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P&O Ferries Scandal

It has been suggested that the UK seizes P&O assets. If they’ve broken UK law by hiding behind maritime law, can’t think why not?
 
ks.234 said:
It has been suggested that the UK seizes P&O assets. If they’ve broken UK law by hiding behind maritime law, can’t think why not?
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I’d argue fraudulently taking covid handouts was in itself enough for criminal proceedings. It sickens me that they appear to have taken countless £millions in state handouts, recently paid shareholders a very handsome dividend, and now shaft their whole workforce and expect the rest of us to clear up their shit. As a tax payer that annoys me hugely and I’d quite happily see their remaining ports burned to the ground if there is no legal recourse to return our cash.

I am fundamentally a capitalist, I believe in the free market, the absolute right to have ideas, create businesses etc, but I have zero time for the crooked shit that is just everywhere in this country at present. There is just no integrity or honesty to be seen at all. P&O are bunch of bloody crooks and fraudsters, just like the government.
 
Tony L said:
I’d argue fraudulently taking covid handouts was in itself enough for criminal proceedings. It sickens me that they appear to have taken countless £millions in state handouts, recently paid shareholders a very handsome dividend, and now shaft their whole workforce and expect the rest of us to clear up their shit. As a tax payer that annoys me hugely and I’d quite happily see their remaining ports burned to the ground if there is no legal recourse to return our cash.

I am fundamentally a capitalist, I believe in the free market, the absolute right to have ideas, create businesses etc, but I have zero time for the crooked shit that is just everywhere in this country at present. There is just no integrity or honesty to be seen at all. P&O are bunch of bloody crooks and fraudsters just like the government.
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The main problem would seem to be that DP World are on a board of advisors advising our own government.

Where there is dirty money, corruption and theft of ‘taxpayer’ money, there is our government at the centre of it all
 
ks.234 said:
Where there is dirty money, corruption and theft of ‘taxpayer’ money, there is our government at the centre of it all
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It just really pisses me off as I try to play a straight game. pfm was hit fairly hard by the first covid lockdown so I ended up taking the first two state grants as I was fully entitled to do so, but I then tweaked the ad settings, a good vinyl collection came in (I couldn’t go out to buy stock as usual), and things picked up substantially, so when I did my tax at the end of the year I voluntarily paid the second grant back in full. I obviously didn’t take any of the other grants. That’s just how I do things as I like to think I’m not a piece of shit. It is however not the Tory way. It is not the DP World/P&O way either. They are thieves and crooks, and that is sufficient to justify civil unrest IMHO. I fully support those who are protesting against the way they have been treated. It is not right. There is no integrity, honour or dignity in this sort of business, nor in the type of government that enables it.
 
Tony L said:
It just really pisses me off as I try to play a straight game. pfm was hit fairly hard by the first covid lockdown so I ended up taking the first two state grants as I was fully entitled to do so, but I then tweaked the ad settings, a good vinyl collection came in (I couldn’t go out to buy stock as usual), and things picked up substantially, so when I did my tax at the end of the year I paid the second grant back in full. I obviously didn’t take any of the other grants. That’s just how I do things as I like to think I’m not a piece of shit. It is however not the Tory way. It is not the DP World/P&O way either. They are thieves and crooks, and that is sufficient to justify civil unrest IMHO. I fully support those who are protesting against the way they have been treated. It is not right. There is no integrity, honour or dignity in this sort of business, nor in the type of government that enables it.
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Tax is for the little people
 
Tony L said:
It just really pisses me off as I try to play a straight game. pfm was hit fairly hard by the first covid lockdown so I ended up taking the first two state grants as I was fully entitled to do so, but I then tweaked the ad settings, a good vinyl collection came in (I couldn’t go out to buy stock as usual), and things picked up substantially, so when I did my tax at the end of the year I paid the second grant back in full. I obviously didn’t take any of the other grants. That’s just how I do things as I like to think I’m not a piece of shit. It is however not the Tory way. It is not the DP World/P&O way either. They are thieves and crooks, and that is sufficient to justify civil unrest IMHO. I fully support those who are protesting against the way they have been treated. It is not right. There is no integrity, honour or dignity in this sort of business, nor in the type of government that enables it.
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Likewise, I am paying a pretty substantial tax bill, and for what? For this Brexit fuelled government to corruptly line their own pockets, their mates pockets, to run down all public services including transport, libraries and the NHS, further demonise the poor and foreign people, amidst a backdrop of rising taxes, NI increases, mass redundancies, fuel poverty, food banks, a war in Ukraine and the infiltration and degradation of everything that we are supposed to be proud of, including our Police force which has devolved into a disgusting monster that only serves the scum that govern this country, and themselves. I don't mind paying my way if it's used correctly and for the benefit of all - including and especially those who are struggling - but under current circumstances it makes me feel sick and in all honesty, to want to go out and start smashing things up. Anyone who doesn't think that Brexit hasn't lead us to this dark point needs their head examined.
 
gavreid said:
Labour signals that it will do nothing:

"Never again should any company think they can treat British workers with such contempt – and be given the green light by the government to do so. Labour will make Britain work for working people."

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...nment-p-and-o-british-workers-tories-dp-world
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Labour is in opposition so can’t do anything. If people voted with a Labour majority in mind the party might do something in future, as that statement says and it’s pretty much all Labour can say.

