£17,250
- Thread starter JezmondTutu
- Start date
Howdy
pfm Member
Can you please build me one then. I'll even give you 100% margin.
And if that would be true, how come nobody comes up with such simple business idea?
JezmondTutu
pfm Member
I get there has been a major evolution in LP12 design, I don't quite get the best part of 20 grand bit though!
I'm not knocking Linn as I love my LP12, I guess I was surprised more than anything else.
I'm not knocking Linn as I love my LP12, I guess I was surprised more than anything else.
RossB
Former Member
I recently paid rather a lot of money for the top spec LP12, with everything except the Urika (I use a Superline/Supercap) and Kandid (I don't like Lyra Cartridges and use an Ortofon Cadenza Black). It replaced an older LP12 I had foolishly sold a year or two earlier. I realised I couldn't live without an LP12 so bought this one.
Yes, it is expensive, but as a long-term investment it is no worse - and no worse value - than any other expensive piece of hi fi. It probably cost less than I have spent on DACs over the last few years, all of which have been unsatisfying in one respect or another - which the LP12 is not.
And yes, I did try other decks - I owned an Orbe/SME IV and an Ace Spacedeck/Moerch DP6 and found both were colourless, bland and dull compared with the LP12.
Yes, it is expensive, but as a long-term investment it is no worse - and no worse value - than any other expensive piece of hi fi. It probably cost less than I have spent on DACs over the last few years, all of which have been unsatisfying in one respect or another - which the LP12 is not.
And yes, I did try other decks - I owned an Orbe/SME IV and an Ace Spacedeck/Moerch DP6 and found both were colourless, bland and dull compared with the LP12.
Mullardman
Moderately extreme...
Put it this way. The LP 12 is and always was essentially a fruit box with a whole shedload of issues. ( I had one.. LP12/Cirkus/Lingo1) for many years.
Suspension drift.
Suspension affected by belt tension.
Tone arm cable affecting suspension necessitating the whole mythology around the 'P-clip'
Motor issues.
Top plate mounting screws coming loose in plinth
Etc., etc.
It was, IMHO, a pretty crude (and pirated) design, which needed constant upgrades to sort out its issues. On the upside it is physically compact, tidy and a bit of a 'looker'.
Even Ivor himself admitted that if he was starting again, he would go with a Direct Drive TT.
Linn is a company built on the re-packaging and clever marketing of existing stuff.
Linn speakers such as Kan and 'Barik were built from KEF drivers.
I have a good friend who has had a 'Linn' for decades. Like Trigger's Broom, it now has nothing of the original left. (Possibly the lid.. I'll have to check)
Think what this actually means... At least Trigger presumably replaced numerous broom heads and handles with identical bits.
With the LP 12, every single component has been 'upgraded'. IOW, every single component was in some way wrong to start with.
TTs such as the SME (and indeed my Gyro SE) have no such issues.
Mull
RossB
Former Member
... other than not sounding as good.
david ellwood
Kirabosi Kognoscente
An original unupgraded 30 year old LP12 still
murders a gyrodek.
murders a gyrodek.
JezmondTutu
pfm Member
Good to hear Ross!
JezmondTutu
pfm Member
Clearly there has been a major evolution in terms of the LP12's design, but my motor unit is largely untouched since I bought it in 1989; it sounds superb in my opinion.
Dougunn
pfm Member
Is that what they cost now!!!!
I left the Linn fold years back; today they are lifestyle products with price based on brand and perceived value - integrity lost.
D
Mullardman
Moderately extreme...
Obviously an opinion. Not a fact.
More opinion.
If you want my opinion, and let's face it you won't because you clearly have bought into the Linn faith..
The Gyro has little or no sound of its own. What you hear is the sound of your arm/cartridge/phono stage combination.
The Linn is a very coloured, resonant device and much of the constant upgrading has been intended to try to 'design out' these issues, but they are are incurable without effectively producing a different deck, which is what tghe latest and ludicrously expensive LP12 is. Mike whatsisname ( designer of the superb Alphason Sonata etc.) once told me that the Linn has a clear and measurable 'reverb'. I'd take his word over the Linn Priesthood any day.
Mull
TPA
Trade: Tiger Paw
I doubt that many people are familiar with the latest SE spec version of the deck, it's a very different animal to other versions. I can only really compare it's signature against a good streamer but it's a very far cry from a Valhalla/Ittok or Lingo deck thats for sure.
I remember when digital first started and the balance between sources was often quite marked, today a high spec LP12 has a very similar balance, that says a lot about how the resolution and accuracy of the player has improved.
Anyway, it doesn't really matter, people should just use whatever floats their boat for whatever reason. Some people spend that sort of money on cables, good luck to them. All replay systems are compromises so just choose your flavour to suit your budget and preferences.
Aside from which I don't think Linn have ever set their stall out to be a budget outfit.
I remember when digital first started and the balance between sources was often quite marked, today a high spec LP12 has a very similar balance, that says a lot about how the resolution and accuracy of the player has improved.
Anyway, it doesn't really matter, people should just use whatever floats their boat for whatever reason. Some people spend that sort of money on cables, good luck to them. All replay systems are compromises so just choose your flavour to suit your budget and preferences.
Aside from which I don't think Linn have ever set their stall out to be a budget outfit.
gary yeowell
pfm Member
Agreed.
Darth Vader
From the Dark Side
This is true and since its birth from the ashes of the TD150 and RD11 has only been tweaked in order to try and address the design flaws. Linn has made no effort in 44 years to design a better turntable.
Its as if the Rover 2000 was still being made with only tweaks added to try and improve performance and handling. Then charging the price of a 911.
Cheers,
DV
SteveS1
I heard that, pardon?
Good post. I think the shock value is the cost for a front end, I don't think it matters what or who by. I couldn't conceive of one that is worth £17k, my experience of DR in this game is bad enough for me to think that it's unlikely to tilt my 'worth it' meter. But that's the fun, we all have different ways of skinning the 'music in the home' rabbit.
Suffolk Tony
Aim low, achieve your goals, avoid disappointment.
I find it quite hilarious that people could ever brand an LP12 as a "Lifestyle" product. It's hardly an eye-catching piece of kit, is it? My old warhorse has undergone lots of grades over the centuries and bears no resemblance to the original one I bought back in the seventies. Sounds bloody good though and IMO I've not heard better.
James
Lord of the Erg\o/s
I think TPA mentioned the 911 first, and you could say there is so much fundamentally wrong with hanging the engine behind the rear wheels with the classic Porsche. But no one will deny that a modern 911 is a thoroughly great drive and much better that the original. Whether it or the latest Linn is worth their respective asking prices is up to the buyer/beholder.
I like my LP12 and a gently used 911 is still on my wish list.