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War declared, Israel v Palestine...

There seems to be a growing body of evidence that the state of Israel has influenced foreign and domestic policy in key western states, either by political or financial means, and is now deeply embedded in the fabric of those states' administrations. So, the likes of Biden have little choice but to voice support for Israel, and provide support by way of arms shipments, etc (see also, leaders in the UK) because they are, at least to a degree, worked from behind by people operating on behalf of the state of Israel. Hence why we see grotesque support for 'Israel's right to defend itself' when there's nobody challenging that right, but merely challenging Israel's right to commit genocide in pursuance of those aims.

And the repression of campus (and other) protests all seems to align to similar misgivings, that academia is similarly beholden to interests aligned with the state of Israel.

Money, as we know, talks. And Israel is the source of a lot of the most sophisticated electronic surveillance software used by states.

What worries me, quite aside from the actual, you know, genocide which is being carried out in plain sight, is that this belief aligns fairly well with my understanding of the position Hitler took against the Jews - they had their hooks into everything and altogether too much control and influence, and needed stopping. That aside from any 'Aryan supremacy' and racial purity arguments which, IIUC, came along later. It's all getting very dark. So many things are coming to a head at once.

It's tempting to think this way, but I think it gets the causation the wrong way round.

The key point is that Israel is a strategic outpost for the West (chiefly, the US) in the Middle East. Given that strategic importance, the US bends over backwards to defend Israel's actions, keep it well supplied with weapons, intelligence, whatever.

Israel exploits its strategic importance to the US, but the main driver in the relationship is the US.

Put simply, Biden could tell Netanyahu and his genocidal government to **** off anytime, if he really wanted to.
 
It's tempting to think this way, but I think it gets the causation the wrong way round.

The key point is that Israel is a strategic outpost for the West (chiefly, the US) in the Middle East. Given that strategic importance, the US bends over backwards to defend Israel's actions, keep it well supplied with weapons, intelligence, whatever.

Israel exploits its strategic importance to the US, but the main driver in the relationship is the US.

Put simply, Biden could tell Netanyahu and his genocidal government to **** off anytime, if he really wanted to.
That makes it sound as though little Israel has the whole of the western world over a barrel. Do you think we all need to bend over backwards quite so much? If we did some more to reduce the scale of tragedy would Israel would just refuse to cooperate with us - just turn its back on us?
 
It's tempting to think this way, but I think it gets the causation the wrong way round.

The key point is that Israel is a strategic outpost for the West (chiefly, the US) in the Middle East. Given that strategic importance, the US bends over backwards to defend Israel's actions, keep it well supplied with weapons, intelligence, whatever.

Israel exploits its strategic importance to the US, but the main driver in the relationship is the US.

Put simply, Biden could tell Netanyahu and his genocidal government to **** off anytime, if he really wanted to.
I ask myself 'why Israel?' on this point. Why not, for example, Saudi Arabia which is the major supplier for western oil and therefore a key strategic and geopolitical 'ally'; or Kuwait, or Jordan if you want a state with a slightly more 'progressive' outlook. Why, if you want a strategic outpost in the Middle East, would you align with the one state which all the other states hate and would remove given half a chance?

In trying to answer this question, I come back to the fundamental premise behind my earlier post.
 
I ask myself 'why Israel?' on this point. Why not, for example, Saudi Arabia which is the major supplier for western oil and therefore a key strategic and geopolitical 'ally'; or Kuwait, or Jordan if you want a state with a slightly more 'progressive' outlook. Why, if you want a strategic outpost in the Middle East, would you align with the one state which all the other states hate and would remove given half a chance?

In trying to answer this question, I come back to the fundamental premise behind my earlier post.
The truth is the US was attempting to broaden it's reliance through the saudi israel normalisation process and with others but that strategy is up in smoke for now.

 
There seems to be a growing body of evidence that the state of Israel has influenced foreign and domestic policy in key western states, either by political or financial means, and is now deeply embedded in the fabric of those states' administrations. So, the likes of Biden have little choice but to voice support for Israel, and provide support by way of arms shipments, etc (see also, leaders in the UK) because they are, at least to a degree, worked from behind by people operating on behalf of the state of Israel. Hence why we see grotesque support for 'Israel's right to defend itself' when there's nobody challenging that right, but merely challenging Israel's right to commit genocide in pursuance of those aims.

And the repression of campus (and other) protests all seems to align to similar misgivings, that academia is similarly beholden to interests aligned with the state of Israel.

Money, as we know, talks. And Israel is the source of a lot of the most sophisticated electronic surveillance software used by states.

