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A thread to catalogue the eloquence, dignity, diplomacy and wisdom of Boris Johnson III

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Tony L said:
You spout this bullshit every time. Please name those who are not Tories who are also not voting tactically against them in marginal seats. Let us see these evil people that haunt your nightmares.

PS As a Brexiter/Brexit apologist you have damaged your beloved Labour far more than anyone else here. As a ‘Gillian Duffy’ you are part of the reason they are now neutered and unable to stand up to right-wing ideology. You helped create the fence of indecision that has destroyed them.
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Typical second paragraph, you know nothing about me. It’s not bullshit, you don’t like the truth is the bottom line. There are hundreds of posts on this forum supporting the undermining of Labour and Corbyn when he was leader of the party. Could even be thousands. You tell me, it’s your forum. You’re an IT wizard so get the data...

I do not support brexit but I’m sure you will carry on making up whatever you like to deflect from the truth that people such as yourself are why we are where we are.
 
Tony L said:
One would hope any with a formal legal background, e.g. Barristers etc, would run a risk of being struck-off for openly supporting/defending Johnson’s criminal behaviour, or at the least have any future legal career tainted.

PS Wolfson’s resignation letter here (Twitter). It’s well worded and hits quite hard.
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Reminds me of the man overboard joke...

A male on a cruise liner falls over the railings mid ocean,
an observer asks why the sharks are swimming away from the desperate fellow rather than attacking him.

A swift retort, "Professional Etiquette" The man is a Barrister!
 
Brian said:
It’s not bullshit, you don’t like the truth is the bottom line. There are hundreds of posts on this forum supporting the undermining of Labour and Corbyn when he was leader of the party. Could even be thousands. You tell me, it’s your forum. You’re an IT wizard so get the data...
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I’m just not a tribalist. I believe one should be able to be critical of all who seek power over us and fully analyse their policy, background and history. I personally find Labour seriously wanting in all areas. That does not mean I would use them as an anti-Tory tactical vote in a key marginal, but I live in a seat where an expenses-fiddling teen sex-tester and paedo-conspiracy-theorist in a red rosette could get elected, and did (now replaced by a more credible if boring replacement).

Basically I don’t need to vote Labour as it is impossible for anything else to win here. As such I can safely vote with my conscience, which is for other less authoritarian/nationalist and more democratic non-Tory alternatives. I will never get representation for my vote, but it will count on the national total. To be honest I don’t even know if there is a Green standing in May, but if not I’ll vote LD, mainly to piss you off! The Tories aren’t contenders here so it is perfectly safe!
 
ks.234 said:
You seem to want to forget the moral question of a chancellor imposing increasing tax rises on the electorate at the same time and reducing his own tax.

Just because it’s legal, don’t make it right.

Profiting from Slavery was legal
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You could tax Sunak at 99%, it would make sod all difference. Actually it would, he’d probably move abroad and pay zero tax at all in the UK.
 
ks.234 said:
You still avoid the moral question. How can a CotE impose tax rises on the electorate while avoiding tax himself and retain any moral integrity?
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How is he avoiding tax? He pays all tax due in the UK and anywhere else it’s due. Same for his missus.
 
Ponty said:
How is he avoiding tax? He pays all tax due in the UK and anywhere else it’s due. Same for his missus.
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I don't think it is a difficult concept that the CofE and his family should pay UK tax on their earnings. They clearly live in the UK and no matter the legal loopholes that he is able to exploit, there is a moral issue at play. Suggesting that vital services cannot be funded, and imposing tax rises, when he is a part of a system that sees 21 trillion pounds sitting in the British territories is just wrong. Britain and its territories are recognised as the global leader in the facilitation of international tax avoidance at a time when we are a nation stricken with inequality and poverty - it is not right, is it?
 
Tony L said:
I’m just not a tribalist. I believe one should be able to be critical of all who seek power over us and fully analyse their policy, background and history. I personally find Labour seriously wanting in all areas. That does not mean I would use them as an anti-Tory tactical vote in a key marginal, but I live in a seat where an expenses-fiddling teen sex-tester and paedo-conspiracy-theorist in a red rosette could get elected, and did (now replaced by a more credible if boring replacement).

Basically I don’t need to vote Labour as it is impossible for anything else to win here. As such I can safely vote with my conscience, which is for other less authoritarian/nationalist and more democratic non-Tory alternatives. I will never get representation for my vote, but it will count on the national total. To be honest I don’t even know if there is a Green standing in May, but if not I’ll vote LD, mainly to piss you off! The Tories aren’t contenders here so it is perfectly safe!
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Canny, but you still don’t get it.

I know Labour is far from perfect but it remains the only realistic opposition to the tories. That’s the bit you don’t seem to grasp, or maybe your priority is different to mine, and despite your words you don’t dislike tory ideology as much as I do.

