dan m
pfm Member
Well I've got about 300 ea. of classical LPs and CDs, so maybe not much point in getting the highlights. That Decca set is tempting, but I still haven't head got through that huge Mozart box yet.
Big box of Decca
- Thread starter Basil
- Start date
Well I've got about 300 ea. of classical LPs and CDs, so maybe not much point in getting the highlights. That Decca set is tempting, but I still haven't head got through that huge Mozart box yet.
Barrymagrec
pfm Member
My feeling is that we are in a silly price period for CDs and that when the likes of HMV go down the tubes (as surely they will) Amazon prices will go up significantly. It follows that the smart thing is to buy what you can while the going is good (that`s my excuse anyway)
We do indeed live in surreal times. I used to have dreams about being in shops and being able to take any record I wanted, and it has now sort of come true.
The heartening thing about the Decca box is that it is such a beautiful thing in and of itself (magnets, essays etc.), and someone has taken an enormous amount of trouble, searching out nice copies of albums to scan, tucking in little extras etc.
Compare and contract with the EMI Britten Collector's set:
A fantastic bargain of real top drawer alternatives to Britten's own Decca recordings. However, the inner sleeves comprise 37 - that's THIRTY SEVEN - identical colour photographs of a seagull on a pole. Talk about Friday afternoon slackness in EMI's graphics department ....playing Angry Birds, perhaps?
If the record company can't be bothered to make even the faintest attempt at enthusiasm for its magnificent back catalogue, why should we be arsed to buy it. I can play a game and torrent at the same time without breaking a sweat, no probs.
palp
The 'selections' 5 disc arrangement of the Decca box is such crap though - just who would want a single movement of a violin concerto here, and a movement of a symphony there - and would they give a toss about 'Decca Sound'?
Deliver it straight to charity shops and cut out the middle man.
The heartening thing about the Decca box is that it is such a beautiful thing in and of itself (magnets, essays etc.), and someone has taken an enormous amount of trouble, searching out nice copies of albums to scan, tucking in little extras etc.
Compare and contract with the EMI Britten Collector's set:
A fantastic bargain of real top drawer alternatives to Britten's own Decca recordings. However, the inner sleeves comprise 37 - that's THIRTY SEVEN - identical colour photographs of a seagull on a pole. Talk about Friday afternoon slackness in EMI's graphics department ....playing Angry Birds, perhaps?
If the record company can't be bothered to make even the faintest attempt at enthusiasm for its magnificent back catalogue, why should we be arsed to buy it. I can play a game and torrent at the same time without breaking a sweat, no probs.
palp
The 'selections' 5 disc arrangement of the Decca box is such crap though - just who would want a single movement of a violin concerto here, and a movement of a symphony there - and would they give a toss about 'Decca Sound'?
Deliver it straight to charity shops and cut out the middle man.
Best thing that ever happened to classical music.
Barrymagrec
pfm Member
Enough already - ordered - and - http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B005SQ3AU8/?tag=pinkfishmedia-21 should all keep me quiet for a while...
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Nic Robinson
Moderator
It's gone up on Amazon. £80.80 now. Still £76.47 delivered on HMV, however. Just ordered one (gave up waiting for it to go down lol!
Nic Robinson
Moderator
I listen to classical vinyl all the time and have hardly any issues with surface noise. What did you used to do with your records?
It's not what he did to them but what the previous owner or owner's did, and what they played them with...
Plus, for whatever reason, records bought brand new develop pops 'n' clicks over the years, especially new stuff in the final years when more and more lp's were pressed using re-cycled vinyl.
To offset the negativity, a few hints to prevent, or at least slow the addition of more pops 'n' clicks.
Never lift the cart from a record whilst playing.
Never lower it into a record, mid side, unless there is a gap.
Always replace hard plastic inner sleeves and bare paper or card ones with the matt, soft plastic ones.
Keep the record mat or platter surface surgically clean.
