Brexit: give me a positive effect... XIII

[Kirk]

Boris wasn't even born when the original lie began.

You're not going to last long in a snake pit if you're anything other than a snake. That is the single reason why Brexiters 'downplay' Boris's mendacity. It isn't pretty, and it isn't enjoyable, but it is almost certainly necessary.

Well, at least you admit it.

Boris wasn't even born when the original lie began.

You're not going to last long in a snake pit if you're anything other than a snake. That is the single reason why Brexiters 'downplay' Boris's mendacity. It isn't pretty, and it isn't enjoyable, but it is almost certainly necessary.

Ah...but who has the ladders?

 

[Brian]

Well we will all have to suffer on then and see what happens if it comes to pass. There is no point in opening up the old story line of the last election and SNP voting etc. We can all see that Labour have to win England to have any chance. The problem is the majority there appear to want Brexit at any cost and Labour will continue to play both sides. I don't see any soft landing regardless of what happens in the next election. This is the future and it will continue in this disjointed and ludicrous path even if Labour sneaks in next time.

I’m not opening up any old story line, just saying how it is. The accusation was I was mainly blaming the EU, I replied to that by again clearly placing responsibility with the tories but you still find something to cry about. No tory govt=no brexit and every seat counts in a GE. It is simply a fact, that it doesn’t suit your agenda and that of the kids you side with is not a concern to me.

The groundhog day stuff is from hard remainers, 6 years stuck on repeat, ‘opening the same old story lines’.

 

[Brian]

You seem to be in a constant sate of pathological agitation.

Like the Express readership. CAAATT: Confused And Angry All The Time

That’s nice. Old chums still sticking together.

 

[eternumviti]

The Lone Sandwich anecdote. You’ve obviously never seen what happens at US or NZ points of arrival regarding those carrying food. My point though was about lying in high office and collusion with it -and it still stands.

But as we all agree, NI is not only a particularly sensitive issue, but it is also a part of the UK. And it is not a point of entry into either NZ or the US.

Do you not acknowledge, even slightly, the utter absurdity of refusing a lorry entry because there's an undocumented sandwich in the driver's cab. In a lorry travelling from one part of the UK to another, within two customs, SPS veterinary and food standards jurisdictions that are absolutely identical, and have been for years.

You could use it as a case study in blind insanity, let alone the pedantism of which you so often accuse me. And in Northern Ireland! It is effing madness.

 

[TheDecameron]

But as we all agree, NI is not only a particularly sensitive issue, but it is also a part of the UK. And it is not a point of entry into either NZ or the US.

Do you not acknowledge, even slightly, the utter absurdity of refusing a lorry entry because there's an undocumented sandwich in the driver's cab. In a lorry travelling from one part of the UK to another, within two customs, SPS veterinary and food standards jurisdictions that are absolutely identical, and have been for years.

You could use it as a case study in blind insanity, let alone the pedantism of which you so often accuse me. And in Northern Ireland! It is effing madness.

That’s two sandwich anecdotes now. How many hundred thousand tons of food have passed normally? Time for an all out packed lunch war.

“Dutch police officers have sparked fury after officers were filmed laughing at a British truck driver while confiscating his ham sandwiches in line with post-Brexit import rules.

'Welcome to the Brexit, sir,' one of the officers says mockingly in the video of the incident, as the driver pleads: 'Can you take the meat and leave me the bread?'

Footage from Dutch TV showed the border officials confiscating sandwiches and other foodstuffs from drivers entering the Netherlands from the UK”.
Daily Mail.

 

[eternumviti]

That’s two sandwich anecdotes now. How many hundred thousand tons of food have passed normally?...

None, grace period excepted. Every sandwich requires up to 3 Veterinary health certificates. Every lorry load of agri-food product requires 720 pages of archaic, analogue, forms to be correctly filled in the specified ink colour. A veterinary inspection of a truck takes up to 6 hours, with up to 12 hours of form-filling at the head office or depot. Any one, small deviation, wrong coloured ink or a misaligned stamp can mean that the entire truck has to be turned around, for it is not enough just to remove the offending item.