I am anti tory ideology. That’s it. No apologises for that.

If it was a GE it won’t piss me off if you vote LibDem to stop the tories getting a seat as long as the LibDems don’t jump into bed with them again for a taste of power.
 
Brian said:
Canny, but you still don’t get it.

I know Labour is far from perfect but it remains the only realistic opposition to the tories. That’s the bit you don’t seem to grasp, or maybe your priority is different to mine, and despite your words you don’t dislike tory ideology as much as I do.

I am anti tory ideology. That’s it. No apologises for that.

If it was a GE it won’t piss me off if you vote LibDem to stop the tories getting a seat as long as the LibDems don’t jump into bed with them again for a taste of power.
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Brian, you are absolutely correct. Under the system we have (which both conservative and labour support), the only way you’ll get rid of the tories is by enough people voting labour, unpalatable as though that may sound to many. Any other party is a wasted vote if this is the objective. The SNP have been a massive help in keeping the tories in Westminster.
 
Martin Rowson on Barnacle Boris and Sticky Sunak – cartoon

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https://www.theguardian.com/comment...artin-rowson-barnacle-boris-partygate-cartoon
 
Ponty said:
More noise. As summarised ‘Their use by British residents is entirely legal.’
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Well done. The thing is, as has been made clear several times, we are talking about integrity rather than just legality.

Not understanding what integrity means does seem to be a Tory trait.
 
ks.234 said:
Well done. The thing is, as has been made clear several times, we are talking about integrity rather than just legality.

Not understanding what integrity means does seem to be a Tory trait.
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Integrity doesn’t come into tax, you either owe it or you don’t. As I’ve said, Labour had plenty of time and opportunity to change the rules being questioned, but clearly didn’t see the need.
 
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Ponty said:
Integrity doesn’t come into tax, you either owe it or you don’t.
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I’ll just directly quote from the ever wonderful ‘The Week In Tory’, as you either get it, or you don’t:

“1. Having spent a week insisting there was nothing wrong with avoiding £20 million in tax while being responsible for raising tax, Space Family Sunak have now concluded that for PR purposes their monumental, sickening greed is “not compatible with British fairness”

2. Sunak insisted he should not be associated with his spouse for tax purposes

3. This came as a shock to the rest of us, for whom our spouse’s income affects every personal tax matter, every mortgage application, and all benefits claims

4. But you can’t you expect poor, bewildered Sunak to understand the UK’s rules, especially as it seems he’s spent half his time as chancellor accidentally pledging allegiance to a foreign state for tax purposes, and promising to make USA his forever home

5. Parliamentary rules state MPs must be UK residents for tax purposes, so Sunak broke both MP’s rules and the Ministerial Code, both resigning matters. He didn't resign

6. And then it was revealed Sunak had listed his wealth in the Cayman Islands to avoid even more domestic tax

7. He also failed to list his wife’s £690m stake in Russian businesses in the register of members’ interests, even though the govt of which he is a senior member has given that company multiple contracts, and even though he told us all not to invest in Russia

8. So by Sunday we’d discovered Sunak was chancellor of one country while legally domiciled in another, claimed his wife didn’t pay tax cos she was from a 3rd, got paid by a trust fund in a 4th, and was secretly breaking the rules of his job to give money to a 5th

9. So to prove he's now 100% committed to his job, his nation, and our struggle, he moved out of 11 Downing St and into one of his 4 giant luxury houses

10. Furiously glaring testicle Sajid Javid leaped to Sunak’s defence, saying it would be “morally wrong” not to put up taxes

11. And then Javid admitted he’d spent 20 years as a non-dom avoiding paying those taxes, but there was “nothing immoral” about it

12. He then pressed SHIFT + F5 in his brain, and announced Tories would “tackle aggressive tax avoidance and evasion”, like all the stuff he did”

13. Sunak, laser focussed on what was really pissing us off, decided “divulging the tax status of a private individual is a criminal offence”, and he HATES criminal offences, as we all know

14. So Boris Johnson – yes, Boris Johnson – ordered an ethics inquiry into Sunak”

Copied and pasted from Russ In Cheshire (Twitter).

Whilst very amusingly written this is factually correct (which is what makes it such essential reading). This behaviour is what you are defending here. Willingly going in to bat for crooks, shysters and con-artists.
 
Ponty said:
Integrity doesn’t come into tax, you either owe it or you don’t. As I’ve said, Labour had plenty of time and opportunity to change the rules being questioned, but clearly didn’t see the need.
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integrity very much is what tax avoidance is all about.

“Tax avoidance involves bending the rules of the tax system to try to gain a tax advantage that Parliament never intended.

It often involves contrived, artificial transactions that serve little or no purpose other than to produce this advantage. It involves operating within the letter, but not the spirit, of the law.”
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/tax-avoidance-an-introduction

People with integrity do not “bend the rules”.
 
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