And the top tip, if the recording is available on CD, buy the CD!
Tony L
Administrator
All good advice, and I'd add get a wet vacuum record cleaner, or buy your classical vinyl from a shop that uses one - I'd not consider playing (or selling) a second hand classical album that hadn't had a run through a good RCM. On the whole I find classical vinyl very good, all the good labels took great care and had a pride in their product seldom seen today, though obviously if there are flaws it's more obvious in this genre than any other.
Sods law is strong here...
It always seems that if a record is going to get scratched, it's always at a quiet point...!*
However, pops 'n' clicks are minor compared with mis-tracking on opera sets. Vinyl simply doesn't have the cojones for loud choral passages... even from new.
My advice, stick to chamber music on vinyl.
* of course there is no mystery here, just common sense. Surface noise is always more noticable during quiet passages...
Amendment to my list:
Never lift the cart from a record whilst playing, unless a dust bunny forms and starts to cause mis-tracking by lifting the stylus out of the groove. I've had these things appear on absolutely spotless records... nasty little buggers!
Oh and a record cleaner is a good idea, but given a large collection, a killer of listening time that has no equal...
Ha ha... all your base are belong to us...
Seriously, hope you enjoy it and the Elgar.
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Tony L
Administrator
I've never had even the slightest issue with damage due to cuing mid track, though I always use the lever. Can I ask what arm / cart you used? It doesn't match my own experience at all.
Three, over the vinyl years, an RB300 on a Rega 3 and LP12 replaced by an ARO and finally the Spacedeck and Ace-Space.
Carts on the Rega; Rega Elys, Ortofon MC15, MC20
LP12 MC20, Rohmann, Lyra a blue one, can't remember the name.
The Lyra stayed with the Spacedeck, and a Skala was added, which I wore out in a year as I fully retired and free time expanded, this was the primary catalyst which prompted the final switch to digital.
ps,
The Rohmann is still in use, very infrequent use, but I still have a few lps I haven't managed to track down on CD yet... but this year has been good, Decca finally re-released one of my favoutire Brahms first symphonies by Josef Krips and the Viena Phil, I've been searching for this on CD for 10 years!
The lp I have, and I've only ever seen the copy I own, is well shagged!
Carts on the Rega; Rega Elys, Ortofon MC15, MC20
LP12 MC20, Rohmann, Lyra a blue one, can't remember the name.
The Lyra stayed with the Spacedeck, and a Skala was added, which I wore out in a year as I fully retired and free time expanded, this was the primary catalyst which prompted the final switch to digital.
ps,
The Rohmann is still in use, very infrequent use, but I still have a few lps I haven't managed to track down on CD yet... but this year has been good, Decca finally re-released one of my favoutire Brahms first symphonies by Josef Krips and the Viena Phil, I've been searching for this on CD for 10 years!
The lp I have, and I've only ever seen the copy I own, is well shagged!
Nic Robinson
Moderator
Although classical on CD is certainly free from surface imperfections and mis-tracking, I always come back to the vinyl. There is something about the immediacy and glow of the sound that just makes me want to listen to side after side in a session. CD just sounds like background noise and invariably I want to do something else after a while listening in digital.
I’ve been listening to classical vinyl and CDs for decades and have never had the sheer listening pleasure from digital that I get from vinyl.
It’s true that some records seem to have trouble with choral and organ music, but many others are perfect. In fact, many of the ones that struggle respond well to a wet clean. Charity shop records that are shagged when I get them home and clean them just get binned. But these are not in the majority.
As for opera, choral, organ etc. I don’t think there’s any music the medium can’t handle. An example that comes to mind is Belshazzar’s Feast with Previn on EMI. The massive forces of orchestra, brass bands and choir are never too much for the medium. The CD I own of the same recording sounds insipid and flat by comparison. Similarly with La Nativite, Jennifer Bate, the vinyl is crystal clear without an ounce of distortion. The very well mastered CD is just missing something by comparison. I could go on. There have been some very good re-masters to CD in recent years. Decca legends is a good example. And yet, I always return to my vinyl copy if I want to really listen and enjoy the music.
