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MDAC first listen (part XI)

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WAD62 said:
A question, the EDO (Enhanced Digital Output applet by Triode) has several benefits, firstly it turns off unwanted functionality such as the SBTs onboard DAC, gives a more 'optimised' linux kernel, but it also gives me an option of using USB out. I notice that in the applet notes it states that the M-DAC is one of the devices it's been successfully tested with, using the native USB out. Have you had any contact with the developer 'Triode'? Or is this something he's developing in isolation?

FYI I'm using COAX at the moment, but I may experiment with USB once everything has 'bedded in'...
Click to expand...

I'm using EDO with my SBT, connected via USB and it sounds wonderful. I remember a distinct improvement over coax. I did however need to connect it via a USB 2.0 hub to get the connection to sync properly (it correctly converts the SBT's USB 2 signal to the USB 1.1 required by the M-DAC, for want of a more precise explanation)

Now I wonder what benefits a USB isolator between the M-DAC and the hub would offer...
 
synackle said:
I'm using EDO with my SBT, connected via USB and it sounds wonderful. I remember a distinct improvement over coax. I did however need to connect it via a USB 2.0 hub to get the connection to sync properly (it correctly converts the SBT's USB 2 signal to the USB 1.1 required by the M-DAC, for want of a more precise explanation)

Now I wonder what benefits a USB isolator between the M-DAC and the hub would offer...
Click to expand...

I had a brief experiment the other day, I just selected the USB out (non work-around option) and it worked quite well apart from some occasional dropouts, which I figured could be solved with some buffer 'tuning'...perhaps I need to try a USB hub...as for an isolator, there's no end to this 'game' is there, there's always something that might just get that extra ounce!!!
 
WAD62 said:
I had a brief experiment the other day, I just selected the USB out (non work-around option) and it worked quite well apart from some occasional dropouts, which I figured could be solved with some buffer 'tuning'...perhaps I need to try a USB hub...as for an isolator, there's no end to this 'game' is there, there's always something that might just get that extra ounce!!!
Click to expand...

Yeah I tried without a hub, loads of dropouts and I don't think 96kHz would work either, hub is definitely the way to go IMO. I certainly don't hear the need for an isolator but nonetheless I'm curious to try! In theory noise on the USB cable is the only remaining limiting factor in supplying noise-free bit-perfect asynchronous data to the M-DAC
 
synackle said:
Yeah I tried without a hub, loads of dropouts and I don't think 96kHz would work either, hub is definitely the way to go IMO. I certainly don't hear the need for an isolator but nonetheless I'm curious to try! In theory noise on the USB cable is the only remaining limiting factor in supplying noise-free bit-perfect asynchronous data to the M-DAC
Click to expand...

...any recommendations with regard to the USB Hub?
 
WAD62 said:
...any recommendations with regard to the USB Hub
Click to expand...

Any old cheap-ass USB 2.0 hub (I used one that was lying around the office, it even has loads of garish LEDs in it which actually look kinda cool glowing behind my hi-fi cabinet), plug the hub into the SBT and the the M-DAC into one of the hub's ports, et voila!
 
In my setup the difference between using an isolator and not using one is extremly subtle.

With speakers I'd never notice it, with headphones it is very slightly noticeable.

Odly enough I prefer the sound more when not using the isolator.
I find the sound to be very slightly warmer, yet with apparent improvements in upper midrange detail. Again I cannot stress this enough... it's very very subtle.

I use a WireWorld Silver Starlight USB cable from my desktop PC to the M-DAC which has the data and power transmition lines well separated within the cable, so maybe this has something to do with it?


Still at the cost of most USB isolators, I do recommend trying one out in your system. Worst case it doesn't improve anything - but at least you know ;)
 
Jeez, I got an hp laptop with integrated beats audio drivers, now I noticed that I can control the M-dac volume through the beats, I wonder if it effects the sound quality i'm receiving..
it controls everything, bah.
 
I finished setting up my second MDac into the study... Using an imac with ssd playing via Amarra, USB to the mdac, feeding a wooaudio WA2, Sennheiser Hd650 cans.... Top, top sound.... I wish I had now bought the woo and the mdac in silver to match the study.. But the sound is awesome... Detailed, engaging, loads of body to the music, warm without sacrificing Hf (moon audio silver dragon cables help the Hf)....

Happy long weekend here for me.... Listened to Music most of the day....
 
dadab12 said:
Jeez, I got an hp laptop with integrated beats audio drivers, now I noticed that I can control the M-dac volume through the beats, I wonder if it effects the sound quality i'm receiving..
it controls everything, bah.
Click to expand...

Does the volume level indicator change on the MDAC's display ie change form say -25dB to -30dB when you reduce the level - or simply the playback level changes with no level change on the MDAC display?

If the playback level changes with no level change on the MDAC display then this is bad news - your "beats" driver is messing with the Audio Data...

Goto the Wiki and try the Bit perfect test to confirm your Data is being streamed to the MDAC is "unmolested"... I suspect not... maybe call me a snob, but "Beats" does not sound promising...

