Ukraine V

[Chefren]

So Azov neo nazis are now 'elite' soldiers?

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ks-trend-of-ukrainian-losses-on-eastern-front

Profile: Who are Ukraine’s far-right Azov regiment?

The far-right neo-Nazi group has expanded to be part of Ukraine’s armed forces, a street militia and a political party.

www.aljazeera.com

Elite soldiers have some combination of superior training, equipment, leadership or motivation, and as a result they are usually given more difficult tasks to perform. Leadership and motivation are especially important, as elite units are expected to me more reliable in difficult situations. The status has nothing to do with their political affiliation, except for motivational reasons you can at least expect them to not be hostile to your nation's regime.

---
A bit off-topic: it's a common misconception that all SS-units in WW2 were elite units. Some were indeed elite and highly motivated, some were of pretty average quality and some were terrible.

 

[al2002]

Ukraine peace talks alternative to inevitable battlefield defeat, says senior general

Both sides now strive for ‘most favourable position’ ahead of possible negotiations

www.telegraph.co.uk

 

[al2002]

Looks like NATO troops will be involved in the UkraineRussia war. The first batch of French troops have already arrived.

France sends combat troops to Ukraine battlefront - Asia Times

France has sent its first troops officially to Ukraine. They have been deployed in support of the Ukrainian 54th Independent Mechanized Brigade in

asiatimes.com

NATO starts deploying troops as Russia races to win - Asia Times

NATO is starting to deploy combat troops to Ukraine. Soldiers from Poland, France, the UK, Finland and other NATO members are arriving in

asiatimes.com

According to the second article the US plans to send troops after the elrction. If true, the war will not be confined to the Ukraine.

 

[Amber Audio]

Looks like NATO troops will be involved in the UkraineRussia war. The first batch of French troops have already arrived.

France sends combat troops to Ukraine battlefront - Asia Times

France has sent its first troops officially to Ukraine. They have been deployed in support of the Ukrainian 54th Independent Mechanized Brigade in

asiatimes.com

NATO starts deploying troops as Russia races to win - Asia Times

NATO is starting to deploy combat troops to Ukraine. Soldiers from Poland, France, the UK, Finland and other NATO members are arriving in

asiatimes.com

According to the second article the US plans to send troops after the elrction. If true, the war will not be confined to the Ukraine.

That’s a load of bollox according to the French

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1787495544358633487

France denies having sent troops to Ukraine

France formally disputed the deployment of the Foreign Legion’s first 100 military personnel in the Ukrainian city of Sloviansk, which had been reported the day before.

www.pravda.com.ua

 

[tones]

Looks like NATO troops will be involved in the UkraineRussia war. The first batch of French troops have already arrived.

France sends combat troops to Ukraine battlefront - Asia Times

France has sent its first troops officially to Ukraine. They have been deployed in support of the Ukrainian 54th Independent Mechanized Brigade in

asiatimes.com

NATO starts deploying troops as Russia races to win - Asia Times

NATO is starting to deploy combat troops to Ukraine. Soldiers from Poland, France, the UK, Finland and other NATO members are arriving in

asiatimes.com

According to the second article the US plans to send troops after the elrction. If true, the war will not be confined to the Ukraine.

I find it doubtful that the West would send combat troops, even if it were the Foreign Legion. That would reinforce Putin's narrative that the nasty West is trying to destroy Russia.

 

[al2002]

Really Amber audio, do you expect the French to admit it if it were true? Given the author’s background and contacts in the DOD this is unlikely to be completely wrong. He had a hawkish reputation so I don’t see this as pro Russian disinformation. As always, time will tell, but by then it might be too late. For sure, if NATO troops are involved the war zone will expand beyond Ukraine’s borders.

 

[al2002]

I find it doubtful that the West would send combat troops, even if it were the Foreign Legion. That would reinforce Putin's narrative that the nasty West is trying to destroy Russia.

I don’t. That’s how the US involvement in Vietnam started. There’s a direct line from ‘advisor’ - it is well known that weapons systems are being operated by NATO on behalf of the Ukrainians - to combat solder. Evidently the Russians take this seriously as they‘ve announced training exercises for their tactical nukes.

 

[tones]

I don’t. That’s how the US involvement in Vietnam started. There’s a direct line from ‘advisor’ - it is well known that weapons systems are being operated by NATO on behalf of the Ukrainians - to combat solder. Evidently the Russians take this seriously as they‘ve announced training exercises for their tactical nukes.

Well, actually IIRC, it didn't - it started with the Gulf of Tonkin Incident, a substantially fabricated event which the US used as an excuse to send combat troops. This was back in the days of combatting the spread of evil communism. Putinism doesn't have quite the same ring. I feel sory for Ukraine, which has fought valiantly, but ultimately I can't see the justification of sending troops to support it at the risk of provoking a wider war.

 

[Amber Audio]

Really Amber audio, do you expect the French to admit it if it were true? Given the author’s background and contacts in the DOD this is unlikely to be completely wrong. He had a hawkish reputation so I don’t see this as pro Russian disinformation. As always, time will tell, but by then it might be too late. For sure, if NATO troops are involved the war zone will expand beyond Ukraine’s borders.

