merlin
Avatar changed - Town names deemed offensive.
The Yamaha FX-3 looks rather tasty - front ported and a 15" paper cone ala JBL. Floor standers too so discrete!
Best system to go with Yamaha NS-1000's?
- Thread starter PlanetZany
- Start date
joel
Painter of Dragons, Maker of Mirrors
I was pondering those very speakers. They've been in stock a few days now, so probably almost ripe for a bit of nego...
But they're not for me I think. Space is pretty tight, even with these Japanese Kans.
I think they'd work a treat at Merlin's place, though. Quad-like clarity with JBL punch for 800 quid..
But they're not for me I think. Space is pretty tight, even with these Japanese Kans.
I think they'd work a treat at Merlin's place, though. Quad-like clarity with JBL punch for 800 quid..
joel
Painter of Dragons, Maker of Mirrors
You are right. Not only not loud enough for you, but they don't do JBL bass, at least not to the degree all that dub u have lying around requires.
With a bit of tweaking (and new stands especially, I suspect), I think they will do pretty good bass. Certainly more than acceptable in terms of depth and speed, but without the wonderful jackhammer kick of the JBL / TAD world.
With a bit of tweaking (and new stands especially, I suspect), I think they will do pretty good bass. Certainly more than acceptable in terms of depth and speed, but without the wonderful jackhammer kick of the JBL / TAD world.
enjoy_the_music
pfm Member
Nice...seen a few dub/reggae concerts here in Strasbourg...walk out feeling like you smoked a thousand joints. nice.
Anyway, interesting about the FX-3's...i've been looking at some of those too but would prefer the Exclusives. They are highly rated and rare...unsure if they are for studio use.
Joel, those look mighty high up on the stands. Doesnt Yamaha recommend 35cm? Ask at hifido, Yamaha did make dedicated stands for these bad boys. They are slab sided with a connecting slab running diagonal through the centre...you'll know what i mean when you see'em.
I'm just trying to get the girlfriend to agree to the purchase of a house locally...if so would allow for large extension with cathedral ceilings and ample room for some top end booty shakers...she's french though and needs more convincing than most.
Anyway, interesting about the FX-3's...i've been looking at some of those too but would prefer the Exclusives. They are highly rated and rare...unsure if they are for studio use.
Joel, those look mighty high up on the stands. Doesnt Yamaha recommend 35cm? Ask at hifido, Yamaha did make dedicated stands for these bad boys. They are slab sided with a connecting slab running diagonal through the centre...you'll know what i mean when you see'em.
I'm just trying to get the girlfriend to agree to the purchase of a house locally...if so would allow for large extension with cathedral ceilings and ample room for some top end booty shakers...she's french though and needs more convincing than most.
enjoy_the_music
pfm Member
Yeah thats not so bad a price either. There were some on french ebay which ended at 7500 euros but the reserve wasnt met...ugly bastards though aren't they? The Exclusive and newer JBL everest's are a 'tad' prettier 
Even for a truck load of Agent Provocateur underwear would the missus let me have them.
Even for a truck load of Agent Provocateur underwear would the missus let me have them.
should get the JBL everests for Y1,000,000 (also at hifido) Richard
now they look SERIOUS!!
joel
Painter of Dragons, Maker of Mirrors
Yamaha's recommendations are interesting, and I understand why they say what they say, but I can hear quite clearly what it is I'm doing in my room. Height can make an interesting difference. The speakers have changed, but the room acoustic hasn't very much (unfortunately).
joel
Painter of Dragons, Maker of Mirrors
I've moved the speakers a fraction apart and closer to the rear wall and adjusted toe-in to make it ever-so-slightly shallower, so the backs are now at 210 and 250mm, IOW, about 4cm of toe-in (everything measured the the mm on each speaker, of course).
Bass gains punch and depth, wiithout sounding too far off further up. Overall there's more weight, but no muddiness apparent right now. Adjusting the toe-in seems to have alleviated some excess mid-range energy and cleared up some of the occasional treble heat around the 2nd xover with the L-pads set between Harbeth & Quad.
Overall, the effect is smoother and more natural, but very very clear. Definitely worth playing with the setup on these.
The TV now returns as a bit of a problem because of it's position, but I can live with it for the time being, and it's less bothersome than with the Harbs.
