HX1.2 mk2 and ARCs. Anyway never missed the sondek for many reasons.
 
I know lots people rave about the performance, I was tempted to buy one myself. But the Heath Robinson nature of it put me off. There’s one in the classifieds with what is described as a “common fault”. The fault looks like what happens when you get a bit heavy-handed assembling some cheap flat pack.
 
Heard a WT Amadeus in my home a while back, superb. That an a Phonosophie P3 were the only decks that I would have happily swapped my LP12 for. Both looked well made.
 
It is not beyond any one of us to produce a replacement plinth for a Simplex from plywood in an afternoon.

I can understand that some are put off by the basic level of engineering (e.g. carpentry) in some of the Well Tempered designs, but I view this as a strength, not a weakness. A great turntable can be quite a crude device, and when I see high-precision expensively-finished parts pushing up deck prices, decks which will one day be very expensive to repair, I wonder why that's necessary. The genius of Bill Firebaugh is that he ruthlessly removed the requirement for precision engineering. I've said this many times, but an engineer is someone who can do for two bob what any fool can do for a quid. By that measure Firebaugh is the master, and his decks are the zenith of the art. Unbelievably clever and musically satisfying. If I have to replace a damaged plinth - I'm ready. YMMV.
 
So if it is a just a cheap £3 motor, some nylon belt and a bit of chipboard what does it do that other similarly simple/cheap decks don't ? What is its MO for want of a better term?
 
matt j said:
So if it is a just a cheap £3 motor, some nylon belt and a bit of chipboard what does it do that other similarly simple/cheap decks don't ? What is its MO for want of a better term?
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Do you mean USP rather than MO? If so, the answer is simple: the Well Tempered decks sound as good or better than just about all decks at equivalent price.

Why? Because of good engineering decisions about where to spend the budget, where to economise, and how to steal a march on the competition. Here are some examples: cheap motor isolated from plinth by rubber diaphragm; non-precessing very stable bearing by using triangular aperture in a nylon disc; low-elasticity high torque motor pulley/platter ratio; arm bearing with golf ball as only precision part; 33/45 rpm capstan with easy belt transfer; dirt cheap but adequate belt; and so on. Just a lot of very good decisions about how to make a great-sounding deck with modest resources. It's admirable.
 
Spiderous said:
I know lots people rave about the performance, I was tempted to buy one myself. But the Heath Robinson nature of it put me off. There’s one in the classifieds with what is described as a “common fault”. The fault looks like what happens when you get a bit heavy-handed assembling some cheap flat pack.
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That was my exact thought.
 
You’re paying for expert engineering, a distributor and a dealer. Just as one is with an LP12, for example. A Technics is slightly different because of massive economies of scale and state of the art manufacturing facilities.

Judging anything by parts cost is a fool’s game in HiFi. We’re supposed to value sound quality. If a Simplex sounds better at its price point then it is better. I’ve owned Linn, Well Tempered and Technics turntables and enjoy them all for what they are.
 
sonddek said:
Do you mean USP rather than MO? If so, the answer is simple: the Well Tempered decks sound as good or better than just about all decks at equivalent price.

Why? Because of good engineering decisions about where to spend the budget, where to economise, and how to steal a march on the competition. Here are some examples: cheap motor isolated from plinth by rubber diaphragm; non-precessing very stable bearing by using triangular aperture in a nylon disc; low-elasticity high torque motor pulley/platter ratio; arm bearing with golf ball as only precision part; 33/45 rpm capstan with easy belt transfer; dirt cheap but adequate belt; and so on. Just a lot of very good decisions about how to make a great-sounding deck with modest resources. It's admirable.
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Yes USP was what I was after! Aside from the arm nothing jumps out as massively ground breaking there, but plenty of people rave about the sound. I'll try and get a listen at some point as plenty of LP12 owners seem to rate them.
 
There is not a huge difference in sound. The Amadeus is similar, just a bit more neutral so it handles more complex music better.
 
matt j said:
Yes USP was what I was after! Aside from the arm nothing jumps out as massively ground breaking there, but plenty of people rave about the sound. I'll try and get a listen at some point as plenty of LP12 owners seem to rate them.
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There are not very many turntables with non-circular bearing bushings. I forked out for a Karousel to keep my Sondek vaguely up to date, but I've no doubt that the Well Tempered bearing competes, at least, and you could probably make profit selling them for thirty quid.

If I come to producing an affordable high performance turntable the inspiration will be Firebaugh's ruthless concentration on reducing the design to what really matters.
 
I’ve just bought a Simplex. Just about to get it setup. Would anyone be interested in some pictures to show how it all goes together?

I am assembling it up from the start, and adding all the oil and silicon and so on.

I couldn’t really see before I bought it how it all goes together so I wondered if anyone else would like to see.
 
Eoin said:
I’ve just bought a Simplex. Just about to get it setup. Would anyone be interested in some pictures to show how it all goes together?

I am assembling it up from the start, and adding all the oil and silicon and so on.

I couldn’t really see before I bought it how it all goes together so I wondered if anyone else would like to see.
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Yes please!
 
I replaced my 1970s LP12/Lingo with a Well Tempered Record Player, a predecessor to all the current models.
It’s a fantastic deck and I’m not looking to replace it any time soon.
 
I use a GTA too wth XX-2 MK2. I've had it since they came out and I'm sure the simplex is pretty similar sonically. The arm is capable of carrying some very high spec cartridges beyond my pocket. The only items I've replaced (apart from cartridges) are the squash balls - Wilson red dot ;). My only regret is not buying a cueing device while they were available.



 
WT GTA with DV XX-2 MK 2 here also. Replaced an LP12 with after market sub-chassis (can't remember which), Tiger Paw Tranquillity bearing support, Infinity Black Widow/Shure V15-3/Jico SAS and Lingo 3.

Sound quality is superior to my ears, and it certainly got me off the upgrade bandwagon. No regrets whatsoever. Only modifications were a new low slung counterweight and a purpose made acrylic dust cover!
 
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