Restoring a Thorens TD124 Mk II SME3009 Shure V15 Type III

[Tony L]

Ok, I couldn't resist... I've flung it together, plonked it into system #2 and played some Coltrane on it! It now gets up to speed within one revolution (a fricking huge improvement!) and sounds lovely. The drive system makes very little noise that is audible now the platter is in place, just a slight whirring, and no worse than either the 301 or L70, I can't hear any rumble coming through the Heresys plus it is electrically silent (no hum / buzz). Speed seems stable, but it needs the eddy-current brake on full as it wants to go faster, I guess I may end up moving the magnet slightly, but I'll wait until I've tried it with the new belt. Anyway it sounds bloody good! Solid, sure footed and generally substantial. It will be interesting to try it through the main system at some point as my DV phono stage is obviously massively superior to the one built into the PM7200. I'm very happy with it indeed.

I'm surprised you report little difference with the stunningly beautiful Schopper platter, I understood that was meant to be a decent sonic upgrade. I plan to try both the alloy platter and the iron one from the MkI as word on the street seems to be it's better sounding than the alloy one, assuming your cart doesn't stick to it! I'm using a MM (Pickering XV15/625E) so no problem there for the time being, and given that the arm is a 3009 S2 Imp I doubt it will see an MC in the forceable future.

Tony.

 

[Tony L]

PS Not impressed with the description of the Schopper belt! I hope mine's better! I was certainly expecting an improvement from a tired 41 year old belt, but by saying that it seems to work perfectly as is.

 

[audiogoose]

I had one belt prior to the one I am using now that I bought off "eBay" from a seller advertising it as equal to the OEM one for the 124.
When I installed it, it was much too tight. Everything was much noisier than what I have now. I think it's really very important to get the right size belt. Too tight pulls the stepped pulley against the side of its bearing well causing a metal-on-metal rubbing sound which can't be good IME.
Too loose, and either the belt falls off at start-up, or you get a slapping sound, which is what I think I may have just a little of. I'm just not sure. It just seems that without the talc, the belt doesn't quite grip the motor pulley and stepped pulley quite tightly enough. So, I may try a new belt.
Tony:
The new Schopper platter has been on my table the last 2 years and I never went back to the old alloy one to see what would be missing. I definitely think there are blacker backgrounds and, as a result, a little more detail. I also think dynamics are improved, but I can't say for sure. Not a night and day difference to me, that's for sure. It sure is better looking. Too bad it can't be seen during operation.

 

[Fox]

The OEM ebay belts will loosen fairly quickly with use. The 124 gets quite hot under the hood with that motor and I found the slightly tight band loosens up after a day or so of use. I'd love to compare the Schopper Platter with the Brass one (likewise with the not seeing it in operation, bit)... In truth I can't be arsed tearing mine apart any more. I do know its a seriously good sound and was better than with the alloy platter and no desire to go back.

I think I have less surface noise than the Orbe, no rumble that I can hear.

 

[Tony L]

My Schopper order arrived today. I've now fitted the new capacitor (old one was truly yucky), replaced the motor suspension grommets and belt. The Schopper belt measured just over 16cm flat, i.e. 32cm circumference, which is apparently within range. I remember reading something from Joel Bontreux (an ex-Thorens employee who sells spares) that the range is 320-340mm for a good 50Hz belt. The Schopper belt was about 8mm shorter than the one I took off and certainly didn't feel crazy-tight at all. I'm letting the deck run for a couple of hours to settle down, it seems to be running fine, though being honest I think it was mechanically a little quieter before I started today's fiddling – I suspect the belt just needs to bed in a bit. Anyway it turns Blue Notes nicely:

I suspect this is the job done as my aim was only to clean and service it, no more.

I now need to think long and hard about a course of action for the less tidy early MkI I also bought…

Tony.

 

[audiogoose]

If it sounds as good as it looks, it's one fine turntable.
Enjoy.

 

[John P]

Tony, that looks lovely. A fine piece of audio engineering.

 

[hifi_dave]

Tony, that looks the biz. Is it going to take over from the 301 ?

 

[Tony L]

Tony, that looks the biz. Is it going to take over from the 301 ?

No, physical size dictates it will stay in system #2 (PM7200 / Heresy) as it fits on the wall-shelf whereas the 301 is way, way too big! I have no idea which is ultimately the better deck, though the 301 obviously has the better arm & cart so would win any comparative dem. The 124 makes for an excellent vinyl grading / evaluation deck, so will get a fair bit of use. The SME 3009 / Pickering combo being a far better tool in this respect than the elderly L70 / M3d which preceded it (that had such a big, ballsy sound that it was almost completely oblivious to surface noise, the Pickering is far more typical of a modern mid-range cart plus tracks at less than half the weight!). I'm delighted with both decks - this 124 appearing is entirely independent of the 301, I never looked at it as a replacement. One can't have too many vintage decks!

Tony.

 

[John Caswell]

Hi all,
For those interested
UKD are the Thorens UK distributors and normally have a good stock of brand new Thorens TD124 and TD150/125/160 drive belts.

John Caswell

UKD - Nick Green
01753 652 669
[email protected]

Based in Iver near Heathrow

 

[Jonathan Ribee]

i'm saving myself for the cart for the new year... Dec>Feb are deep dark months and I get a LOT of listening done then. But so far very happy with the DL103

fox

We're in the deep and dark bits - have you tried it yet dude?

