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Homelessness

darrenyeats said:
I agree totally, possession and use of drugs should not be a criminal matter, it's a health and social issue. In this regard I think we should treat all drugs a little bit like we do alcohol and tobacco.
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Problem being, anyone purchasing drugs is aiding & abetting the continued drug & sex slave trade, you makes your choices in life.
I don't need to rob, or kill my neighbor to fuel my smoking habit.
Until the possession of drugs becomes legal, the crime lords will benefit from anyone possessing or using drugs.
 
Tony L said:
Actually they don’t. If you do the research you find Democrats/Labour preside over stronger economic performance than Republican/Conservative. There are many graphs and charts that can be googled up to prove this!
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Your opinion, or fact? Research?

Please don’ t adopt such a patronising tone thank you

My take is the exact opposite....( actually ! )

Where is your “proof”?


Your implication that Left Wing poliicies and their followers are intellectually superior is given the lie by the very existence of JC as their current champion ( apart from reeking of extreme arrogance )

I would challenge even the most devout Left Winger to justify the claim that JC displays any form of intellect to speak of

His approach is pure populism comparable with that of Farage and Trump

The real worry is how many voters seem ti be fooled by his false promises
Simon
 
Simon. You ARE in denial. Every measure shows that rates of homelessness, rough sleeping, families in totally unsuitable temporary accomodation etc., have increased hugely under the current administration and the coalition before that.
You ask which policy? Well I could be flippant and say 'the policy of not giving a flying f*** about ordinary people', but whilst it is obvious that is the predominant attitude within Govt, I accept it's not a 'policy'.

However, the cumulative effects of both punitive changes to benefits, the long term decline in the availablity of social housing ( Thatcher.. 'Right to Buy' ..restrictions nf building by Local Authorities) the deliberate creation of a low wage 'gig' economy and other effects of 'austerity' and the policy of blaming the victim, have clearly pushed many of the least resourced individuals and families outside the market for decent, affordable housing. Of course, outside of the deliberate and active policy decisions, there is also the cruelly passive failure to act.. as if somehow the problem, or the victims of it.. will go away.

But, let's just assume for a moment that I am completely wrong and that the housing /homeless issue is not in any way related to a combination of both long and short term Tory policy. Then what do you suggest is the cause..? More importantly, what do you suggest is the solution and why are your beloved Tories not implementing it?
 
Simon Vess said:
Your opinion, or fact? Research?

Please don’ t adopt such a patronising tone thank you

My take is the exact opposite....( actually ! )

Where is your “proof”?


Your implication that Left Wing poliicies and their followers are intellectually superior is given the lie by the very existence of JC as their current champion ( apart from reeking of extreme arrogance )

I would challenge even the most devout Left Winger to justify the claim that JC displays any form of intellect to speak of

His approach is pure populism comparable with that of Farage and Trump

The real worry is how many voters seem ti be fooled by his false promises
Simon
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It doesn't take a plethora of graphs etc., to demonstrate that social housing, the NHS and many other beneficial outcomes of Govt policy were introduced by the left, and furiously opposed by the right. Instead of feigning insult, you might be better occupied educating yourself as to the realities.
 
Simon Vess said:
Your opinion, or fact? Research?

Please don’ t adopt such a patronising tone thank you

My take is the exact opposite....( actually ! )

Where is your “proof”?


Your implication that Left Wing poliicies and their followers are intellectually superior is given the lie by the very existence of JC as their current champion ( apart from reeking of extreme arrogance )

I would challenge even the most devout Left Winger to justify the claim that JC displays any form of intellect to speak of

His approach is pure populism comparable with that of Farage and Trump

The real worry is how many voters seem ti be fooled by his false promises
Simon
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The real worry is how many people have been brainwashed by four decades of neoliberal economic dogma into believing "there is no alternative".

Leaders don't necessarily need intellect, as long as they have a good team around them.

Leaders do need to have vision and the ability to inspire other people to work towards it. Love him or loathe him, Corbyn has that. In contrast the current Tory Party is intellectually hollow and rudderless, in policy terms.

As for homelessness and rough sleeping, the evidence is all around us. I've lived in Sheffield for 15 years and I can't remember ever seeing so many people begging on the streets (yes, I know, they're all millionaires really). Any number of studies show the homelessness is on the rise:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-soared-under-the-conservatives-a7198966.html

The rise in homelessness under the Tories is empirically demonstrable. It's also a predictable consequence of benefits cuts, a punitive sanctions regime, the "bedroom tax" and so on.

So I'm going to work on the hypothesis that Tory policies have led to an increase in homelessness until someone can persuade me otherwise.