Now you will say 'ah, but it's the rules, and as the UK is now a third country it has to comply by the rules just like any other yada, yada, yada... and Johnson signed the deal yada, yada...' and I will respond with comments about brain-dead pedantism, punishment beatings, blind bureaucracy gone utterly insane, the spiteful ugliness of the EC and the fact that these idiots are stoking a fire that, should it catch, they will not only not be able to control, but which will consume them and their ridiculous, nasty theology, along with NI.

 

[Barrymagrec]

I think this thread should be moderated by Nicholas Parsons - he wouldn`t allow all this repetition and deviation.

 

[Tony L]

I see that even after what must be thousands of pages now we haven’t progressed beyond the typical public-school Tory arrogance and dickheadery of “I don’t want to be a member of your golf club, but I absolutely demand to be able to play there whenever I wish by whatever rules I choose”.

 

[Colin L]

The thing that annoys me about Brexit and its defenders is that they claim it's a good thing for many reasons, but the Brexit / Leave referendum taking points focussed solely on misleading facts and outright lies (they still do btw). If it was such a good thing why not argue for it on its merits. We have ET on this very thread accepting that Leave / Spaffer are liars, but he holds his nose and votes Tory and Brexit because the ends justify the means. Thats quite a credibility gap IMO.

 

[TheDecameron]

None, grace period excepted. Every sandwich requires up to 3 Veterinary health certificates. Every lorry load of agri-food product requires 720 pages of archaic, analogue, forms to be correctly filled in the specified ink colour. A veterinary inspection of a truck takes up to 6 hours, with up to 12 hours of form-filling at the head office or depot. Any one, small deviation, wrong coloured ink or a misaligned stamp can mean that the entire truck has to be turned around, for it is not enough just to remove the offending item.

Now you will say 'ah, but it's the rules, and as the UK is now a third country it has to comply by the rules just like any other yada, yada, yada... and Johnson signed the deal yada, yada...' and I will respond with comments about brain-dead pedantism, punishment beatings, blind bureaucracy gone utterly insane, the spiteful ugliness of the EC and the fact that these idiots are stoking a fire that, should it catch, they will not only not be able to control, but which will consume them and their ridiculous, nasty theology, along with NI.

This is a new development! You do the post and write in the hypothesised response. It’s a fast track/ one stop shop solution to overmanning in the Brexit age. I’m expecting an automated response system next with a generic- ‘please read the FAQ section’.

 

[PsB]

None, grace period excepted. Every sandwich requires up to 3 Veterinary health certificates. Every lorry load of agri-food product requires 720 pages of archaic, analogue, forms to be correctly filled in the specified ink colour. A veterinary inspection of a truck takes up to 6 hours, with up to 12 hours of form-filling at the head office or depot. Any one, small deviation, wrong coloured ink or a misaligned stamp can mean that the entire truck has to be turned around, for it is not enough just to remove the offending item.

Now you will say 'ah, but it's the rules, and as the UK is now a third country it has to comply by the rules just like any other yada, yada, yada... and Johnson signed the deal yada, yada...' and I will respond with comments about brain-dead pedantism, punishment beatings, blind bureaucracy gone utterly insane, the spiteful ugliness of the EC and the fact that these idiots are stoking a fire that, should it catch, they will not only not be able to control, but which will consume them and their ridiculous, nasty theology, along with NI.

Have you ever tried to "import" a ham sandwich into the US? Or Australia? They don't let any in, the rules are very much black and white, and the penalties if they find one you haven't declared go way beyond confiscation. As you say, the UK has left the EU, but it has also refused to align on food standards. So we are where we are, and the EU applies the rules like any bureaucracy, as it was obvious it would from the start.

When I lived in the US I flew frequently from Paris into various airports (Atlanta or Raleigh Durham, also JFK and Newark). Invariably around Christmas time, the immigration officer would mark my form with the dreaded "A-1" mark meaning I was singled out for 20' of fine-tooth comb agricultural inspection of all my luggage. They just could not believe that I was not trying to sneak in a couple of saucissons. I frequently got into perfectly futile arguments about the desirability of having more unadulterated French saucisson or pâté circulating in the USofA, but also learned some useful info, e.g. it's perfectly OK to bring raw milk camembert (as you long as you declare it, naturally). There's actually a lot of method to DoA madness.