What worries me, quite aside from the actual, you know, genocide which is being carried out in plain sight, is that this belief aligns fairly well with my understanding of the position Hitler took against the Jews - they had their hooks into everything and altogether too much control and influence, and needed stopping. That aside from any 'Aryan supremacy' and racial purity arguments which, IIUC, came along later. It's all getting very dark. So many things are coming to a head at once.
That sounds like a slightly sinister conspiracy theory. That Israel "punches above its own weight" in international politics is beyond doubt. That Western governments have a definite inclination to support Israel rather than its enemies, is also beyond doubt. This is because Israel, for the democratic West, is culturally, politically and economically "one of us." It is people we know and do profitable business with. And in strategic terms, it is also a Western outpost in the Middle East. It is perfectly logical that the American and European governments should support Israel when it is in conflict with violently anti-Western dictatorships like Hamas, Iran (which is allied with Russia) Hezbollah or the Houtis. The West pours financial and political aid into Egypt and Jordan because it wants them on "our" side. It turns a blind eye to Saudi civil rights because in terms of "realpolitik" it is better to have the Saudis discreetly on "our" side.
One Italian commentator this week said: "Remember that the people who finance and arm Hamas are the same people who kill teenage girls for not wearing the muslim veil correctly, hang homosexuals and now want to execute a rapper because they didn't like his songs."
As for the Palestinians, the sad reality is that Hamas does not give a damn, Erdogan does not give a damn, Iran does not give a damn. But they can use them to further their own purposes and ambitions to be a key power in their part of the world.
 
That sounds like a slightly sinister conspiracy theory. That Israel "punches above its own weight" in international politics is beyond doubt. That Western governments have a definite inclination to support Israel rather than its enemies, is also beyond doubt. This is because Israel, for the democratic West, is culturally, politically and economically "one of us." It is people we know and do profitable business with. And in strategic terms, it is also a Western outpost in the Middle East. It is perfectly logical that the American and European governments should support Israel when it is in conflict with violently anti-Western dictatorships like Hamas, Iran (which is allied with Russia) Hezbollah or the Houtis. The West pours financial and political aid into Egypt and Jordan because it wants them on "our" side. It turns a blind eye to Saudi civil rights because in terms of "realpolitik" it is better to have the Saudis discreetly on "our" side.
One Italian commentator this week said: "Remember that the people who finance and arm Hamas are the same people who kill teenage girls for not wearing the muslim veil correctly, hang homosexuals and now want to execute a rapper because they didn't like his songs."
As for the Palestinians, the sad reality is that Hamas does not give a damn, Erdogan does not give a damn, Iran does not give a damn. But they can use them to further their own purposes and ambitions to be a key power in their part of the world.

Why does the US not do more to stop Israel harming the Palestinian people so much?
 
That sounds like a slightly sinister conspiracy theory. That Israel "punches above its own weight" in international politics is beyond doubt. That Western governments have a definite inclination to support Israel rather than its enemies, is also beyond doubt. This is because Israel, for the democratic West, is culturally, politically and economically "one of us." It is people we know and do profitable business with. And in strategic terms, it is also a Western outpost in the Middle East. It is perfectly logical that the American and European governments should support Israel when it is in conflict with violently anti-Western dictatorships like Hamas, Iran (which is allied with Russia) Hezbollah or the Houtis. The West pours financial and political aid into Egypt and Jordan because it wants them on "our" side. It turns a blind eye to Saudi civil rights because in terms of "realpolitik" it is better to have the Saudis discreetly on "our" side.
One Italian commentator this week said: "Remember that the people who finance and arm Hamas are the same people who kill teenage girls for not wearing the muslim veil correctly, hang homosexuals and now want to execute a rapper because they didn't like his songs."
As for the Palestinians, the sad reality is that Hamas does not give a damn, Erdogan does not give a damn, Iran does not give a damn. But they can use them to further their own purposes and ambitions to be a key power in their part of the world.
Do you give a damn?
 
I ask myself 'why Israel?' on this point. Why not, for example, Saudi Arabia which is the major supplier for western oil and therefore a key strategic and geopolitical 'ally'; or Kuwait, or Jordan if you want a state with a slightly more 'progressive' outlook. Why, if you want a strategic outpost in the Middle East, would you align with the one state which all the other states hate and would remove given half a chance?

In trying to answer this question, I come back to the fundamental premise behind my earlier post.

Israel being a strategic asset is consistent with a number of other countries serving the same purpose. And the US turns a blind eye to gross violations of human rights in at least one of the countries you mention.

I don't know how many countries qualify as being in the Middle East, but it makes sense, strategically, for the US to hedge its bets and include more than just Israel among its strategic partners.

Beyond that, I suspect the special treatment of Israel by the US is down to historical contingency (perhaps the US had no other options, back in the 1940s).
 
I ask myself 'why Israel?' on this point. Why not, for example, Saudi Arabia which is the major supplier for western oil and therefore a key strategic and geopolitical 'ally'; or Kuwait, or Jordan if you want a state with a slightly more 'progressive' outlook. Why, if you want a strategic outpost in the Middle East, would you align with the one state which all the other states hate and would remove given half a chance?

In trying to answer this question, I come back to the fundamental premise behind my earlier post.

I believe the answer lies between the views expressed. Also consider that in the US money counts in politics as much as anything else, both parties are heavily influenced by AIPAC who contribute huge sums to their coffers, hence any actions that would go counter to AIPAC's agenda would seriously impact election race funding.
 
