Rockmeister
pfm Member
This, the most depressing post of all. How can you misunderstand so completely?What an utterly depressing thread. I'm staggered that some members think sex with a 12 year old child is OK.
This, the most depressing post of all. How can you misunderstand so completely?What an utterly depressing thread. I'm staggered that some members think sex with a 12 year old child is OK.
Well given it was illegal then and illegal now, I think we can assume it was generally viewed the same way. Unlike say homosexuality which was once illegal but is now mostly accepted and not illegal.
The idea that f-cking pre pubescent kids in the 60s was thought of as ok is bullshit. Ask a parent.
This, the most depressing post of all. How can you misunderstand so completely?
He was apparently on a UK tour at the time.... yet we are on to page 12?
I find the puritanical, back to Victorian values, holier than thou hand wringing most worrying personally!
They'll be covering the legs of pianos and sending someone from the council to find out why you weren't at church this morning next!
No wonder music has died a death now that the mandated rider includes kale and quinoa bio yogurt, a bottle of designer spring water then an early night!
One of your finest moments.
On a music thread I might nearly agree with you but here where we are discussing the possible abuse of a 12 year old girl the comments are just so crass.
I guess none of us want this to be true but if it is there is no excuse or justification. I presume we can at least agree on that?
.sjb
Oh dear. We are sheep, we are led by our dicks, she was asking for it, we have no control, it is her fault, look at her - the way she is dressed - clearly begging for it, what is a man supposed to do, presented with such provocation.My posts are trying to open closed minds apparently already clutching the noose. I pose alternatives to the image of the virginal sugar sweet child as an exercise in fairness. Look at your own wording. You repeatedly refer to abuse. I point out that females are as capable of a deliberate act as any man. I have NOT condoned under age sex, in fact twice expressed my concerns. What I have said is that men can be led by sexual desire and, putting 2+2, it happened quite regularly. If it has happened to an under age child against her/his will, that’s rape and if proven, the abuser goes to jail. If the child in question planned the act for gain, then it’s wrong on both sides. In an ideal world, yes, all adults should be responsible and honest, and yes no child should, until the age of consent be able to go into a sexual relationship without getting noticed and advised, but that’s not how we are. We are flawed. You are, I am and a lot of kids certainly are so, this stuff happens. Im going to sum my position then stop.
This is not Utopia. No ‘we should’ argument makes any sense. We are flawed. We are Sheep.
The law tries to protect the more vulnerable sheep but within that flock are those who don’t want to do the good stuff. And 100 more character flaws and on and on. Maybe, Dylan’s accuser is one such. Maybe not, but the possibility needs to be examined in court.
Under what name do you write in the grauniad? Have you built the gallows yet for the obviously guilty Mr Dylan, who was out of the USA at the time? Are you doing penance to cleanse your soul of the deadly sin of once having actually liked the music of this monster who's almost certainly completely innocent?
I guess none of us want this to be true but if it is there is no excuse or justification. I presume we can at least agree on that?
Have you built the gallows yet for the obviously guilty Mr Dylan
Well given it was illegal then and illegal now, I think we can assume it was generally viewed the same way. Unlike say homosexuality which was once illegal but is now mostly accepted and not illegal.
The idea that f-cking pre pubescent kids in the 60s was thought of as ok is bullshit. Ask a parent.
I think Rockmeister's posts try to analyse, dispassionately and objectively, the "zeitgeist" of 1965. What really horrifies me are posts that lay down moral law, with emotional and self-righteous indignation in 2021 UK, as if this were the only and universal law and the only morally defensible position possible. All other angles and nuances being condemned as heresy. I would not be surprised if these same people would also pass judgment on "what kind" of sex people have, not just what is legal or illegal, but what is morally "appropriate." Is adultery to be condemned, for instance? Oral or anal sex? Bondage and S/M? Group sex? What is "appropriate" and what isn't? Who are the judges?
Finally you got it! Good description of what? 25% of western males, maybe a bit higher. I know a fair few men exactly like that.The second bit, from “it’s her fault, to …provocation”, you just made up. Careful now.Oh dear. We are sheep, we are led by our dicks, she was asking for it, we have no control, it is her fault, look at her - the way she is dressed - clearly begging for it, what is a man supposed to do, presented with such provocation.
Well, rocky?
Can't say this LP cover really helped matters re. the rumours....
For information: the translucent 'Deluxe' banner was not on the original release and the model was by all accounts 11 years old.
Laws were in place in the 60's to deal with underage sex & paedophilia so time is no excuse for taking advantage of vulnerable children. It is precisely why we have laws for historical abuse.Just as we can only judge the Victorian slave traders within the context of the mores of their time, so we have to view the prevailing attitudes in the 1960s. We can say, from our current perspective, that they were wrong, and we won’t condone these actions now, but what do we do now that will be condemned in 2 generations’ time? Driving cars with one occupant, flying for frivolous purposes like leisure?