John
 
synackle said:
Any old cheap-ass USB 2.0 hub (I used one that was lying around the office, it even has loads of garish LEDs in it which actually look kinda cool glowing behind my hi-fi cabinet), plug the hub into the SBT and the the M-DAC into one of the hub's ports, et voila!
Click to expand...

Ultra Bright Blue LED's will be fitted to your MPAX / MAMP - as your obviously a very a sick pup!!!
 
delange said:
Wow John, you never stop to amaze me with the high level of customer support you guys stand for. If all brands would listen to their customers like you guys do...
I too like the quality phono stage option in the MPAX. Considering all the additions, will you still have room to fit all those things?
Also, would the tuner be fitted by default in the MPAX? I'm not to keen on that idea and would prefer it without a tuner. I still use my beloved Revox B760 for that purpose. I don't even use the Internet radio capabilities of my SBT because of the poor SQ provided by Internet radio.
Click to expand...

Only the MTRN will have the tuner as its a software defined RF design - so relies on the MDAC for final audio conversion (which should result in pretty decent performance)... its practically for free, adding less then GBP10 to the MTRNS cost to the end user so that's why we decided to include it - and considering its going to to be pretty much "state of the art" - then why not...

John
 
WAD62 said:
Absolutely agree John, even when I only have single amp terminals I still bi-wire if my speakers are bi-wirable, it tightens up the bass IMHO

My main system is bi-amped/bi-wired and then one can really notice a difference, 8000P on my bass, & an 8000SX for the treble, fed by an SB Touch (EDO 0.7, MG-PSU), M-DAC as pre (A0.8 @ 180degree).

The touch and its PSU are new, so they are bedding in nicely, bass clarity and soundstage are getting better by the day.

A question, the EDO (Enhanced Digital Output applet by Triode) has several benefits, firstly it turns off unwanted functionality such as the SBTs onboard DAC, gives a more 'optimised' linux kernel, but it also gives me an option of using USB out. I notice that in the applet notes it states that the M-DAC is one of the devices it's been successfully tested with, using the native USB out. Have you had any contact with the developer 'Triode'? Or is this something he's developing in isolation?

FYI I'm using COAX at the moment, but I may experiment with USB once everything has 'bedded in'...
Click to expand...

Adrian (Triode) has basically worked on the application on his own, but Dominik worked with Adrian on external USB hub solution to correct an issue with the the Freescale's OTG USB controller used in the SBT.
 
JohnW said:
Have been thinking about it... I might be able to add a internal location for "Plug-in" option card... much like the optional attenuator card.

The MTRN has a VERY decent FM/AM Tuner - we might be able to open up SW world band support - however there will be some spot "frequencies" that will be blocked by internal interference.

However, I'm have nothing to do with DAB...

John
Click to expand...

i know what you mean about DAB, but the BBC in their wisdom have put 6music on there along with the 5live family of stations, which I usually have burbling on in the background all day like a lot of people.
 
JohnW said:
Does the volume level indicator change on the MDAC's display ie change form say -25dB to -30dB when you reduce the level - or simply the playback level changes with no level change on the MDAC display?

If the playback level changes with no level change on the MDAC display then this is bad news - your "beats" driver is messing with the Audio Data...

Goto the Wiki and try the Bit perfect test to confirm your Data is being streamed to the MDAC is "unmolested"... I suspect not... maybe call me a snob, but "Beats" does not sound promising...

John
Click to expand...

Thanks John,
what do you mean by playback level? the playback device stay as M-dac
but you can just control the db, mute from the beats completely, and it is shown on the led indicator, it's like it has control over the m-dac.
I tried to uninstall the beats drivers but it's just reinstalling them again on system startup..
I'll run the bitperfect test bah
 
dadab12 said:
Thanks John,
what do you mean by playback level? the playback device stay as M-dac
but you can just control the db, mute from the beats completely, and it is shown on the led indicator, it's like it has control over the m-dac.
I tried to uninstall the beats drivers but it's just reinstalling them again on system startup..
I'll run the bitperfect test bah
Click to expand...

So adjusting the volume level on the beats software changes the gain level indicator on the Mdac? (not the bargraph, but the Volume level setting)?

Sounds like you have enabled the "USB Volume" option in the MDAC Menu options to "accept Control"

John
 
JohnW said:
So adjusting the volume level on the beats software changes the gain level indicator on the Mdac? (not the bargraph, but the Volume level setting)?

Sounds like you have enabled the "USB Volume" option in the MDAC Menu options to "accept Control"

John
Click to expand...

yeah, I see it now. so it should be ok now? ;o
yeah no control over the m-dac now from the beats, still I don't like the beats at all they seem bad
 
I'd still run the Bit perfect test - I'd not be surprised if the beats software is messing with the Audio data being streamed to the MDAC...

I might be wrong - but no harm in confirming via the MDAC's Bit perfect test....

John
 
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