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Naim: Is it personal?

Mr Pig said:
The Naim 'sound' has changed over the years and, while it might not be to your taste, I doubt anyone resents the brand because of it.
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Not sure about that, though I don't think 'resents' is the right word.

I think the combination of the distinctive (unnatural?) sound signature and the historical baggage associated with the brand have led to a 'dislike', rather than a resentment.

It is what it is, I don't see the point in getting upset about it. I don't think I've ever experienced Quad fans getting agitated when the 'pipe and slippers' meme gets trotted out.
 
Good Morning All,

As somebody who has, very fully, been down the Naim 'rabbit hole' and come out the other side my simple thoughts are as follows. I did get to 10 Naim boxes i.e NAC52 + SC, SNAXO 3-6 + SC, 4 x NAP250 and 2 x NAP135 having started off over 30yrs ago with a simple pre-amp/ power amp combo I feel I have some direct experience (like many others on here).

I am now completely Naim free and don't miss it at all.

I'm finding the SE amplification I'm now experiencing simply provides me with a better audio experience.

Whether the newer Naim equipment would be sonically better than the CB/ olive stuff I had I don't know and I'm not sure I could afford to find out.

Regards

Richard
 
There is a constant I pick up on time and time again around this theme which equates to chasing a unicorn. Many have been down the same rabbit hole only to realise that the mythical beast does not actually exist. Whether they have been encouraged to this quest or built up this expectation themselves is irrelevant. It’s simply a part of many personalities. Once the lesson has been learnt, they are free to focus on what actually matters which is just the music. Some blame the brand, others simply accept their folly. If Naim or Linn for that matter are guilty of anything it is encouraging this nonsense. There is no doubt that the kit they sell is good quality but it never really lives up to the hype. My mantra is set a budget, choose what you like the look of and stick with it for a sensible amount of time. If possible even get a home demo but if you just make the effort to do your research you are unlikely to go far wrong. Voices hanging in the air, massively deep and wide three dimensional sound stages. Acres of detail….. Meh!
 
I started with a non-Naim system in the early 90s, then got the upgrade bug and listened to a few setups, one of which was Naim, which I enjoyed. Bought the best combo I could afford at the time but was put off by the eye-watering price of the upper reaches of the product line.

Over the years I too have been massively disappointed by the same issues that Tom60300 has mentioned, and as I’ve said elsewhere, if any part of my current system goes ‘phut’ I’ll be off the Naim-train for good.

in the early years I bought into their design philosophy but am now feeling that in the later incarnations they just don’t offer value for money any more (my opinion note, you may feel differently)
 
Paul Hindle said:
There is a constant I pick up on time and time again around this theme which equates to chasing a unicorn. Many have been down the same rabbit hole only to realize that the mythical beast does not actually exist.
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I was talking to someone about this yesterday, this was my experience. I realize in retrospect that the Naim 'sound' was fundamentally flawed. Very good or outstanding in some ways, which is what impresses in short dems, but there is something missing. It niggles away at you and the answer is always another Naim box. Once you get a more rounded amplifier you understand that constantly wanting to upgrade is not obligatory or desirable. I've had the same amps now for twenty years with no desire to change them.
 
Naim has both good and bad points. Like most others here, I’m going to do some slagging off, but I did like the olive Naim sound a lot. I came to the conclusion that the “bit that’s missing” with olive era stuff is textural detail; the bit that allows you to hear the difference between say an oboe and a clarinet. By removing that texture, pace and rhythm are accentuated. Add it back and it becomes more difficult to follow the music, rather than just hear the sound. The difference between hi-fi and music I’d say. Just my opinion of course and I’m talking about olive variants here.

As much as I liked them, the first time I became “annoyed” by Naim was with my CD3.5. It is well known that a simple capacitor / resistor filter has been omitted from one of its internal power supplies. You can easily add that yourself, and certainly Naim normally would have put that filter in place; it’s not as if they “forgot”. So why should they leave it out? Well, the resulting sound becomes slightly harsh, meaning it’s improved by adding a Hicap. I find it difficult to believe that could have happened “just by accident”. Again, that’s my opinion.
 
Mr Pig said:
I was talking to someone about this yesterday, this was my experience. I realize in retrospect that the Naim 'sound' was fundamentally flawed. Very good or outstanding in some ways, which is what impresses in short dems, but there is something missing. It niggles away at you and the answer is always another Naim box. Once you get a more rounded amplifier you understand that constantly wanting to upgrade is not obligatory or desirable. I've had the same amps now for twenty years with no desire to change them.
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Ignorant statement.