Anyway, TRACK 5 is now playing. Sadly not at D66000 volume. I would hazard a guess that the Everests are actually broken in more places than we thought...
Bass gains punch and depth, wiithout sounding too far off further up. Overall there's more weight, but no muddiness apparent right now. Adjusting the toe-in seems to have alleviated some excess mid-range energy and cleared up some of the occasional treble heat around the 2nd xover with the L-pads set between Harbeth & Quad.
Overall, the effect is smoother and more natural, but very very clear. Definitely worth playing with the setup on these.
The TV now returns as a bit of a problem because of it's position, but I can live with it for the time being, and it's less bothersome than with the Harbs.
Anyway, TRACK 5 is now playing. Sadly not at D66000 volume. I would hazard a guess that the Everests are actually broken in more places than we thought...
enbee23
pfm Member
I currently run a pair of NS-1000M and before them used to run Compact 7s from Accuphase pre/monos. I'm not able to make any direct comparison between the two speakers as a house move and the change of amplification and speakers all happened pretty much at the same time. So, it's interesting to read your observations
joel
Painter of Dragons, Maker of Mirrors
These are one of the great audio bargains of Japan. The temptation is to say they are great speakers for the money (there, I did), but the simple truth is that these are great speakers.
First impressions were, for once, fairly accurate. Very low distortion, smooth top-to bottom response with some treble bias that can be simply and cleanly adjusted to taste/need using the L-pads, and a goodly amount of thump, though not in JBL/TAD territory.
Bass is deep enough and pretty good, while positioning makes a significant difference to the sound - and not just in the bass. Bass response is not as even as I would like yet, but of course the room is playing a big part in this. Room treatments, long overdue, are next on the agenda. Nevertheless, I'm more than happy with the direction the sound is taking.
Integration between drivers is seamless to my ears. The mid and treble units in particular seem to act as a single driver. Even very close up it is surprisingly hard to tell one from another.
The Yamahas can be played at low, moderate or quite high volume with no strain to speaker or ear. They are one of the few speakers I've heard that are perfectly satisfying at low volume, in fact they set a new standard for me in this respect. Yes, better than the Harbs (although M40s would make for a more appropriate comparison).
Stereo imaging is very good; being essentially between and slightly beyond the speakers as it should be, and as I like it. Fans of all enveloping high-end spacious soundstaging may want to look elsewhere. Imaging is not as it was with the EVs, inhumanly precise, so even well-recorded voices are ever so slightly smudged L/R in comparison. Since most recordings these days are totally incoherent in terms of stereo anyway, this is less of an issue than it might at first seem. Overall, the speakers seem dependable; on a few stereo recordings made in the field with hand-held mics, musicians, people, animals, fireworks, thunderstorms all seem to move naturally across as well backwards and forwards, while changes to mic position heard as a phasey effect are very clear, too.
The inherent cleanliness of the NS-1000 sound coupled with the carbon-fibre 12" LF driver provide a very accurate take on perc and drums with enough kick and bite, however they are not in TAD territory. TAD are the only speakers that do percussion & drums completely convincingly.
Warm sounding records sound warm, cool sounding speakers sound cool. In a sense they are like a blank canvas onto which each recording is painted.
What all this adds up to is a speaker that essentially outputs what is input. While this is fantastic, it's not always very pretty. Listening to classic BN, RVG's cavalier approach to piano is more apparent than it has ever been, and the recordings really stink in places (things we've discussed on PFM before), as the distortion doesn't melt away into a gold-tinged background fuzz, but is presented right there, as it is.
These are not speakers that are somehow "musical". They are tools, designed to do a job; to present what's being input as cleanly and in as uncoloured a manner as possible. They don't attempt to make recordings sound exciting, smooth, musical or anything other than what they are. Of course they're not entirely successful, but they get close, at least as close as any similarly sized speaker I've heard.
This weekend has been spent listening to all types of music, it seems at times as though through new ears. These speakers are that good.
First impressions were, for once, fairly accurate. Very low distortion, smooth top-to bottom response with some treble bias that can be simply and cleanly adjusted to taste/need using the L-pads, and a goodly amount of thump, though not in JBL/TAD territory.
Bass is deep enough and pretty good, while positioning makes a significant difference to the sound - and not just in the bass. Bass response is not as even as I would like yet, but of course the room is playing a big part in this. Room treatments, long overdue, are next on the agenda. Nevertheless, I'm more than happy with the direction the sound is taking.
