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General Election 2024

MVV said:
Pious w***, w*****g. I realise exactly what I'm doing. I'm giving a party a chance of making a positive difference. They may disappoint me, but there is no alternative; see it as an experiment. If it fails you can go back into your basement and type endlessly about something that no one even can be bothered to read.
Hey, have you heard this:
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Oh dear, so rude. From the man who doesn’t like to bicker too.

How do you expect voting for more neoliberalism to make any difference to the problems caused by neoliberalism? It won’t happen. It can’t happen.

You do know that “there is no alternative” is literally a classic Thatcherite saying, don’t you? It’s a story, a myth to preserve a failed ideology

PS, yes, I have heard that song before, you posted it earlier, did you forget?
 
ks.234 said:
What Starmer has said to members has been lies. That much should be obvious

What Starmer has promised to ‘wealth creators’, Freeports, private Health providers is quite another. Starmer won’t tell lies to it’s sponsors

The only investment Labour have promised will come from PFI in all but name and the magical growth they have promised to deliver by copying the same Tory fiscal rules that have failed to deliver anything but decline since the 70’s
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Your realistic alternative is? Do you really not want rid of this tory govt?

Best to support the change of govt then judge Labour on what they actually do seems a sensible way forward.
 
So who is this Social Democrat that will revive public services plug the 20 billion pound hole and tax the rich so they don't simultaneously run off with all their money?

They would get my vote.
 
Brian said:
Your realistic alternative is? Do you really not want rid of this tory govt?

Best to support the change of govt then judge Labour on what they actually do seems a sensible way forward.
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I want to get rid of the Tory Ideology that has caused so much damage, but that isn’t going to happen. But that does not mean I have to vote for more Tory ideology just because it is wrapped in red.

I am judging Labour on what they are saying now, and everything they are saying now is framed in the same narrative that has caused so much damage and decline so far and can only do so again in the future.
 
ks.234 said:
I want to get rid of the Tory Ideology that has caused so much damage, but that isn’t going to happen. But that does not mean I have to vote for more Tory ideology just because it is wrapped in red.

I am judging Labour on what they are saying now, and everything they are saying now is framed in the same narrative that has caused so much damage and decline so far and can only do so again in the future.
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I want rid of tory ideology too. What is your realistic suggestion for making progress?

There is an election next week and there is yet another chance to remove these parasites from govt.
 
Brian said:
I want rid of tory ideology too. What is your realistic suggestion for making progress?

There is an election next week and there is yet another chance to remove these parasites from govt.
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Labour subscribe to the same parasitic ideals as the Tories.
 
Brian said:
Yes, you've said. You ignored my question.


Until they are in govt we don't know. What do you suggest? Another term for the tories?
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We do know, because all of Labour’s spending plans are predicated on growth and their plans for growth are based on the same jam tomorrow trickle down economics.
 
ks.234 said:
We do know, because all of Labour’s spending plans are predicated on growth and their plans for growth are based on the same jam tomorrow trickle down economics.
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No, we don't know. According to you, they lie, remember.

On an almost daily basis I read of billions £££ squandered by the tories.

Labour speak of growth, people will get that, but proper spending of the billions stolen and wasted by the tories will go a long way. I doubt that will get much traction in the tory owned media though, so growth it is. Whatever it takes to remove the tories.
 
mandryka said:
What's the nature of the collusion? Is it that they have actually met formally or informally and resolved together not to speak about certain things? What does either side -- politicians and media -- have to gain by the collusion?
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"I'm sure you believe everything that you're saying, but I'm saying if you believed something different you wouldn't be sitting where you're sitting."

 
Brian said:
No, we don't know. According to you, they lie, remember.

On an almost daily basis I read of billions £££ squandered by the tories.

Labour speak of growth, people will get that, but proper spending of the billions stolen and wasted by the tories will go a long way. I doubt that will get much traction in the tory owned media though, so growth it is. Whatever it takes to remove the tories.
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No, you’ve misread what I said.

Labour can’t spend the billions that have been stolen, because they’ve been stolen.

Labour’s plan for growth is the same as the Tories. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is insanity

You keep saying “remove the Tories”, but replacing them with the same thing is not an alternative.

You vote for more of the same thing that has caused damage and decline if you like. I will be voting for the party that best represents my values
 
That’s fine. But in FPTP only Labour or Conservative can win. Brian thinks Labour is the better option, which seems reasonable. A fag paper between them is still a fag paper.

I think what I’ve said above has been stated around 1000 times, just on this thread, by many people. Your response remains the same, that they are the same, only they’re not, quite.

It’s a very simple question: Labour or Tory, and for most it’s Labour. Who is it for you?
 
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