Naim, woops ...Name me one system that completely satisfies on all media at all times Mr. Pig?

For me my 30+ year old CB Naim active analog only system still delivers on what was promised and what I liked about it, and also the upgrade philosophy I was told at the time and still holds true today, upgrade the front end -for me it was recently a P10 & Aura- and the whole system is transformed for the better. Nothing I've heard in the past 20 years has me thinking of changing my system, and now with the P10 95% of the vinyl I play sounds fantastic, with my LP12's I was lucky to be happy with 70% of my collection.

But I do agree that very little remains from the Naim of 35 years ago in todays Naim. After Olive for Naim and the Klout/Kairn days for Linn I lost interest in these companys and pretty much all new Hi-Fi gear in general.

Avon said:
Naim has both good and bad points. Like most others here, I’m going to do some slagging off, but I did like the olive Naim sound a lot. I came to the conclusion that the “bit that’s missing” with olive era stuff is textural detail; the bit that allows you to hear the difference between say an oboe and a clarinet. By removing that texture, pace and rhythm are accentuated. Add it back and it becomes more difficult to follow the music, rather than just hear the sound.
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That's not a system issue, that's a front end/turntable issue.
 
I loved how my Naim system sounded. OK, I wasn't entirely convinced by the CDS2, but the 52/135s amps were fantastic. That is, until they encountered my Ergo E-Vs. The 135s weren't really up to it when cranking loud and bass-heavy music. That's when the dealer suggested an upgrade to NAP300, which I declined. Then it got personal. Shortly thereafter, I sold most of my Naim and bought Densen.

But history has a way of repeating itself. My beloved and completely unmolested NAC52 has found its way back to me. If I could just find a sensibly priced Supercap to get on the merry-go-round again :D.
 
The issue I have with Naim is price. It’s good kit, but not great I think. It certainly doesn’t merit the prices IMO. I’ve never seen it as high end at all. Like Linn, the marketing is, or has been, genius. As has the business plan.
 
Del monaco said:
The issue I have with Naim is price. It’s good kit, but not great I think. It certainly doesn’t merit the prices IMO. I’ve never seen it as high end at all.
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The stuff I liked (chrome bumper-era) was a really good price-spread from the first Nait right through to a totally unobtainable to me 32.5/HiCap/SNAXO and 6x135s for active Isobariks. I started with a 62/140, which wasn’t crazy price (I actually bought it new, which is rare for me), and then added a second hand HiCap later. That did me for a decade. Naim only went real ‘high-end’ for me when the 52 came out. That’s the point they looked at Absolute Sounds Audio Research, Krell etc pricing and thought “here, hold my beer…”.
 
HifiDan said:
To be honest, I really don’t get some of the negativity towards Naim or any other brand written on threads here. Here’s the thing: I flick through the forum and if I’m honest, I only click on what I’m interested in. My mind boggles why some feel the need to even click on a thread which the subject, regards a brand or something they either dislike or have any interest in let alone, post a reply/comment. I own Naim equipment as I like the way it sounds but I also have Rega, Michell, Russ Andrews, Townshend Audio gear too. Everyone is different, everyone likes different things. Some people buy a Ford, others buy a Vauxhall etc, some buy Naim, some buy Linn. It’s a personal preference at the end of the day and it’s entirely up to the individual on how they spend their hard earned cash.
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perfect answer, couldn’t have put it better myself. It’s your ears and money to choose what you like and enjoy, simple as that, there is no right or wrong. It’s a hobby with the actual aim to enjoy listening to music using whatever equipment meets your needs and taste. Some people just take it too seriously
 
Tony L said:
Naim only went real ‘high-end’ for me when the 52 came out.
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I was sat at a dealer (in Dunedin) in the early 1990s when I first laid eyes on the NAC52. I recall it was at least four times the price of a NAC72. The first example was sold to an older gentleman who listened exclusively to classical music.
 
James said:
I was sat at a dealer (in Dunedin) in the early 1990s when I first laid eyes on the NAC52. I recall it was at least four times the price of a NAC72. The first example was sold to an older gentleman who listened exclusively to classical music.
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James, did you ever come across any of the New Zealand assembled NAC22/NAP120 (possibly SNAPS too) that were put together by Avalon Audio?
 
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