Integration between drivers is seamless to my ears. The mid and treble units in particular seem to act as a single driver. Even very close up it is surprisingly hard to tell one from another.
The Yamahas can be played at low, moderate or quite high
volume with no strain to speaker or ear. They are one of the few speakers I've heard that are perfectly satisfying at low volume, in fact they set a new standard for me in this respect. Yes, better than the Harbs (although M40s would make for a more appropriate comparison).Stereo imaging is very good; being essentially between and slightly beyond the speakers as it should be, and as I like it. Fans of all enveloping high-end spacious soundstaging may want to look elsewhere. Imaging is not as it was with the EVs, inhumanly precise, so even well-recorded voices are ever so slightly smudged L/R in comparison. Since most recordings these days are totally incoherent in terms of stereo anyway, this is less of an issue than it might at first seem. Overall, the speakers seem dependable; on a few stereo recordings made in the field with hand-held mics, musicians, people, animals, fireworks, thunderstorms
all seem to move naturally across as well backwards and forwards, while changes to mic position heard as a phasey effect are very clear, too.The inherent cleanliness of the NS-1000 sound coupled with the carbon-fibre 12" LF driver provide a very accurate take on perc and drums with enough kick and bite, however they are not in TAD territory. TAD are the only speakers that do percussion & drums completely convincingly.
Warm sounding records sound warm, cool sounding speakers sound cool. In a sense they are like a blank canvas onto which each recording is painted.
What all this adds up to is a speaker that essentially outputs what is input. While this is fantastic, it's not always very pretty. Listening to classic BN, RVG's cavalier approach to piano is more apparent than it has ever been, and the recordings really stink in places (things we've discussed on PFM before), as the distortion doesn't melt away into a gold-tinged background fuzz, but is presented right there, as it is.
These are not speakers that are somehow "musical". They are tools, designed to do a job; to present what's being input as cleanly and in as uncoloured a manner as possible. They don't attempt to make recordings sound exciting, smooth, musical or anything other than what they are. Of course they're not entirely successful, but they get close, at least as close as any similarly sized speaker I've heard.
This weekend has been spent listening to all types of music, it seems at times as though through new ears. These speakers are that good.
sideshowbob
Champagne fascia aficionado
Sounds like a definite result. Enjoy.
-- Ian
-- Ian
joel
Painter of Dragons, Maker of Mirrors
They make some pretty horny PA rigs, but nothing like the NS-1000s AFAIK. Mind you, they produced something like 200,000 NS-1000s over 20 years, so not too shabby.
This would not be an economical speaker to produce these days, sadly.
I think so. These are what I would have liked the Harbs to be and then some. Looks like we'll be redecorating 80s style. My wife will be happysideshowbob said:
joel
Painter of Dragons, Maker of Mirrors
The sky didn't fall in on my head, which came as a bit of a surprise.
The speakers are 1.5m cab to cab, and I'm sitting about 2.5m away with another 2m or so of space behind me in an adjoining room with the sliding partition open. The ceiling is 2.6m and reasonably high by Japanese standards.
Rather bizarrely, they sound the same at close range, just with more of everything. Too much, in fact. I should probably turn the volume down a bit first.
They don't do some of the things studio horns do: there isn't the bite and kick on percussion; the spooky reality is not there, or it's a dfferent take on it. Then again, they don't sound terribly cone-like either, and they are a big speaker with a large woofer in a wide baffle in a heroically constructed cabinet...
I think that with more listening - and it's really a pleasure now - the truth will reveal itself.
I have no doubt a big pair of exclusives would show a clean pair of heels to the Yamahas, but there is a basic rightness to the sound nonetheless.
BTW, apparently the strange tripod things in front of the domes are to attenuate driver HF, but are they not also working as waveguides to some degree?
These are the stands that Yamaha produced for the NS1000Ms, the angled part shown can be used slopping up or downwards to change the bass output, in fact there are quite a few different positions you can use them by varying which side they sit on. They are not spiked at all and could probably do with having some spikes, at the bottom at least, I think they're made out of MDF and wigh about 5kg. I don't think they were ever on sale in the UK, I was lucky enough to get them with a pair of Diatones that I bought off a guy who moved over to England from Japan.