Jonathan

 

[Borellus]

Oh completely. It crumbles daily when I look at its little box on the bookcase next to the TT. My cold icy heart melts when I stroke it, caress it... its my precioussssss. Minsesssss!

But if you want teh pron, here's some I made when it arrived sans needle...

Can't you hear it calling to it's master? It's waited so long to return to Mordor "One cart to rule them all and in the BlueNote bind them ..."

 

[aquapiranha]

Tony, absolutely stunning! what a fantastic job!

 

[Tony L]

Tony, absolutely stunning! what a fantastic job!

Thanks, I'm really pleased with it. I'll try and take a better pic of it at some point, that one was from a very dull day so I pushed it quite hard in Photoshop and then over-sharpened it, so it looks more than a bit unnatural. The deck actually looks a lot better in real life.

I've still not got round to trying it in the main system yet so I've no idea what it really sounds like, i.e. through a really good phono stage, but it's certainly a nice tool for record grading. I quite often spin vinyl on it. I'll play a whole side when I was really only intending to check a tiny mark or whatever, and then end up flinging a few more on. It's a pleasure to use, a reassuringly firm 'clunk' when you turn it on and the clutch that stops the platter is just great for 45s. They really thought this one through: 4 speeds, built in adapter for 'dinked' 45s, clutch, spirit level etc. A proper record player; a genuinely useful and unpretentious tool for playing records.

Tony.

 

[aquapiranha]

Well Tony, should you ever decide to sell that deck, you will have a queue longer than that at the launch of the iPhone!

 

[Tony L]

Well Tony, should you ever decide to sell that deck, you will have a queue longer than that at the launch of the iPhone!

Excellent, not that I plan to sell this one. The light was a bit better today, the sun even came out for a few minutes so I took a couple more pics:

Both are pretty accurate with minimal post-processing.

I’ve not introduced my TD-124 MkI to the world yet:

It’s just sitting minding it’s own business upstairs in the record shop for the moment. I can’t decide what to do with it, so I’ve so far done nothing. It’s in decent, though not mint, shape, the fragile top platter has been dropped at some point in it’s 50 year life, it’s not bad, just has a maybe 0.5mm ‘ripple’ in the reflection when it’s rotating, i.e. the rim is not perfect. It’s flat though and the clutch engages / lifts it neatly. There are also a couple of scratches / wear marks on the chassis around the clutch mech. I’d grade it as a VG++ I guess, certainly better than many. Mechanically it’s fine, the main bearing had already been fully restored by ex-Thorens employee and all round 124 guru Joel Boutreux, the plastic inner bushings replaced with bronze (it's a very early MkI). The motor looks ok, I’ll fully strip and clean it at some point. Otherwise it’s a few detail bits, i.e. replacing a few screws with neater ones, replacing the start-up capacitor etc. Either that or just flip it as is on eBay whilst the pound is so low, I really can’t decide.

Tony.

 

[Fox]

fox
We're in the deep and dark bits - have you tried it yet dude?

Nope not yet. :-D

Tony, just keep it if you are not hurting for the cash right now. These Thorens decks don't seem to be affected by the vagaries of "fashionable hifi" so it will probably appreciate over time. They are such solid, well made beasts and, like you say have that ability to keep you on whole sides at a time... for more hours than you had planned.

 

[bob]

Thats a beautiful deck you have on the wall bracket Tony, the other one isn't too shabby either lol. What cart is in the finished one? Looks like a Stanton or even a Pickering, if it is that's proper retro hifi.

Ronnie

 

[Tony L]

Tony, just keep it if you are not hurting for the cash right now. These Thorens decks don't seem to be affected by the vagaries of "fashionable hifi" so it will probably appreciate over time. They are such solid, well made beasts and, like you say have that ability to keep you on whole sides at a time... for more hours than you had planned.

I suspect that's the plan. I just don't need the cash at present so I'll probably just box it up and forget about it along with my two L70s. I'm tempted to try the cast iron sub platter on the MkII though.

Thats a beautiful deck you have on the wall bracket Tony, the other one isn't too shabby either lol. What cart is in the finished one? Looks like a Stanton or even a Pickering, if it is that's proper retro hifi.

It's a Pickering XV15/625E, there's a chap on eBay banging them out NOS for 69 quid with three styluses. It's a perfect match with the 3009 S2 Improved so makes sense. Obviously the deck would take a hugely better arm cart combo, as Fox has done with his, but it's fine for my purpose. I have a very nice 301 in the other room with a M2-10 / AT33PTG for serious listening.

Tony.

 

[Fox]

Well, one reason why I do not want to move away from the Denon 103 is that at present it ticks all my boxes so while I have a lovely piece of Teh Japanese Uberness waiting, I'm not rushing myself to change a thing -- it may topple the whole house of cards and start what we in the know call "Doing a Jonathan" which involves a perfectly rational and justifiable need for Step Up Traffos, more expensive Phono Stages using Valves and then a Preamp would be needed! Then I could end up completely changing everything, getting back into racks, fabricating Phase 11 stacks of Manalike under everything, ditching the ATCs and getting a pair 300B SETs and Quads -- and I am just not ready for that!