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Now the dust has settled - the Karousel

Did you allow the stock inner platter time to run in before comparison with the mober?
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I didn't buy the kit just the bearing. I installed the Karousel with Mober SSP12
 
I though that the inner plater was also changed with the Karousel? - The material is certainly different than my earlier one.
 
Karousel Inner platter is the same as the Cirkus platter. A friend hooked me up with just the bearing that all I can say about that.
 
rkay5 said:
Karousel Inner platter is the same as the Cirkus platter. A friend hooked me up with just the bearing that all I can say about that.
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I suspect this is correct, I’d be surprised if Linn had spent additional money tooling up for a different inner platter.
 
Mr Pig said:
This sounds very reminiscent of the Cirkus bearing. It was clearer and more detailed than the old bearing, everyone raved about and at first I was really impressed with it.

But quite soon the novelty of the extra detail wore off and I realized I wasn't getting into the music as much. It didn't 'boogie' as well, there wasn't the same sense that you were listening to three-dimensional, real people. It was a colder, less emotional sound.

I removed the Cirkus after a few years, I did try to make it work, but the old bearing was more alive. Detail isn't everything. There have always been decks that offered more detail than the LP12 but what they didn't do was give you the same sense of listening to real people that the LP12 did.

The Cirkus bearing just made the bearing housing stiffer and that's also all the new bearing does. I am concerned that the Karousel might be taking the LP12 further down a road Linn started on thirty years ago that I don't much like.
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I was of like mind and found the Cirkus bearing much more to my liking once improving to a better subchassis.
 
John said:
I was of like mind and found the Cirkus bearing much more to my liking once improving to a better subchassis.
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I well remember, many years ago, when my LP12 came back, having had the Cirkus update. I didn’t like it tbh, the life and soul had been taken from the music. I stuck with it though, and as you say, with the Kore, it sounds better. That probably means that a sub-chassis upgrade should have come first.
 
Had the Karousel bearing fitted a couple of weeks ago, only had chance to listen a couple of albums. It's definitely better but then my deck had a full strip down & rebuild, the basic Linn Black ICs were swapped for Naim RCA-DIN Hi-Line and and I upgraded the XLR-DIN leads on the amps so it's hard to say which of the 3 have made biggest difference and but I know for sure that LP12 seems CD like quiet now if that makes any sense? Really looking forward to going through my records again as I was hearing things on the recordings that I couldn't before.

I know it's a big hifi cliche but what else can I say?!
 
paulski said:
I have absolutely no doubt you’re in for a treat. Brace yourself...
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The Karousel has been fitted. First impressions are:

-- I'm hearing textures in bass notes I've never heard before.

-- There seems to be more layering of musical information, where it's easier to hear subtlety amidst loud passages. There is better dynamic contrast.

-- Articulation seems more incisive. the timing and pitch of notes changing are better differentiated instead of blurring together.

-- Background noise is vastly reduced. Clarity is definitely improved.

So far, I'm liking the Karousel a lot.
 
James said:
The Karousel has been fitted. First impressions are:

-- I'm hearing textures in bass notes I've never heard before.

-- There seems to be more layering of musical information, where it's easier to hear subtlety amidst loud passages. There is better dynamic contrast.

-- Articulation seems more incisive. the timing and pitch of notes changing are better differentiated instead of blurring together.

-- Background noise is vastly reduced. Clarity is definitely improved.

So far, I'm liking the Karousel a lot.
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Just goes to show the importance of a quality bearing in a TT design.
 
Darren L said:
Just goes to show the importance of a quality bearing in a TT design.
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This is true. You're dealing with the collection of information that is literally microscopic so any mechanical tightening up can make a big difference. But you sometimes need to be careful of where you give credit.

If the deck is being fully rebuilt it's difficult to dismiss the possibility that some of the improvement was the result of the process and not the part. Has only one part been changed? You could't fit the Cirkus bearing to the older sub-chassis so true direct comparison was impossible.

Also, unless the bearing being replaced is pretty new you're replacing a worn part with a new part. If tighter tolerances in the new bearing can improve the sound the slight wear in the old one can hurt it, you can't have it both ways.

I'm not saying the new bearing is not better, just that you need to be careful.
 
Mr Pig said:
If the deck is being fully rebuilt it's difficult to dismiss the possibility that some of the improvement was the result of the process and not the part. Has only one part been changed? You could't fit the Cirkus bearing to the older sub-chassis so true direct comparison was impossible.
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I don't think new springs and rubber grommets would have made the difference I heard.

Mr Pig said:
Also, unless the bearing being replaced is pretty new you're replacing a worn part with a new part. If tighter tolerances in the new bearing can improve the sound the slight wear in the old one can hurt it, you can't have it both ways.
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This might be more pertinent. My old pre-Cirkus bearing is 33 years old. Under a microscope, I can see some wear on the spindle tip and thrust bearing surfaces. That alone would account for a lower noise floor.

I've effectively got myself a brand new, bang up-to-date LP12 with the Karousel.
 
James said:
I've effectively got myself a brand new, bang up-to-date LP12 with the Karousel.
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If the motor is good, yip. In some ways filling a Karousel to a very old LP12 is brilliant value.

The tips on the bearing spindles don't last that long. I don't know how big a difference the one-piece spindle really makes but a ball bearing is better from a wear point of view as it's easy to replace.
 
James said:
The Karousel has been fitted. First impressions are:

-- I'm hearing textures in bass notes I've never heard before.

-- There seems to be more layering of musical information, where it's easier to hear subtlety amidst loud passages. There is better dynamic contrast.

-- Articulation seems more incisive. the timing and pitch of notes changing are better differentiated instead of blurring together.

-- Background noise is vastly reduced. Clarity is definitely improved.

So far, I'm liking the Karousel a lot.
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That’s a perfect summation of what I’m hearing with mine. It’s seriously good.
 
wylton said:
I well remember, many years ago, when my LP12 came back, having had the Cirkus update. I didn’t like it tbh, the life and soul had been taken from the music. I stuck with it though, and as you say, with the Kore, it sounds better. That probably means that a sub-chassis upgrade should have come first.
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Funny you should mention that as I was round a Audio loving old friends last weekend.Having a coffee sat on the sofa and I raised the Karousel in the conversation as I am seriously thinking of getting one for my LP12.
Although he's since sold his LP12 - Ittok - Troika about 15 years ago and now streams as his main source.His reply was almost identical to your post and he returned the Cirkus to his dealers and like you said the old magic returned.
 
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