That sounds like a slightly sinister conspiracy theory. That Israel "punches above its own weight" in international politics is beyond doubt. That Western governments have a definite inclination to support Israel rather than its enemies, is also beyond doubt. This is because Israel, for the democratic West, is culturally, politically and economically "one of us." It is people we know and do profitable business with. And in strategic terms, it is also a Western outpost in the Middle East. It is perfectly logical that the American and European governments should support Israel when it is in conflict with violently anti-Western dictatorships like Hamas, Iran (which is allied with Russia) Hezbollah or the Houtis. The West pours financial and political aid into Egypt and Jordan because it wants them on "our" side. It turns a blind eye to Saudi civil rights because in terms of "realpolitik" it is better to have the Saudis discreetly on "our" side.
One Italian commentator this week said: "Remember that the people who finance and arm Hamas are the same people who kill teenage girls for not wearing the muslim veil correctly, hang homosexuals and now want to execute a rapper because they didn't like his songs."
As for the Palestinians, the sad reality is that Hamas does not give a damn, Erdogan does not give a damn, Iran does not give a damn. But they can use them to further their own purposes and ambitions to be a key power in their part of the world.
All well and good, but realpolitik aside shouldn't normal, compassionate, empathetic people feel repulsed by the actions of both the Iranian and Israeli states ?
Isn't it hypocrisy to express concerns about the cruel murder of Muslims in one country, yet view deaths inflicted by a state you consider "one of us" as acceptable collateral damage ?

I would add, particularly when the aim of the slaughter is to disposess the victims of their lands.
 
Israel being a strategic asset is consistent with a number of other countries serving the same purpose. And the US turns a blind eye to gross violations of human rights in at least one of the countries you mention.

I don't know how many countries qualify as being in the Middle East, but it makes sense, strategically, for the US to hedge its bets and include more than just Israel among its strategic partners.

Beyond that, I suspect the special treatment of Israel by the US is down to historical contingency (perhaps the US had no other options, back in the 1940s).
Yes, I agree our cosying up to Saudi Arabia is similarly problematic. What I find more difficult to explain is why the West would try to sustain a strategic partnership (in order to promote our interests in the region) with the one country that unites the great majority of the region in their opposition to it.
I suspect, as you say, that historical contingency has played a significant part in that; but also I suspect that that same historical contingency has been exploited to massive advantage by Israeli governments since then, so that it has achieved influence far beyond its value to the West.
 
It's tempting to think this way, but I think it gets the causation the wrong way round.

The key point is that Israel is a strategic outpost for the West (chiefly, the US) in the Middle East. Given that strategic importance, the US bends over backwards to defend Israel's actions, keep it well supplied with weapons, intelligence, whatever.

Israel exploits its strategic importance to the US, but the main driver in the relationship is the US.

Put simply, Biden could tell Netanyahu and his genocidal government to **** off anytime, if he really wanted to.
That's certainly a plausible explanation for pro Israeli politicking but doesn't explain the almost blanket pro Israeli media bias. I'm shaking my head so much these days in disbelief I'm getting a repetitive strain injury.
 

Belgium condemns ‘threats’ and ‘intimidation’ against ICC

Belgium’s Ministry of Foreign Affairs has said it “condemns any threats and acts of intimidation” against the International Criminal Court (ICC).
Posting on X, it said the ICC “must be able to act and carry out its functions independently, without interference”.
Belgium’s Foreign Ministry was responding to a statement issued by the prosecutor’s office at the ICC saying that threats made against the court undermine its “independence and impartiality”.
The prosecutor’s statement did not mention Israel, but it was issued after Israeli and US officials warned of consequences against the ICC if it issues arrest warrants against Israeli officials over their war on Gaza.
🇧🇪 Belgium condemns any threats and acts of intimidation against the @IntlCrimCourt.

The #ICC plays a fundamental role in the fight against impunity and must be able to act and carry out its functions independently, without interference. https://t.co/13twkvVAW5
🇧🇪 Belgium MFA (@BelgiumMFA) May 3, 2024
 

Democratic lawmakers warn Biden that Israel violating US law by restricting aid to Gaza

Dozens of Democratic lawmakers in the US have written a letter to President Joe Biden saying that ongoing Israeli restrictions on humanitarian aid entering Gaza “call into question” their compliance with US law.
The 86 members of the House of Representatives said they believe there is sufficient evidence that Israel is failing to comply with a US Foreign Assistance Act provision, which requires recipients of US-funded arms to uphold international humanitarian law, as well as allow the free flow of US assistance.
“We expect the administration to ensure [Israel’s] compliance with existing law and to take all conceivable steps to prevent further humanitarian catastrophe in Gaza,” the letter said.
In February, Biden issued a national security memorandum mandating assurances from recipients of US military assistance that stipulations on humanitarian law and aid are being adhered to.
At least four State Department bureaus advised US Secretary of State Antony Blinken last month that Israel’s claims that it is adhering to international humanitarian law in Gaza are “neither credible nor reliable”.

 
^^ If there are any 'violently anti-Western dictatorships' in the Middle East they were created by the USA and Israel.
 


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