 

[TheDecameron]

I think this thread should be moderated by Nicholas Parsons - he wouldn`t allow all this repetition and deviation.

I think you would be excellent in the role Barry, I always respected your even temper and equanimity. I would certainly defer to your moderating decisions*.

*slipping a pony now and again.

 

[Seeker_UK]

Have you ever tried to "import" a ham sandwich into the US? Or Australia?

I got British food into Australia by carrying it past Customs in my GI tract.

 

[eternumviti]

Have you ever tried to "import" a ham sandwich into the US? Or Australia? They don't let any in, the rules are very much black and white, and the penalties if they find one you haven't declared go way beyond confiscation. As you say, the UK has left the EU, but it has also refused to align on food standards. So we are where we are, and the EU applies the rules like any bureaucracy, as it was obvious it would from the start.

When I lived in the US I flew frequently from Paris into various airports (Atlanta or Raleigh Durham, also JFK and Newark). Invariably around Christmas time, the immigration officer would mark my form with the dreaded "A-1" mark meaning I was singled out for 20' of fine-tooth comb agricultural inspection of all my luggage. They just could not believe that I was not trying to sneak in a couple of saucissons. I frequently got into perfectly futile arguments about the desirability of having more unadulterated French saucisson or pâté circulating in the USofA, but also learned some useful info, e.g. it's perfectly OK to bring raw milk camembert (as you long as you declare it, naturally). There's actually a lot of method to DoA madness.

All very interesting, but NI is not the USA. I refer the honourable gentleman to my reply to TheDecameron of 8.44 last night.

Your reply would anyway have had a tad more relevance if you had been travelling from mainland US to, say Hawaii or Alaska.

 

[Kirk]

Foster has been on GB News - "Boris took the view that he was going to get Brexit done. In order to do that he was going to sign up to the protocol and he would change it later on. That was genuinely his belief that he would change it later on. Now of course that has proven to be very very difficult."

 

[eternumviti]

I see that even after what must be thousands of pages now we haven’t progressed beyond the typical public-school Tory arrogance and dickheadery of “I don’t want to be a member of your golf club, but I absolutely demand to be able to play there whenever I wish by whatever rules I choose”.

Oh, God, its the golf club again.

Tony, geopolitics, and the EU, have nothing in common with a golf club. It's an awfully weak analogy.

A very tory one too, if you think about it!

This is a new development! You do the post and write in the hypothesised response. It’s a fast track/ one stop shop solution to overmanning in the Brexit age. I’m expecting an automated response system next with a generic- ‘please read the FAQ section’.

Your posts sometimes get so abstract as to be incomprehensible. Anything, I suppose, is better than actually addressing the questions.

 

[TheDecameron]

Well EV, when the question is ‘here’s the latest edition of Watch Tower- YOU tell me how the earth isn’t 6,000 years old’ then I’m afraid it doesn’t promote engagement. Look at your response in #1554 “All very interesting but I’m here to talk about…”
What you’ve done is (just like the Tory Government) narrowed the discussion to your choice of taking point, using the colourful imagery of the lonely sandwich.
You got your Brexit, you got the Boris-singled contract now JFDI.

 

[Kirk]

The thing that annoys me about Brexit and its defenders is that they claim it's a good thing for many reasons, but the Brexit / Leave referendum taking points focussed solely on misleading facts and outright lies (they still do btw). If it was such a good thing why not argue for it on its merits. We have ET on this very thread accepting that Leave / Spaffer are liars, but he holds his nose and votes Tory and Brexit because the ends justify the means. Thats quite a credibility gap IMO.

And let's not forget their notion of democracy - "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge". Asimov saw them coming.

 

[ff1d1l]

Oh, God, its the golf club again.

Tony, geopolitics, and the EU, have nothing in common with a golf club. It's an awfully weak analogy.

Sorry, but it is a spot on analogy - and holds up to scrutiny rather better than Barren Shelves Colin's Titanic one, which has also been trotted out rather more often recently than the golf cart has. If you're so analogy-phobic how come you haven't weighed in on that pisspoor example?

 

[davidsrsb]

Meanwhile at the other end of the planet we manage to trade all kinds of stuff with the EU by using their standards unmodified. They are bigger than us, get over it.