Brexit: give me a positive effect (2022 remastered edition) II
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richardg
Admonishtrator
This is not as the Belgian police saw it. They have complained that they had to go in and sort it out becasue the institutions are so poorly self-regulated.
Your comment is more ridiculous defence of the EU when it does not merit it.
richardg
Admonishtrator
Not so fast. I have sold my french company and am now running a new one, and it is English! Taxes are going back your way.
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
Excellent- the lockup you spoke of, I presume? Sometimes I worry you’re only a carbon monoxide alarm away from a persistent vegetative state.
BTW did you get deported?
richardg
Admonishtrator
ff1d1l
pfm Member
Getting there...Two thirds of Britons support ref to rejoin the EU
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/ukne...e-referendum-on-rejoining-the-eu/ar-AA15Rpwf?
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/ukne...e-referendum-on-rejoining-the-eu/ar-AA15Rpwf?
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TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
Gibraltar was never part of Johnson’s EU withdrawal agreement. Negotiations are still on-going to define Gibraltar’s ultimate relationship with the EU. Like Scotland and N.Ireland, a majority of Gibraltarians voted to remain in the EU. Its economy is utterly reliant on the 15,000 EU citizens who cross the border daily to service the economy, yet more than six years after it decided to leave the EU, Britain has failed to agree a treaty and has run emergency planning for what would happen if no deal was secured,
https://www.gibraltar.gov.gi/press-releases/government-exercise-for-no-treaty-8892022-8487
Meanwhile on Brexit Island, Farage’s crew along with the fanatics on the Tory benches and literally a handful of Ulster backwoodsmen are still haunting the zombie government of Sunak as well as the Labour Party in an attempt to further degrade existing agreements with Europe. The clown car’s still smouldering.
https://www.gibraltar.gov.gi/press-releases/government-exercise-for-no-treaty-8892022-8487
Meanwhile on Brexit Island, Farage’s crew along with the fanatics on the Tory benches and literally a handful of Ulster backwoodsmen are still haunting the zombie government of Sunak as well as the Labour Party in an attempt to further degrade existing agreements with Europe. The clown car’s still smouldering.
Brian
Eating fat, staying slim
Should there be another referendum within the next 5 to 10 years or so, the EU will insist on poor terms for the UK so rejoining is likely to be rejected.
6 years? Disingenuous. The first 4 at least were wasted due to the attempts to overturn the referendum result. 2 x GE’s, no progress made on just about anything with endless bickering going on in Parliament. Some folk have a lot to answer for and that’s not just those who voted to leave.
Going back to the notion of the UK rejoining the EU. How ironic should Scotland leave its largest trading partner only for the UK to rejoin the EU and Scotland to become genuinely independent. e.g. failing to meet the criteria for joining the EU.
sean99
pfm Member
https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/24/economy/brexit-uk-economy/index.html
"Brexit has cracked Britain’s economic foundations
In reality, Brexit has hobbled the UK economy, which remains the only member of the G7 — the group of advanced economies that also includes Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan and the United States — with an economy smaller than it was before the pandemic."
Pretty good summary of the mess that Brexit has caused - at least a decade, likely much longer, of significant economic damage.
"Brexit has cracked Britain’s economic foundations
In reality, Brexit has hobbled the UK economy, which remains the only member of the G7 — the group of advanced economies that also includes Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan and the United States — with an economy smaller than it was before the pandemic."
Pretty good summary of the mess that Brexit has caused - at least a decade, likely much longer, of significant economic damage.
misterdog
Not the canine kind
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/20/eu-referendum-george-osborne-house-prices-brexit
So a Tory Chancellor, along with the governor of the Bank Of England,back in 2016, predicts that house prices will crash if we choose Brexit.
Yet the opposite actually happened.
What went wrong ?
More lies ?
Maybe people were convinced to vote for Brexit, because they thought it unfair to the younger generation, that house prices were too high.
By a Tory Chancellor of the exchequer.
So a Tory Chancellor, along with the governor of the Bank Of England,back in 2016, predicts that house prices will crash if we choose Brexit.
Yet the opposite actually happened.
What went wrong ?
More lies ?
Maybe people were convinced to vote for Brexit, because they thought it unfair to the younger generation, that house prices were too high.
By a Tory Chancellor of the exchequer.
eternumviti
Insufficient privileges to reply.
This is all terribly gloomy, which must be an enormous relief.
