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Naim: Is it personal?

Iain Docherty said:
I went to a Naim demo at the Scottish hifi show at Dalmahoy once. They weren’t exactly overwhelmed with punters and so were actively soliciting music choices. I gave them a Keith Jarrett disc and asked them to play one of the shorter less improvised ie more approachable pieces at the end. The guys doing the demo turned it off about two minutes because the multi box mega system was making such a hash of it; it was screechy beyond belief. I listened to my late dad’s Naim system for decades and never got it… but that demo was something else altogether
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That Dalmahoy Naim system sounded awful. When I pointed this out to a dealer he agreed and said that it improved after a couple of days. Apparently the Totem speakers needed to settle down!
 
The uber mains, the on 24/7, the upgrade club and so on no longer fitted with my lifestyle, listening room or income.

With a few side steps I realised that far cheaper (and quieter) amplification with efficient speakers was the path for me.

Then I discovered the value in active speakers so I have those too. Each part of the journey has been interesting and fun.
 
I should count myself lucky that I never liked the Naim sound. Listened to an Olive Nait 3 in the 90s, "that's OK but it sounds a bit harsh" so I bought vintage Quad instead. Called at a mate's place with the full house 52/135/DBLs, close but no cigar. Went home from his and put my system on, breathed a sigh of relief. Went to look at a CB Nait 2 offered cheap when these things were available at about £100 (2000 ish). The poor thing was trying to drive Briks and sounded awful. "No thanks mate, I'll leave it." Missed out there, could have made a killing 10 and 20 years on. I could have sold it as unused too, because I sure as hell didn't want to use it. Various shows, top of the shop items, left shaking my head. Probably saved me a fortune over the years.
 
James said:
@Dingbat, maybe you can turn your Naim system off and listen again from cold with an open mind to judge if there is an audible difference. :D
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Actually, there's been a few times in the past year where I've had it off for a while, either overnight, or possibly a few days, and when I turned it on again, not sure that it sounded any worse from cold. Because of my severe recent case of upgraditus, it was getting switched on/off quite a bit, it didn't seem to do the system any harm. In fact, I could have sworn a couple of times when I did this, it actually sounded better afterwards. So on/off now and then is likely healthy. I end up though listening to music at various times all through the day, so it's more for convenience I'm keeping it on.
 
Another thing about (olive) Naim is that the (single-ended) pre-amp boards are improved “beyond belief” by using low noise power supplies, to the extent you get ideal performance with two independent supplies per board. I’m not sure how unusual that might be. Sure, other pre-amp makes may benefit too, but to this extent? I’ve no idea what the PSRR of Naim amps is.
 
Dingbat said:
Actually, there's been a few times in the past year where I've had it off for a while, either overnight, or possibly a few days, and when I turned it on again, not sure that it sounded any worse from cold. Because of my severe recent case of upgraditus, it was getting switched on/off quite a bit, it didn't seem to do the system any harm. In fact, I could have sworn a couple of times when I did this, it actually sounded better afterwards. So on/off now and then is likely healthy. I end up though listening to music at various times all through the day, so it's more for convenience I'm keeping it on.
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Think of the recapping costs you'll save yourself in the long run, especially with your brand new 282/Super.
 
Iain Docherty said:
I went to a Naim demo at the Scottish hifi show at Dalmahoy once. They weren’t exactly overwhelmed with punters and so were actively soliciting music choices. I gave them a Keith Jarrett disc and asked them to play one of the shorter less improvised ie more approachable pieces at the end. The guys doing the demo turned it off about two minutes because the multi box mega system was making such a hash of it; it was screechy beyond belief. ...
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I hope that Jarrett disk wasn't "The Köln Concert". This is not a disc to test for great piano reproduction because the instrument he was playing wasn't a great piano (understatement). I perceive it as clangy and lacking in bass resonance/bloom. It might well get described as screechy - because that's what it is like at source. Not good for judging the replay kit, but Jarrett makes superb music on the instrument regardless of its sound.
 
Avon said:
Another thing about (olive) Naim is that the (single-ended) pre-amp boards are improved “beyond belief” by using low noise power supplies, to the extent you get ideal performance with two independent supplies per board. I’m not sure how unusual that might be. Sure, other pre-amp makes may benefit too, but to this extent? I’ve no idea what the PSRR of Naim amps is.
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Naim PSRR is about average, I think I was told. Not especially good, but neither especially poor. This is of course judged against their contemporaries. Compared to a more modern design they are likely to suffer.
 
Avon said:
Another thing about (olive) Naim is that the (single-ended) pre-amp boards are improved “beyond belief” by using low noise power supplies, to the extent you get ideal performance with two independent supplies per board. I’m not sure how unusual that might be. Sure, other pre-amp makes may benefit too, but to this extent? I’ve no idea what the PSRR of Naim amps is.
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I suspect these "beyond belief" improvements are just the usual hyperbole produced by almost all that have spent money and/or time on HiFi. This is not especially a Naim thing, in my opinion. While in the Naim universe it does tend to be applied to a PSU upgrade as this is what one does in with the Naim! Which is not to say that a better power supply does not bring improvement within a Naim system ... it is the magnitudes discussed that are hard to believe. I fitted a Avondale TRP4 and thought I could easily live without what it brings :p while others rave about it.

Outside of the Naim universe, there are similar "beyond belief" found from adding a linear PSU to e.g. a DAC or a streamer. Or sticking things under things, or on top of things. Which is not to say that a linear PSU added to a DAC or streamer can't be an improvement etc.

I see this as just people enjoying their time and money. All good, just don't believe the hype.
 
I kept my CDX2 switched on early in its life, only off when the room got too cold - No central heating.

30 percent of the time on switch on the case fuse blew even when using the appropriate Littelfuse. I had spares but eventually over time the problem went away for some reason.
 
stevec67 said:
Compared to a more modern design they are likely to suffer.
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Modern or whatever.
When I auditioned a Nait back in early 90s, I found my then various other kit wasn’t able to hold a tune, timing and involvment was miles better with CB/Olive kit.
My old valve stuff was insane expensive and that little Nait scored me, was miles better on pure musical Joy.
Can't believe its four decades ago.
 
per flemming said:
Modern or whatever.
When I auditioned a Nait back in early 90s, I found my then various other kit wasn’t able to hold a tune, timing and involvment was miles better with CB/Olive kit.
My old valve stuff was insane expensive and that little Nait scored me, was miles better on pure musical Joy.
Can't believe its four decades ago.
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I began my hi-fi journey back in the late 1980's with a Creek 1040 (?) integrated. Curiosity got the better of me in 1988 or 1989 and I listened to a next rung up amp - can't even recall the make, but it was getting great reviews. Before buying the chaps in Lyric Hi-Fi suggested I might want to have a listen to a nait 2. At first it didn't sound as clear/ bright, but after a couple of tracks, exactly as you say, it just seemed to get hold of the tune and came across so much more coherently. After all those years I have very recently received my Nait 2 back from Darran at Class A who undertook it's first ever service! I haven't fired it up yet as was toying with the idea of getting a decent cd player to feed it a decent signal. I've waited quite a while and looking forward to it!
Peter
 
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