Mytek Brooklyn DAC

[Werner]

IIRC so does the benchmark

https://benchmarkmedia.com/blogs/ap...audio-myth-switching-power-supplies-are-noisy

As a breed cheap SMPS wall warts are noisy, have their noise in the audio band (and have it moving around to boot), and, to put a cherry on top of it, connect their output ground via a capacitor directly to mains.

This tends to be nasty.

However, once you design an SMPS as a machine for most efficiently delivering power from the mains to a specific load, and with a specific output noise signature, things become vastly more interesting (and complex), and miracles can be performed.

 

[darrenyeats]

What is your suggestion for the best method to determine if there really are audible differences?

We punters can't determine audibility with any rigour that would be called scientific, with amateur listening tests blind or otherwise. Blind listening puts the sighted listening into context, and I recommend it.

 

[cooky1257]

Dealers eh, you gotta love they way they plant your joyful purchase with seeds of nagging dissatisfaction.

 

[Purité Audio]

The Mytek measures superbly well.
http://www.stereophile.com/content/...ne-amplifier-measurements#rmLr6cotHH0LSpL1.97

Keith

 

[radamel]

Dealers eh, you gotta love they way they plant your joyful purchase with seeds of nagging dissatisfaction.

Thankfully not all dealers are created equal.

 

[JTC]

Wee update: very happy. It's a league beyond what I got from MDAC L2 Toy. The only downside I have discovered is that it doesn't seem to work with my SBT via USB and the EDO mod. Bizarelly, it plays at twice the speed. I can recognise the music, but it's all sped up and strange sounding. Maybe I need to tweak a setting somewhere. Doesn't matter - it's sublime with coax digital from the SBT.

And, wow, you should hear the Stax fed from the Brooklyn. Phenomenal!

 

[Joe P]

I look at it this way -- it's a hobby, not a clinical trial. The cost of making the wrong choice is one that I can live with. I'm not against blind listening or relying on objective measurements, either to underpin sighted listening results or to understand why a piece of kit sounds a certain way, but it's just consumer electronics.

Joe

 

[Purité Audio]

Sounds like the sample rate isn't being recognised , can you re set to 44.1?
Keith

 

[JTC]

Sounds like the sample rate isn't being recognised , can you re set to 44.1?
Keith

Not sure, Keith. I would assume so, but I'd have thought it would do this kind of thing for me automatically. I've got it running via Coax right now, no problems, but I think when it was on USB it read 32bit and I think it got the same rate right (at least on the display).

 

[Purité Audio]

It's probably not bit depth but sampling rate , what is the SBT set to?
Keith

 

[Julf]

The only downside I have discovered is that it doesn't seem to work with my SBT via USB and the EDO mod. Bizarelly, it plays at twice the speed. I can recognise the music, but it's all sped up and strange sounding. Maybe I need to tweak a setting somewhere.

I assume you have asked on the squeezebox forums?

 

[Julf]

I look at it this way -- it's a hobby, not a clinical trial. The cost of making the wrong choice is one that I can live with. I'm not against blind listening or relying on objective measurements, either to underpin sighted listening results or to understand why a piece of kit sounds a certain way, but it's just consumer electronics.

I totally agree. Double-blind listening tests only enter the picture when someone state that they *know* they can hear a difference - prompting the question "how do you know?".

 

[JTC]

I assume you have asked on the squeezebox forums?

Not yet.

 

[JTC]

It's probably not bit depth but sampling rate , what is the SBT set to?
Keith

I haven't changed any settings, so I assume it is picking the rate of the track - in this case it was a 16/44.1, FLAC cd rip.

 

[radamel]

I look at it this way -- it's a hobby, not a clinical trial. The cost of making the wrong choice is one that I can live with. I'm not against blind listening or relying on objective measurements, either to underpin sighted listening results or to understand why a piece of kit sounds a certain way, but it's just consumer electronics.

Joe

IMO you're quite right, Sir.

 

[Ian M]

I totally agree. Double-blind listening tests only enter the picture when someone state that they *know* they can hear a difference - prompting the question "how do you know?".

I'm interested to know how many documented cases of double blind listening tests exist that have ever proved anything that everyone can agree on?

 

[adamdea]

As a breed cheap SMPS wall warts are noisy, have their noise in the audio band (and have it moving around to boot), and, to put a cherry on top of it, connect their output ground via a capacitor directly to mains.

This tends to be nasty.

However, once you design an SMPS as a machine for most efficiently delivering power from the mains to a specific load, and with a specific output noise signature, things become vastly more interesting (and complex), and miracles can be performed.

Yes, makes sense.

Looking at the Stereophile measurements for mytek there seems to be no noise in the audioband down to 20dB below the 16 bit quantisation noise (ok I admit stereophile's 1Khz tone FFT only shows up to 10K, but from the other measurements it looks like it goes on up in the same vein.) Presumably they have designed theirs ok.

 

[Purité Audio]

That's why I find surprising that it's designer claims it sounds better with an external supply, I can't quite see how it could?
Keith

 

[adamdea]

I look at it this way -- it's a hobby, not a clinical trial. The cost of making the wrong choice is one that I can live with. I'm not against blind listening or relying on objective measurements, either to underpin sighted listening results or to understand why a piece of kit sounds a certain way, but it's just consumer electronics.

Joe

All agreed Joe. It still leaves the intriguing social question of how (or at least what is the acceptable range of ways) to respond to the questions of the sort

- "I swapped my [cable/router/PSU/rubber feet/cd transport/digital filter] and everything now sounds better: Can you explain why?"

- "I am thinking of replacing my [cable/router/PSU/rubber feet/cd transport/digital filter] and am wondering whether this is likely to make my kit sound better: what do you think?"

Perhaps the best answer is-any way you like as long as you only say it once.

 

[adamdea]

I'm interested to know how many documented cases of double blind listening tests exist that have ever proved anything that everyone can agree on?

I would have thought that the sensible starting point would be to look at the broad consensus of opinion around the limits of human hearing (which have been established using structured tests) including the frequency range, pitch discrimination, equal loudness curves, just noticeable amplitude differences etc.

The problem is, in the audio consumer electronics sector, the implication of accepting that information would not be great for sales. I doubt that "everybody" agrees on anything. Looking at standard textbooks in the field of electronics or psychoacoustics I have noticed on several occasions quite scathing comments about audiophile beliefs about audibility of jitter, ultrasonics etc. This has lead me to form the view that the preponderence of expert, non enthusiast, not having a commercial interest, opinion probably does broadly agree on quite a lot of stuff based on structured tests.

Everybody? Well that depends what you mean.