I'm reluctant to ask, but feel that I should if only to quench my own curiosity, but by what metric is Britain's economy actually smaller than it was prior to the pandemic? All the graphs and what have you seem to indicate that it isn't smaller, though there appear to have been peaks in 2005 and 2014. Perhaps that's what the article was referring to.
Britain's dumpster economy seems to remain, by some miracle, the 6th largest in the world, and the 2nd largest in Europe, and despite some comparisons I've seen recently, remains, remarkably, larger than that of Uruguay.
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
Relative size isn’t the dominant measure of success or failure- it’s the rate and direction of change and I think we know where that’s headed. It would be as fatuous as choosing another single parameter in isolation…like house prices, though I think we know where those are heading too.
My favourite is “ well the sun hasn’t fallen out of the sky” (sic). Perhaps ‘Brexit’s Buggered Business’ would be more accurate.
My favourite is “ well the sun hasn’t fallen out of the sky” (sic). Perhaps ‘Brexit’s Buggered Business’ would be more accurate.
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eternumviti
Insufficient privileges to reply.
I assume your accusations of fatuosity are directed at sean99, given that it was he to whom I was responding, you know, Britains position relative to the G7 etc..
Of course this small island will progressively diminish relative to the rapid rise of the so-called 'emerging economies', many of them far more populous than the UK. The British economy, in common with those of the EU's big beasts, is stagnating relative to those emerging economies, and I doubt there's anything that will stop that shift. We are mature economies saddled with ageing populations. Europe's position in terms of world GDP has been falling for years. It's probably quite remarkable that we've hung on as long as we have.
Brexit has 'buggered' some businesses, undoubtedly, but given that only a relatively small percentage of UK businesses exported to the EU, and that EU exports accounted for only about 14% of GDP prior to (actual) brexit, it won't have 'buggered' by any means all of them, whilst many will have undoubtedly benefited, and will benefit in the future, from import substitution, and opening new markets. And, of course, many businesses have adapted to the new export rules. Business is well known for being extraordinarily adaptable.
The question of the UK's apparently diminished (smaller) economy relative to 'prior to the pandemic' remains unaddressed.
farfromthesun
pfm Member
Not sure about that. I think the Tories just didn't have the first clue what to do (still don't) but they never once said that the referendum result would be overturned and were in fact steadfast in maintaining that it would be respected. It was simply hard to do, hence why it's still ongoing, and a right old mess, seven years later.
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
It was always someone else’s fault. They took back control on 24 June 2016 and within months the nuclear button was pressed by the British Parliament invoking Article 50, sealing Britain’s departure from the union. Despite the regular shit posting about ‘not respecting democracy’ by simply disagreeing with the UK’s withdrawal or having the temerity to vote for non approved parties, thus undermining the great British deal we should be entitled to, it’s clear the responsibility for what happened lies with the elected government(s) of Great Britain.
Its also so obvious that while they couldn’t believe their luck that enough of the electorate were taken in by the putative benefits of leaving the E.U. they had been selling, the anti-EU Tories and Labour politicians hadn’t the first clue what to do in order to deliver ‘the vision’. Instead attacks on any dissenting voices and public institutions were carried out. Ministers for Departing the EU and even Prime Ministers came and went. They couldn’t square the dream of Brexit as told by Farage, Johnson, Gove et al with reality.
Attacks on democracy did of course come- the most notorious being the unlawful closure of Parliament by a Prime Minister and threats against the judiciary, labelled as ‘Enemies of The People’. The attack on the democratic choice of the people of Northern Ireland is currently under way with threats of escalation regularly coming from Government ministers, even if somewhat muted under the third Prime Minister in as many months.
misterdog
Not the canine kind
So you will be blaming next years fall in house prices on Brexit, not the 'world' inflation,interest rate rises and recession ?
https://www.ecb.europa.eu/pub/econo...ng to the estimated model,two years (Chart B).
Maybe less fatuous than you might like to think.
TheDecameron
Unicorns fart glitter.
The broad expert* consensus is that Brexit has cost Britain. Even the British Govts impact assessments show net economic loss. Against that we have a couple of Brexit fans on a forum doing a Vicky Pollard on the subject.
* yeahrraknow- we’ve had enough of experts cos I know what I know.
* yeahrraknow- we’ve had enough of experts cos I know what I know.
ff1d1l
pfm Member
In 2015, 44% of the UK's goods and services were exported to the EU, while 53% of our imports came to the UK from the EU. In the same year, UK exports to the EU were valued at £223.3 billion, while UK imports from the EU stood at £291.1 billion.
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