Also, since Tory policies have led to greater homelessness, more child poverty, more people dying as the NHS is starved of funds etc *and* the Tories continue to pursue those policies I'm going to work on the assumption that the vast majority of Tory MPs and some Tory voters lack compassion.
 
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Simon Vess said:
I would challenge even the most devout Left Winger to justify the claim that JC displays any form of intellect to speak of

His approach is pure populism comparable with that of Farage and Trump
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LOL. May I bring to your attention Theresa May and her various preset wooden slogans and chants, the utter sub-bovine stupidity of the Brexit “negotiating” team of David Davis, Disgraced Former Defence Minister Liam Fox and king of Trumpian popularism Boris Johnson. This shower of incompetent double-talking shite make anyone look intellectual by comparison, and I haven’t even mentioned the clearly inbred absurdity that is Jacob Rees-Mogg and likely your next leader!

I’m not a Labour voter so I’m not really looking to defend them, but come on, anything looks good against a bunch of grasping imbeciles and trough-feeders who have crashed 20% off Stirling, had the national credit rating downgraded twice (the first time being the first in history), made homelessness and foodbanks the new normal for many thousands and to top it all removed our future trade links with our nearest foreign economic partners setting us up for decades of decline, and all for a short term electoral gain as they were scared of a seat-less pressure group headed by a few far-right tax-exile spivs. I’m sorry, but I’m amazed anyone claiming to be intelligent would seek to defend such a catastrophically piss-poor record!
 
Mullardman said:
Simon. You ARE in denial. Every measure shows that rates of homelessness, rough sleeping, families in totally unsuitable temporary accomodation etc., have increased hugely under the current administration and the coalition before that.
You ask which policy? Well I could be flippant and say 'the policy of not giving a flying f*** about ordinary people', but whilst it is obvious that is the predominant attitude within Govt, I accept it's not a 'policy'.

However, the cumulative effects of both punitive changes to benefits, the long term decline in the availablity of social housing ( Thatcher.. 'Right to Buy' ..restrictions nf building by Local Authorities) the deliberate creation of a low wage 'gig' economy and other effects of 'austerity' and the policy of blaming the victim, have clearly pushed many of the least resourced individuals and families outside the market for decent, affordable housing. Of course, outside of the deliberate and active policy decisions, there is also the cruelly passive failure to act.. as if somehow the problem, or the victims of it.. will go away.

But, let's just assume for a moment that I am completely wrong and that the housing /homeless issue is not in any way related to a combination of both long and short term Tory policy. Then what do you suggest is the cause..? More importantly, what do you suggest is the solution and why are your beloved Tories not implementing it?
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Just a couple of points:

1 rather a large number of wild assertions and use of judgemental phrases that really dont stand up to scrutiny presented in your usual intemperate style?

Try adopting a more thoughtful approach instead of spraying abuse around

2 why do you refer to “ your beloved Tories” ? another example of your flamboyant wild assertions that simply reek of sour grapes.As it happens i am no lover of the Tories, and I aldo believe that JC is utterly sincere ( more is the worry!)

Simon
 
Tony L said:
LOL. May I bring to your attention Theresa May and her various preset wooden slogans and chants, the utter sub-bovine stupidity of the Brexit “negotiating” team of David Davis, Disgraced Former Defence Minister Liam Fox and king of Trumpian popularism Boris Johnson. This shower of incompetent double-talking shite make anyone look intellectual by comparison, and I haven’t even mentioned the clearly inbred absurdity that is Jacob Rees-Mogg that is likely your next leader!

I’m not a Labour voter so I’m not really looking to defend them, but come on, anything looks good against a bunch of grasping imbeciles and trough-feeders who have crashed 20% off Stirling, had the national credit rating downgraded twice (the first time being the first in history), made homelessness and foodbanks the new normal for many thousands and to top it all removed our future trade links with our nearest foreign economic partners setting us up for decades of decline, and all for a short term electoral gain as they were scared of a seat-less pressure group headed by a few far-right tax-exile spivs. I’m sorry, but you are clearly somewhat intellectually disadvantaged yourself if you would seek to defend such a catastrophically piss-poor record!
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I am 100% with you on Brexit and the likes of Davis, Fox and Johnson ( who i detest)

But the policies espoused by JC have been tried and tested and simply do not add up


My take on the Labour administrations over the last 50years is one of inheriting an economy with all the parameters moving in the right direction, but leaving office with said economy in a mess - Labour’s current offer looks as if it would repeat that pattern big time

FWIIW i have voted for both Labour and Tory over my lifetime

In fact probably more times for Labour

I tend to vote for leaders who I feel I can trust to mske good decisuons rather than adhering to any ideology

Simon
 
So you are one of those Fantasy Islanders who blame Labour for the Neo Con driven INTERNATIONAL banking crisis which Brown was bringing about a recovery from until the Tories accidentally got into power?
 
