Windows 11 has arrived

[Jim Audiomisc]

I think the time is fast coming when I will finally part company with MS Windows. I've been saying this to myself ever since support for Windows XP was withdrawn, but as a basic home user I really can't see the point of it any more. Each successive iteration since XP has just been ever more bloated random sh1tware. Apart from my dual boot desk top PC on which I mostly use Linux Mint anyway, I hardly use Windows any more, and my other devices are all Chrome and Android. I still find it amazing that after 27 years Microsoft still can't produce a nice, tidy, user friendly and intuitive operating system.

I guess I was lucky as my working environment, etc, never meant I had to use Windows for everything. I've not used it for decades. And before that only when there was no choice. So far as I can see, they assume everyone else is working for them and can be milked at regular intervals. No doubt that also suits some hardware makers as they can flog new boxes.

 

[clivem2]

It sounds like Microsoft have learnt from Apple. Find ways to make recent kit out of date. As Gary said, the result of the outcry will probably be that Windows 10 will be supported past 2025.

 

[Funk]

I rather prefer the comprehensive old Control Panel over the newer 'Fisher Price' options. In fact I went as far as to re-add it to the Start button right-click context menu.

It does make me chuckle that MS said "Win10 is the final edition of Windows, there will be no more - this one will just evolve..."

 

[Craig B]

It sounds like Microsoft have learnt from Apple. Find ways to make recent kit out of date. As Gary said, the result of the outcry will probably be that Windows 10 will be supported past 2025.

Microsoft's record is still far better than Apple's here. I find the planned obsolescence side especially disappointing with Apple, as they are in control of all, including the 3rd party Apple compatible app market to a certain degree.

With the release of macOS 12 Monterey, there will have been 19 OS X/macOS operating systems in 21 years (not including OS X Public Beta* or 'Server' versions of some), with support only ever going two prior OS versions back, which these days means one is lucky to get 3 supported years out of a given macOS version; all the more disappointing when a given version becomes the last that supports one's hardware.

* OS X Public Beta ran from Sept 13, 2000 to May 15, 2001 whereupon it ceased to function. The funny part is that Jobs managed to persuade Mac users to part with 30 bucks to become beta testers of an OS that lasted 7 months before bricking itself. 'What do you want for $29.95?'

 

[Tony L]

The more I look at it the more I suspect W11 is a loss-leader/troll for the W365 subscription model. That is unquestionably the preferred direction of travel for so many large corporate IT companies these days. In some ways it can be viewed as full-circle back to the days of those wonderful huge IBM mainframes where companies paid a fortune to get it installed but never really owned it as only IBM were allowed to carry out system upgrades and most servicing procedures and there was a massive monthly lease, service charge etc. I caught the tail end of this with AS/400s, which are far more boring than the ‘60s and ‘70s monster mainframes, in many ways that lease and service contract model remained. With the whole Right To Repair argument the spotlight is being shone on this again and just how far things have shifted away from conventional ownership, right to do as you please with an item. Tesla being a very interesting case study, another thing where you pay the full purchase price but don’t really do anything but lease the technology on their terms. The irony is Microsoft was in many ways born out of being a reaction to IBM’s closed business model and opening up the market right up. Now I guess they’ve seen Apple etc drag it backwards and want some of it.

PS FWIW I do think cloud services and servers are the future. Especially now quantum computing etc is coming on line. Thin clients have been touted since I was installing Citrix servers 20 years ago, but it was just crap back then (I used to pronounce it Shitrix), just so slow and laggy as the network infrastructure of the time didn’t have bandwidth and the servers didn’t have the grunt. A whole world has changed since then and I’d put money on this being the next conceptual shift. Cloud based quantum power displayed lag-free on your iPad or whatever.

 

[garyi]

Microsoft's record is still far better than Apple's here. I find the planned obsolescence side especially disappointing with Apple, as they are in control of all, including the 3rd party Apple compatible app market to a certain degree.

With the release of macOS 12 Monterey, there will have been 19 OS X/macOS operating systems in 21 years (not including OS X Public Beta* or 'Server' versions of some), with support only ever going two prior OS versions back, which these days means one is lucky to get 3 supported years out of a given macOS version; all the more disappointing when a given version becomes the last that supports one's hardware.

* OS X Public Beta ran from Sept 13, 2000 to May 15, 2001 whereupon it ceased to function. The funny part is that Job's managed to persuade Mac users to part with 30 bucks to become beta testers of an OS that lasted 7 months before bricking itself. 'What do you want for $29.95?'

Not defending apple here but your reasoning is not quite right. All of these versions have basically been iterations of OSX 10, they are not fundamental changes and upgrading is usually pretty painless. And they will go on macs way more than 2 years old. They want you on the latest version and its 'free.'

 

[gintonic]

Especially now quantum computing etc is coming on line.

it is decades away from being commercialised for services. It is barely out of the lab...

 

[Tony L]

it is decades away from being commercialised for services. It is barely out of the lab...