As others have said, that a company can do this is nothing to do with brexit. There is a reason why more than one person believes this would not happen in France and it’s nothing to do with the EU. This is to do with those who complain about any kind of Union action, who complain about the existence of Unions and who vote in a way that enables a tory govt they are fully aware is going to attack Unions and is going to ensure employment law is more favourable for the employer.
 
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Tony L said:
I’d argue fraudulently taking covid handouts was in itself enough for criminal proceedings. It sickens me that they appear to have taken countless £millions in state handouts, recently paid shareholders a very handsome dividend, and now shaft their whole workforce and expect the rest of us to clear up their shit. As a tax payer that annoys me hugely and I’d quite happily see their remaining ports burned to the ground if there is no legal recourse to return our cash.

I am fundamentally a capitalist, I believe in the free market, the absolute right to have ideas, create businesses etc, but I have zero time for the crooked shit that is just everywhere in this country at present. There is just no integrity or honesty to be seen at all. P&O are bunch of bloody crooks and fraudsters, just like the government.
Click to expand...

100% correct. I took the first self employment grant a couple of years ago. Never claimed a thing in my life but thought I’d better had as all I saw on the news was looming death and bankruptcy. Of course weeks after taking over 10k I realised I didn’t need a penny of it as I was doing better than ever at work. I didn’t take any more of them unlike every other tradesman in town who just sat around turning most of the work coming in down unless they were taking cash in hand so they could be seen to justify their actions. Everyone from P&O to the one man band needs investigating. Will never happen though.
 
It’s really quite disgraceful to see some posts on social media over the last twenty four hours, crowing about Brexit when 800 people have lost their jobs. “They had it coming” “it’s their own fault” type posts. As someone has already alluded to, P&O pulled exactly the same stunt with Irish Seafarers in 2004, in an EU member country. That dispute was eventually resolved between the Seamen’s Union of Ireland and the Irish government following solidarity action from other unions. That it was an eventual score draw was a result of trade union action and militancy.

P&O know full well that the Tories will do SFA and Starmer’s Labour Party will be as much use as a chocolate teapot. The governments of Thatcher and Major introduced the most anti-union legislation in Europe and Blair’s New Labour did f*ck all in thirteen years to repeal a single line of it.

Workers and unions have rarely been able to rely on courts, judges and the legal system. They are skewed 100% in favour of the bosses- whether U.K. or EU. This dispute will be won or lost depending on whether the TUC mounts a ferocious fightback. This is a dangerous precedent and if they get away with it, expect wide scale hire and fire in other industries. The ship occupations should have been maintained, the RMT must go in hard and the TUC should issue instructions of solidarity. F*ck the anti-Trade Union laws around secondary action, if it’s ok for P&O to disregard the law, then it’s ok for the RMT. The RMT has the power to grind the country to a halt within 24 hours. Only a real, militant fightback will save these jobs.

P&O wouldn’t get away with this if Bob Crow was still alive. Sadly, Frances o’Grady looks set to go down the dead end legal route. And they sure aren’t going to be able to rely on Starmer’s Labour Party.
https://www.eurofound.europa.eu/pub...OtpoAnWqStXagldYtlNH-65_D0lD_IR1AnTf8Ij1uJ510
 
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The government is complicit or supine and the courts and opposition seem to be AWOL, so it is up to the unions. If they don’t fight this with all their resources, their members will start wondering why they exist.
 
PsB said:
The government is complicit or supine and the courts and opposition seem to be AWOL, so it is up to the unions. If they don’t fight this with all their resources, their members will start wondering why they exist.
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The fact of the matter is that the unions have been weakened by years of Tory resentment and anti union feeling. As a result, what a union is able to spend it’s resources on is legally curtailed to the extent that starting a legal battle and losing could lead to accusations of misspending member money. A union will usually only fight a legal battle it is certain to win.

Unions will fight this for all they’re worth, but to threaten them with a backlash from members and blame them if they fail against what is, as you say, a complicit government and supine courts, is to misrepresent the ability of unions, the reality the situation, the reality of how unions have been systematically weakened, and who is to blame for how we got to where we are.
 
ks.234 said:
The fact of the matter is that the unions have been weakened by years of Tory resentment and anti union feeling. As a result, what a union is able to spend it’s resources on is legally curtailed to the extent that starting a legal battle and losing could lead to accusations of misspending member money. A union will usually only fight a legal battle it is certain to win.

Unions will fight this for all they’re worth, but to threaten them with a backlash from members and blame them if they fail against what is, as you say, a complicit government and supine courts, is to misrepresent the ability of unions, the reality the situation, the reality of how unions have been systematically weakened, and who is to blame for how we got to where we are.
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I'm not threatening the unions with anything (a bizarre thought). Just pointing out that if I was a member of a union that didn't consider a case like P&O, where the employers seem to be breaking the law, worth fighting with the utmost energy, I would be reconsidering my membership.

As for the rest, well, Tory governments don't help unions. Maybe if the Labour party spent less time on internecine squabbles things would be different, but we are where we are. I would have thought egregious cases like P&O are opportunities for the union movement to regain some ground, but I'm not an expert.
 
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