Colin Barron
pfm Member
How would security, currency and subsidies operate for the independent Scotland, NI and Wales.
Should England hold a referendum to leave the UK, leaving Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland
- Thread starter ff1d1l
- Start date
ff1d1l
pfm Member
You've got this wrong, totally misreading the situation. Assuming England voted to leave the UK....
What currency, security and regimen of subsidies would England adopt after leaving the UK, which would stay in the EU, but minus England.
Michael J
pfm Member
Who is misreading what? UK currency is provided by the Bank of England. All coin is minted by the Bank of England. Various Scottish banks' promissory notes are only legally valid in Scotland under Scottish law, the same is true of Northern Ireland's notes, and Wales has no currency of its own.
ff1d1l
pfm Member
Detail. It is UK currency, as you said, and would stay with the UK.
glancaster
In the silicon vale
I voted No, because the UK democratic system is ill-prepared for referendums. At the very least, we should hold no further ones until we learn the lessons of the last few.
Rockmeister
pfm Member
Well, most. Some would be quietly 'discouraged' late one night in Glasgow alleyway
"Yeah let the English have a referendum if they want one. The 'Little Englander' Tories that want Brexit are quite happy to let the Scots go and see the union break up if it means they can have their dream."
What convoluted thinking. As I understood it the Little Englander Tories as you put it do not want a Referendum they just want to have Brexit done and dusted. It is the Remoaners who want a Referendum in the hope that the majority of people will change their minds and vote THIS time to remain in the EU.
The SNP want to remain in the EU but at the same time irrespective of whether we do or do not they want to leave the UK as well.
Would I be right in thinking that you have been living in a darkened cave in Ethiopia for the last three years and not had access to PFM?
What convoluted thinking. As I understood it the Little Englander Tories as you put it do not want a Referendum they just want to have Brexit done and dusted. It is the Remoaners who want a Referendum in the hope that the majority of people will change their minds and vote THIS time to remain in the EU.
The SNP want to remain in the EU but at the same time irrespective of whether we do or do not they want to leave the UK as well.
Would I be right in thinking that you have been living in a darkened cave in Ethiopia for the last three years and not had access to PFM?
Michael J
pfm Member
It does not say GBP on the notes.
ff1d1l
pfm Member
Thats right. Nevertheless, that is how the currency is viewed internationally. Do you want to still maintain that the pound is not the currency of the UK? Because if so get on with it, but I'm out...better things to do.
Michael J
pfm Member
I refer the honourable gentleman to the reply I gave some moments ago.
Play semantics all you want, you make a fool of yourself. GBP is the same as a stock market ticker symbol, UKP would be more appropriate. Is there a company called AAPL? The ONLY internationally recognised and acceptable "version" of the pound is Bank of England pound sterling.
ff1d1l
pfm Member
The thinking here is the remain voting Scots are having leave foisted on them by an England who, for predominantly xenophobic reasons have gone along with a coup engineered by those in the upper echelons of power in England who will profit from brexit. Preferably a leave brexit as the possibilities for exploitation of the situation by disaster capitalist, and de regulators are going to give the biggest yield. Not called the canny Scots for nothing, the population north of the border have been wise to this from the off, and are seething at ENGLAND doing this to them without their national consent.
This is the issue. This is why there is now a majority in Scotland in favour of leave.
I'm absolutely certain that England leaving the UK and Scotland staying, with Wales and NI, in the EU, would render any Scottish independance referendum redundant. England is the problem, not the rest of the UK.
ff1d1l
pfm Member
And neither does it say English pound legal tender in England only.
And calling it UKP - UK pound - advances your argument? You're arguing that the the UK currency is in fact English, and the other three countries do not have a currency? Er, yeah.
Personally, I'd have no objection to adopting the Euro. At least if we'd done that after the ref money in my pocket would be worth a fifth or so more in real terms - well, compared to the pound against other world currencies. But saying that doesn't concede that the pound is English, and that if Little England sodded off, it could necessarily take it with them.
If Brexit does not happen and I must confess I do not think it will especially after the next GE due to a lack of a clear majority by the Tories and other Brexiteers the SNP will still want to leave the Union. It suits their purpose at the moment to use the issue of Brexit as a reason for a push for Independence. This disingenuous argument hides their true intent and feelings. They hate the English and the perceived lack of 'fairness' when devolving power and tax revenue.
glancaster
In the silicon vale
The Bank of England, and various banks in Scotland, Northern Ireland, and elsewhere, all print pound sterling banknotes of various, sometimes beautiful, designs. Of those printed in the four home nations, only the Bank of England notes are legal tender anywhere, and only in England and Wales.
In Scotland and Northern Ireland, the true but bizarre situation is that there is no legal tender whatsoever. In practice, this is not usually a problem: if you want to get paid, you need to accept various conventional forms of payment. For tricky legal cases, Scotland has a rule that any 'reasonable offer' of payment of a debt cannot be refused.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banknotes_of_the_pound_sterling
Kind regards
- Garry
In Scotland and Northern Ireland, the true but bizarre situation is that there is no legal tender whatsoever. In practice, this is not usually a problem: if you want to get paid, you need to accept various conventional forms of payment. For tricky legal cases, Scotland has a rule that any 'reasonable offer' of payment of a debt cannot be refused.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banknotes_of_the_pound_sterling
Kind regards
- Garry
Michael J
pfm Member
Bank of England money, the pound sterling, is legal tender throughout the whole UK and all overseas territories and dependencies, etc., unlike ALL other variants which are ALL only legal tender within their own respective territories and possibly not even there.
I did not call it UKP, I merely pointed out that symbolic labels are not the things to which they are applied. You are barking madly at trees of your own planting.
It is a fact that you do not have to like but is nonetheless true due, in Scotland, to the historical ineptitude of Scottish bankers some two hundred years ago, and for other reasons in the other regions of the UK.
Michael J
pfm Member
There is... one and two pound coins are legal tender in any quantity.