It seems to be moving quite fast now. Way over my head/pay grade, but both Google and IBM seem to have stuff functioning now. I had a very interesting chat with some random passer by at the museum a few weeks ago who turned out to be highly knowledgeable and he tried explaining the basics to me (which was a tough job!). It is fascinating stuff, just bewilderingly complex to someone like me who never really made the jump from procedural languages and early 8 & 16 bit hardware conceptually. I’m sure some very interesting stuff is ahead, and not that far ahead.

The Explaining Computers chap had an update a while back too.

PS I was rather pleased to see IBM still in the game!

 

[Craig B]

Not defending apple here but your reasoning is not quite right. All of these versions have basically been iterations of OSX 10, they are not fundamental changes and upgrading is usually pretty painless. And they will go on macs way more than 2 years old. They want you on the latest version and its 'free.'

I'm not sure what your definition of 'iterations' is, Gary.

The first half dozen OS X releases were 32-bit PowerPC only. Then there were a couple of 32-bit/64-bit PowerPC only ones, followed closely by the hybrid 32-bit/64-bit PowerPC/Intel Tiger/Leopard years. And, finally, we come to the Intel only collection, bringing with 'true' 64-bit down to the core with Snow Leopard 10.6 having a 64-bit capable kernel (10.7 Lion was the first fully 64-bit architecture, hence, why 32-bit processor Intel Macs stop at Snow Leopard).

I'd say there were some major changes along the way, there. Many of which required new hardware, so slightly less than 'painless'.

Perhaps you were referring to from 10.9 Mavericks on, as you did mentioned 'free'.

 

[Darth Vader]

I'm not sure what your definition of 'iterations' is, Gary.

The first half dozen OS X releases were 32-bit PowerPC only. Then there were a couple of 32-bit/64-bit PowerPC only ones, followed closely by the hybrid 32-bit/64-bit PowerPC/Intel Tiger/Leopard years, and finally, the Intel only collection, bringing with 'true' 64-bit down to the core with Snow Leopard 10.6 having a 64-bit capable kernel (10.7 Lion was the first fully 64-bit architecture, hence, why 32-bit processor Intel Macs stop at Snow Leopard).

I'd say there were some major changes along the way, there. Many of which required new hardware, so slightly less than 'painless'.

Perhaps you were referring to from 10.9 Mavericks on, as you did mentioned 'free'.

Yes its easy to forget that Windows up to 8.0 and OS X 10.8 were paid for upgrades and only became 'free' after those releases. Win 8.0 was another Vista-like moment and M$ quickly released 8.1 as a free upgrade.

Those were the days,

DV

 

[Darth Vader]

A very large number of Windows applications can be run under Linux. I don't use Windows nor macOS as an everyday O/S but just for familiarisation (and as a backup) so that I can help and fix peoples computers - for free and for fun.

I can run Win 98 games under Linux that don't run under Win 10.

I'm nuts,

DV

 

[Seeker_UK]

it is decades away from being commercialised for services. It is barely out of the lab...

Quantum computing has always been at least a decade away.

 

[gintonic]

Quantum computing has always been at least a decade away.

I know, the one person we have left that teaches it and supervises a couple of PhD students continues to tell me

 

[Bananahead]

If you mean support and manage remote users then that has been in place for more than 20 years especially for large corporations with thousands of computers to support. The only time you had to visit support in person was if you really screwed up your computer or more usually for new hardware refresh.

Cheers,

DV

I don't. I mean if you have a physical machine at work then how do you work-from-home?

 

[davidsrsb]

I don't. I mean if you have a physical machine at work then how do you work-from-home?

Most of us lug a laptop to and fro and have big monitors at both locations

 

[garyi]

I don't. I mean if you have a physical machine at work then how do you work-from-home?

We have a couple doing that now, via VPN it works but its not a fun time.

 

[Bananahead]

So it is painful.

And very 2010.

 

[Sue Pertwee-Tyr]

We have a couple doing that now, via VPN it works but its not a fun time.

We have c600 people doing it currently, and at peak lockdown all 800+ of us were working remotely. We use a VPN, and all have either MS laptops or Surface tablets. If the VPN isn't working well, that might be because your office hasn't committed the necessary resources/funds to configuring it how it needs to be. Ours was a bit flaky at first (not enough user licences as the use case was based on 80% office-based) but is now, dare I say it, proving pretty reliable and functionality is pretty much as it would be in the office.

 

[garyi]

The guys using it for us are trying to run Adobe apps. Its all fun and games for word, but not for indesign! I think over the period they have picked up lap tops

 

[Cesare]

The guys using it for us are trying to run Adobe apps. Its all fun and games for word, but not for indesign! I think over the period they have picked up lap tops

Yes, I think that's the key. Basically remote desktop works well when there is little data going back and forth, but if you need to rotate a 3d design around in realtime you aren't going to enjoy the RDC experience.

I worked somewhere where they had a fancy KVM over IP setup, so the previous workstations were replaced by blades in a C9000 cabinet, and this worked surprisingly well. Some people had local blades, some remote, depending on their work, and even though they had high gigabit links to the datacentre, the latency made some stuff for the remote blades hard. There was a tradeoff though, if the dataset you were working on was at the remote site, then you had either a laggy GUI but working with the dataset was fast, or a responsive GUI but slow data access.