If troops are eventually deployed they’ll be European not NATO, as per Africa etc. EU troops should have intervened before 2014 to prevent Crimea being annexed and in 2022 air cover should have been provided and Ukraine made a no fly zone.

Putin pissing around with his Tac Nuke exercises will just speed up Poland getting Nukes on it‘s own soil, between that, EU military spending increasing greatly due to his invasion, Finland and Sweden now in NATO, he’s done a stand up job.

 

[Avinunca]

I watch this exiled Russian economist. He did an interesting piece on the deputy defence minister who was arrested.

https://www.youtube.com/@INSIDERUSSIA/featured

I also found his piece on the economy enlightening.

 

[tones]

The Washington Post has started what appears to be a good series of articles on Russia:

https://wapo.st/3UOljHE

 

[al2002]

Well, actually IIRC, it didn't - it started with the Gulf of Tonkin Incident, a substantially fabricated event which the US used as an excuse to send combat troops. This was back in the days of combatting the spread of evil communism. Putinism doesn't have quite the same ring. I feel sory for Ukraine, which has fought valiantly, but ultimately I can't see the justification of sending troops to support it at the risk of provoking a wider war.

There were US advisers and ‘ observers’ in Vietnam well before the Gulf of Tonkin. That incident just opened the floodgates.
No one wants a wider war. NATO will, however, push the boundaries and the Russians will respond until one side or the other backs down.

 

[al2002]

If troops are eventually deployed they’ll be European not NATO, as per Africa etc. EU troops should have intervened before 2014 to prevent Crimea being annexed and in 2022 air cover should have been provided and Ukraine made a no fly zone.

Putin pissing around with his Tac Nuke exercises will just speed up Poland getting Nukes on it‘s own soil, between that, EU military spending increasing greatly due to his invasion, Finland and Sweden now in NATO, he’s done a stand up job.

I just don’t see troop deployment without US forces. That would be NATO.
US nukes would have been deployed in Poland anyway. Same as in Italy, Germany and others.

 

[kensalriser]

Persistent Putin shill still persisting.

 

[tones]

Persistent Putin shill still persisting.

He doesn't have a choice, he has to win - or have something that he can sell as a win to make up for the massive dislocation of normal economic life with the militarisation of the economy. The only thing Russia has that people want is gas and oil. He has lost the Russian gas industry its major customer, and it won't ever be coming back, and China and India can get his oil on highly preferential terms to them.

Given his propaganda domination of Russia and the silencing of any independent media not toeing the party line, I'd imagine that a ceding of the Ukrainian territory already acquired could be sold as "We stopped those NATO people dead in their attempt to destroy us!" That would be hard for Ukraine to stomach, especially after all the destruction and utter barbarity to which they have been subjected, but it may be the best deal possible.

 

[Mike Reed]

Not sure what's happened to Ukraine receiving various military aircraft to bolster its own air force. In a recent report from the front lines, Russia was using its air force on the front line with impunity.

 

[tones]

This is tragic, despotism gone barking mad:

https://wapo.st/4bjJGm0

 

[Metlor]

Indeed it is, sadly not an isolated case.

Group of conservative judges vows to not hire Columbia University law students due to anti-Israel protests

A group of conservative federal judges sent a letter to Columbia President Minouche Shafik, vowing to not hire graduates because of the school's response to anti-Israel protests.

www.foxnews.com

Individual freedom seems increasingly dependent on absolute allegiance to ones state or country.

In 1977 the controversy over the Sex Pistols God save the Queen single seemed draconian, happy days.

 

[Kirk]

Indeed it is, sadly not an isolated case.

Group of conservative judges vows to not hire Columbia University law students due to anti-Israel protests

A group of conservative federal judges sent a letter to Columbia President Minouche Shafik, vowing to not hire graduates because of the school's response to anti-Israel protests.

www.foxnews.com

Individual freedom seems increasingly dependent on absolute allegiance to ones state or country.

In 1977 the controversy over the Sex Pistols God save the Queen single seemed draconian, happy days.

There is precedent for this in the US in the 60s via Brennan. Didn't amount to much.

 

[Kirk]

Looks like NATO troops will be involved in the UkraineRussia war. The first batch of French troops have already arrived.

France sends combat troops to Ukraine battlefront - Asia Times

France has sent its first troops officially to Ukraine. They have been deployed in support of the Ukrainian 54th Independent Mechanized Brigade in

asiatimes.com

NATO starts deploying troops as Russia races to win - Asia Times

NATO is starting to deploy combat troops to Ukraine. Soldiers from Poland, France, the UK, Finland and other NATO members are arriving in

asiatimes.com

According to the second article the US plans to send troops after the elrction. If true, the war will not be confined to the Ukraine.

Editors’ Note, May 6, 2024: A link originally indicating a source for this report has gone dead.

That said, Western troops are already in Ukraine.