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Naim: Is it personal?

Perhaps you have forgotten how patronising an environment 80s and 90s hifi shops were, and how intimidating. To this day I still remember some tosser in a Sevenoaks somewhere near leatherhead sneering at me when I expressed an interest in a Gyrodec in the window at about £700. "Right. What are you currently listening to? A Regs 2? It's probably too big a step up, I wouldn't recommend it for you. " Wxxker. His loss, I had the money in the bank and if he'd given me a demo I would almost certainly have carried it out of the shop. I had too many experiences like that, and if that's hifi shops then I don't mourn their passing.

Been there, done that. It was a well regarded Naim/Linn dealer (I was looking to upgrade my LP12 at the time) in the 90s iirc, and it's probably influenced my perception of their products ever since.

I named them on here many years ago, and was accused of lying. That didn't help either tbh.
 
I just never understood why people have got fleeced by dealers and bought kit they don't like. You're in the hands of a salesman. Never used a dealer, never will.
nNaim just seems to me like people can't be bothered to do their own research, pick up what hifi and go ooh that's good.

Dealer demos can be useful. As an example a 1989 demo of top line LP12 and Bricks of 3 amps, Naim and Linn were screechy but Exposure was excellent to this ex ESL owner. The dealer was very annoyed by my choice but the music was You're Under Arrest by Miles Davis. The Exposures were kept and enjoyed for 20 years.

1994 I hated CD players but the Naim CD3 was so good. The dealer insulted me but a Linn was again screechy I still have the CD3 and it still works fine, music was classical.

I put it down to me wearing motorcycle leathers but it was really down to bad overbearing dealerships. I now dress up to attend demos and am treated with respect.
 
…for me it’s the upgrade rabbit-hole I find tiresome. Products are fine though.
Upgrading completely optional though. I'm very happy with a modest setup which includes a pre and speakers most naimies wouldn't give the time of day ...
 
Not really a case of knowing better, in my eyes he’s been a persistent troll on these Naim threads so sod him frankly and if that makes me a twat then fine.
What, so you're going to pick him up on his English grammar? Fxxk me, I bet he's quaking.
 
My 2 cents. I enjoyed and probably still do enjoy the Naim sound. I will honestly hand that to them without hesitation. But, the company executives and various representatives are literally insufferable, except for Jason Gould. But they aren't as bad as the Design and Engineering team, who are smoking the really good stuff.

For example, their wonky engineering voodoo beliefs about DIN connections, mystical earthing design, always imminent Sword of Damocles RECAPPING holy grail obligations, the endless PSU upgrade path to empty your pockets further while proving that they should've designed proper power supplies in their units in the first place (like practically every other manufacturer on the planet), the mysterious admonitions about proper cable dressing, the unethical and wasteful requirement to leave their units powered up 24/7 in spite of eco-concerns, worldwide inflation and skyrocketing electricity costs, the unnatural, illogical and most probably ill-fated marriage with Focal, under the Vervent Audio holding structure, which gives way to a sonic nightmare of epic proportions and the incessant Marketing propaganda that suggests the opposite was a bit much for me.

There are two remaining straws that finally broke the camel's back:
1. Naim has always erroneously and dishonestly insisted that their cheapo ALPS Blue Velvet potentiometer implementations, which are systematically skewed off-balance, be it for volume of balance control on the integrateds and preamps, are "the best possible" because Steve Sells declared "they sound better". What a load of cr@p. I even had a major retailer tell me that if there is the (typical) imbalance then "you aren't using it as intended". LOL, obviously.
2. Probably the worst yet is the Naim forum and the Chinese-style censorship that is routinely practiced there. This is a well-known fact far and wide to both Naim users and non-Naim users. Free speech on internet forums does require some moderation, but an all-out metamorphosis into gigantic propaganda machine where only monolithic inputs conforming to the Party line are tolerated has turned theirs into a vast wasteland of self-congratulating fanboys.

So, not necessarily hating on Naim, just calling out things as they are. Your experience may be different.

I don’t think you are entirely “calling things as they are”. I think Steve Sells is right on the Alps and they sound great. And for that matter, Naim isn’t the only hifi manufacturer that uses these pots because they sound good. Naim does sometimes have an issue with their high gain circuit as many pots of this type can have an imbalance issue at low levels.
 
I don’t think you are entirely “calling things as they are”. I think Steve Sells is right on the Alps and they sound great. And for that matter, Naim isn’t the only hifi manufacturer that uses these pots because they sound good. Naim does sometimes have an issue with their high gain circuit as many pots of this type can have an imbalance issue at low levels.

Missing the points made by a country mile.
 
Dealer demos can be useful. As an example a 1989 demo of top line LP12 and Bricks of 3 amps, Naim and Linn were screechy but Exposure was excellent to this ex ESL owner. The dealer was very annoyed by my choice but the music was You're Under Arrest by Miles Davis. The Exposures were kept and enjoyed for 20 years.

1994 I hated CD players but the Naim CD3 was so good. The dealer insulted me but a Linn was again screechy I still have the CD3 and it still works fine, music was classical.

I put it down to me wearing motorcycle leathers but it was really down to bad overbearing dealerships. I now dress up to attend demos and am treated with respect.

I'd rather do my own research tbh. All my kit has been bought with no "home demo" and just carefully researched beforehand
 
Yeah, ISTR one bloke who went so far as to tear up his living room floorboards and install foundational footers for his Mana stacks. (not necessarily a bad idea, mind)

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Wow, imagine explaining that to guests. I'm assuming there was no spouse in the picture.
 
Missing the points made by a country mile.

Uh, I actually commented on point #1. The person literally notated this as point #1 and one of the two points that “broke the camel’s back”.

As for the rest of that post, too silly to comment on. Don’t care about the geniality of Naim’s directors, find some friends, don’t like DIN and power supplies, don’t buy it, don’t like energy use, shut off your pc and elsewhere, don’t like selling the company so that PS and JV’s family can get paid, give up your salary to charity or better, start your own audio company. Sheesh.
 
I know just how cynical it feels to have seemingly endless upgrade options when you own Naim gear. And to find that PSU is going to double the cost of your amp or cd player. But I think it’s fair enough from an engineering perspective and even a consumer choice. Sadly for many of us it’s a gateway drug :D

I’m not sure Naim were to blame for many of us feeling we needed that next step on the rung to Nirvana. I think the very nature of being an audiophile makes us susceptible to it and the opportunity it afforded dealers to pour fuel on our already burning desire is where the bigger issue lies. But ultimately I agree with @kernow and @Del monaco that it’s not really for me anymore.

Instead I have a Shanti powering a Pi with an Allo board and am constantly wondering what an improvement in the PSU for my Qutest would yield ?

Plus ça change!
 


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