Simon Vess said:
I am 100% with you on Brexit and the likes of Davis, Fox and Johnson ( who i detest)

But the policies espoused by JC have been tried and tested and simply do not add up


My take on the Labour administrations over the last 50years is one of inheriting an economy with all the parameters moving in the right direction, but leaving office with said economy in a mess Labour’ current offer looks as if it would reprat that pattern big time

Simon
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And yet...

http://www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/...-created-two-thirds-of-the-uks-national-debt/

Murphy also has good ideas about closing tax loopholes and tax reform generally. He has been a significant influence on Corbyn's team (although he fell out rather publicly with Corbyn about a year ago - ironically because he didn't think the Labour Party was being nearly ambitious enough).
 
Simon Vess said:
My take on the Labour administrations over the last 50years is one of inheriting an economy with all the parameters moving in the right direction, but leaving office with said economy in a mess Labour’ current offer looks as if it would reprat that pattern big time
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Not my view. US led global financial collapse of 2008 aside (and Iraq, obviously) I think Blair/Brown did a very reasonable job. I disagree with certain aspects, e.g. I would have preferred they borrow for proper state investment rather than the PFI scams etc, but on the whole it was a buoyant healthy economy with a lot of resources invested in infrastructure. A whole world of difference to the boom/bust north/south divide of Thatcherism, which was my introduction to the employment market and politics (I was old enough to vote against her second term).

PS I except the 2008 global financial collapse as every time financial services regulation came up the Tories argued for even less, i.e. the wheels would have come off a lot worse had they been in power. There is also no credible argument that the Tories would have saved suitable a buffer either as history proves otherwise (they always squander any excess on tax cuts for their wealthy backers) and the scale of this collapse was historically unprecedented anyway. I certainly do not hold Labour responsible for the obvious criminality occurring in Republican America.
 
I work in Deansgate, Manchester. Definitely been stepping up a lot in recent months & years. Worst I've seen & I've been working around here (public transport commuter) for 15yrs.
 
Simon Vess said:
Just a couple of points:

1 rather a large number of wild assertions and use of judgemental phrases that really dont stand up to scrutiny presented in your usual intemperate style?

Try adopting a more thoughtful approach instead of spraying abuse around

2 why do you refer to “ your beloved Tories” ? another example of your flamboyant wild assertions that simply reek of sour grapes.As it happens i am no lover of the Tories, and I aldo believe that JC is utterly sincere ( more is the worry!)

Simon
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Says the poster who hurls abuse and denigration at my every post and accuses Corbyn of lacking intellect? You are truly a one off..

Is it too much to hope that you might actually acknowledge the housing issue and suggest some possible remedies...or are you just content to poo poo everybody else's views?
 
Simon Vess said:
And the Guardian is hardly polically neutral...the Daily Mail of the Left
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Utter stool water.
The Graun' doesn't have a proprietor controlling which/how stories are reported, and the DM regularly cooks up stories.
 
Mullardman said:
BBC Lunchtime news. Just now.. Public Accounts Committee report describes Tory Govt housing policy as 'An abject failure'.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42421583

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2017/dec/20/mps-condemn-abject-failure-of-homelessness-policy

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-failure-to-tackle-homelessness-a8119206.html

http://www.parliament.uk/business/c...7/homeless-households-report-published-17-19/
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Mull, in my experience, the people who shout loudest for "evidence" go very quiet when you provide it.

Meanwhile, Channel 4 have been doing a great job this week of exploring homelessness and telling the stories of people who are homeless:


As long as the Tories are in power there will be more tragic cases like this. The idea that Labour will be "just as bad" or "wreck the economy" is just a lie people tell themselves so they can sleep at night.
 
I work in Manchester. The homeless situation is terrible.

The companies who run the office buildings around Piccadilly Station have suggested people may wish to download an app from https://streetsupport.net/ which will allow you to direct people to help. Essentially they wish to discourage us from giving them money as we then encourage more people to beg nearby. The building staff have started wearing body cameras to document the abuse they get from the homeless when trying to move them on from buildings and private squares (and no doubt stop their own employees from being too forceful). GMP are apparently not responding to requests for help - which you can understand given their own resourcing issues.
 
Arkless Electronics said:
If Corbyn gets in I expect him to be the best PM the country has ever had.
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Again, could not agree more, this country needs a complete turnaround politically, this man could provide it if given the chance.
When you have a government with zero interest in ordinary folk, it's going to fail.

You see, the Tory mindset of work pays is fine & dandy for outing the scum who scam the system (a tiny percentage BTW), unfortunately it gives little or no leeway to those suffering, do they care, not a chance.
 
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