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Brexit: give me a positive effect... X

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Enfield boy said:
Not sure about shaking hands with covid patients. I saw (possibly one of the wonderful Led by Donkeys videos) a nurse from Northampton(?) hospital quoted as saying BoJo had visited that hospital and it was the only visit he'd done at the right time to fit. There were no covid sufferers there and he didn't go round shaking hands. So, Boris was in fact keeping himself safe, just lying about it later. What a great leader.
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Try 59 seconds into the video on the Tweet...

https://twitter.com/ThatTimWalker/status/1354138547868069893
 
TheDecameron said:
If you took the Chinese government completely out of the equation do you believe there would or wouldn’t be a global pandemic?
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There quite possibly may be at some point, but not when it happened or nearly as bad. Just look at China’s track record with SARS / MERS etc. Unfortunately I feel this is the warm up act. Nature will always win.
 
Man whose position as PM was enabled by the lies he told persuading people to leave an economic and political union is breaking his own lockdown laws trying to persuade another group of people to stay in economic and political union.

Stephen
 
Ponty said:
Absolutely not. I’ve not seen my father since December 2019. My choice because it’s the right thing to do.

Unfortunately what we are seeing now is a death spike resulting from Christmas mixing, much of it against the rules no doubt. By then, there was no excuse for anyone not to be aware of and fully understand the risks of C19. Yet here we are, witnessing tragic loss.
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Whatever the truth of that, the fact remains that Corbyn urged more stringent measures a full week before the first lockdown (almost certain he did it before that but can't find a suitable reference).

Had Boris Johnson taken that advice we would have saved 20000+ lives in the first wave.

Therefore, your original claim:
Yep, wonderful in hindsight. Can you image if Boris had shut the whole country and borders down with a handful of cases and zero deaths? The opposition (whoever they are) would be protesting, demanding the evidence.
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is false and you would acknowledge that if you had any integrity.
 
Ponty said:
There quite possibly may be at some point, but not when it happened or nearly as bad. Just look at China’s track record with SARS / MERS etc. Unfortunately I feel this is the warm up act. Nature will always win.
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Can you help me then? What would China have had to have done to prevent the virus spreading worldwide? It’s important because you are applying responsibility to the Chinese government and I’d like to hear why you believe that?
 
TheDecameron said:
Can you help me then? What would China have had to have done to prevent the virus spreading worldwide? It’s important because you are applying responsibility to the Chinese government and I’d like to hear why you believe that?
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Release the virus code as soon as their scientists discovered it (very quickly). Watch the BBC2 documentary. Their scientists knew. Their govt gagged them until it was too late.
 
I recall a young Chinese doctor who was getting himself on social media and so on and trying to warn the world that the Chinese govt were hushing up what was potentially a brewing pandemic.

He quite suddenly apparently contracted covid, and died. He seems to have been quietly forgotten.
 
Ponty said:
Release the virus code as soon as their scientists discovered it (very quickly). Watch the BBC2 documentary. Their scientists knew. Their govt gagged them until it was too late.
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Releasing the virus genome wouldn’t have stopped the very rapid spread of the disease worldwide. What stops spread is fast public health restrictions.

On 31 Dec a cluster of pneumonias of unknown cause was reported, ten days later China had identified a brand new virus, the following day they had carried out the sequencing and shared the genome with the world. Shortly after the entire city of Wuhan was shut down- no one enters, no one leaves. 11 million people. Measures described here as ‘draconian’, Johnson even said freedom loving Brits would never tolerate this degree of interference with their liberty. Once the disease arrived here it then became the responsibility of the Prime Minister.

British deaths per million- 1,500. China? 3.4
 
droodzilla said:
Whatever the truth of that, the fact remains that Corbyn urged more stringent measures a full week before the first lockdown (almost certain he did it before that but can't find a suitable reference).

Had Boris Johnson taken that advice we would have saved 20000+ lives in the first wave.

Therefore, your original claim:

is false and you would acknowledge that if you had any integrity.
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I just follow the rules and take personal responsibility. The gang is out in good force today, are you Chinese govt bots?
 
TheDecameron said:
Releasing the virus genome wouldn’t have stopped the very rapid spread of the disease worldwide. What stops spread is fast public health restrictions.

On 31 Dec a cluster of pneumonias of unknown cause was reported, ten days later China had identified a brand new virus, the following day they carried out the sequencing and shared the genome with the world. Shortly after the entire city of Wuhan was shut down- no one enters, no one leaves. 11 million people. Measures described here as ‘draconian’, Johnson even said freedom loving Brits would never tolerate this degree of interference with their liberty. Once the disease arrived here it then became the responsibility of the Prime Minister.

British deaths per million- 1,500. China? 3.4
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You believe their data?! That’s brilliant! Morons here can’t even put on a mask or stop visiting friends in each other’s houses. We’ve got no chance!
 
Ponty said:
You believe their data?! That’s brilliant!
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Yes, the genome was a Chinese fake. I am interested though in understanding why you think the Chinese government is responsible for the current situation. What could they have done differently?
 
SteveS1 said:
None of which has anything to do with Johnson missing Cobra meetings (just the five) or being behind every single part of this tragedy as well as enriching his donors as part of it. You need to get your blinkers off. Johnson was still shaking hands with COVID patients as Italy was being over-run and Goodwood went ahead just before Johnson shutdown - even then allowing everyone a nice last minute superspreading evening or two before pubs were finallly shut. All of which he had to be dragged into doing. Indeed some of the sports bodies started shutting down before compulsion.

Even after the first experience he was still ignoring SAGE and delaying taking action in the autumn prior to his pathetic Christmas comments - which he still only half backed away from. The delay there has cost many lives. This man was always a dangerous opportunist with a craven need to be popular, he hasn't changed - we are not enduring the worst response by some accident.
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Excellent examples.

You could add the care homes, PPE procurement, 'eat out to help out', sending 3 million kids back to school to mingle for a single day before deciding to close them. There are plenty more.

In essence too little, too late, every step of the way.
 
droodzilla said:
No. Absolutely not. Exponential growth = every single day is crucial.

At that time the number of cases was doubling every week, if not every few days.

Therefore, if lockdown had happened when Corbyn asked about it, the number of deaths in the first wave would have been halved, at the very least. That's basic maths.

It's also 25000 families that would not have had to mourn the loss of a mother, father, sister, brother.

Funny how Tories only ever apply the principle of personal responsibility to non-Tories.
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Indeed.
Going by pontys logic there was no point in any lockdown once the cat was out of the bag.

Should have just let it 'run hot' as I believe mr gove suggested.
 
Ponty said:
I just follow the rules and take personal responsibility. The gang is out in good force today, are you Chinese govt bots?
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I have not commented on China because it is not relevant to my point. Show some integrity and admit you were wrong.

And, frankly, your insinuation that I am a Chinese government bot is insulting. I have no time whatsoever for governments that trash human rights.
 
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