I have to say that mis-tracking is much less of a problem on difficult records since I ditched the LP12. The Lenco does that side of things so much better.
Anyway, those are the views of an unreconstructed classical vinyl fan. CD has its place on digitally sourced, modern recordings for sure. For the classical music of the vinyl era, there is only one medium to listen on imho.
I’ve been listening to classical vinyl and CDs for decades and have never had the sheer listening pleasure from digital that I get from vinyl.
It’s true that some records seem to have trouble with choral and organ music, but many others are perfect. In fact, many of the ones that struggle respond well to a wet clean. Charity shop records that are shagged when I get them home and clean them just get binned. But these are not in the majority.
As for opera, choral, organ etc. I don’t think there’s any music the medium can’t handle. An example that comes to mind is Belshazzar’s Feast with Previn on EMI. The massive forces of orchestra, brass bands and choir are never too much for the medium. The CD I own of the same recording sounds insipid and flat by comparison. Similarly with La Nativite, Jennifer Bate, the vinyl is crystal clear without an ounce of distortion. The very well mastered CD is just missing something by comparison. I could go on. There have been some very good re-masters to CD in recent years. Decca legends is a good example. And yet, I always return to my vinyl copy if I want to really listen and enjoy the music.
I have to say that mis-tracking is much less of a problem on difficult records since I ditched the LP12. The Lenco does that side of things so much better.
Anyway, those are the views of an unreconstructed classical vinyl fan. CD has its place on digitally sourced, modern recordings for sure. For the classical music of the vinyl era, there is only one medium to listen on imho.
Cheese
Bitter lover
Well I got this today and listened to a few middle period sonatas, among them the Appassionata.
I bought it because the Backhaus box is sort of 'legendary' and I expected a fairly dusty interpretation - not so at all. It's simply one of the greatest boxes I've bought in many years.
Some others (Richter) have turned the Appassionata into a fireworks and it's certainly great too, but Backhaus just plays it 'right' somehow.
Backhaus playing is IMO a prime example of 'reduce to the max' interpretation, no gimmicks whatsoever and even a fairly dull tone, but somehow these sonatas - works I have listened to for many years - are more beautiful by Backhaus than by anyone else. I guess Arrau may come close, but I reckon my search has ended now, Backhaus nailed it. Bliss.
Nic Robinson
Moderator
Wonderful. For me there is nobody to match him in Brahms. I might have to get the Beethoven box.
THanks,
Nic.
THanks,
Nic.
seagull
Seabird flavour member
So what is wrong with that?
Are you sure they were identical? That could be construed as being seabirdist. Not all seagulls are the same.
Nic - I used to have quite a large collection of Classical vinyl, bought new between the early 60s and the dawn of CD, which I loved dearly. Clicks and surface noise were either just there from the start, or appeared from nowhere as the years went by (and I have always been very careful with my stuff) I found that baroque and closely-miked instrumental music (harpsichord, guitar, cello etc) always worked well enough on vinyl - i.e. stuff which has a limited dynamic range, but then when you get to opera, Mahler (very much a composer of the CD age) and a lot else (especially stuff that goes mental in the last movement), I found it became a trial. I know that some people can completely ignore surface noise, and I envy them. For me it is like finding my seat at the Festival Hall and then noticing a bronchitic old man sitting purposefully with a large sheet of bubblewrap across his knees in the next row.
I completely understand the joys of collecting analogue vinyl (and the strokeable box sets & lovely librettos with readable typefaces)and also your point about analogue warmth (or colouration or whatever), but this Decca box shows that we really can have it all. In fact if every mini-sleeve was 'laminated with Clarifoil' then life would be completely perfect.
For me (and, I suspect Basil) once I had heard a classical CD, then really, that was it. So obviously superior in so many ways that I never bought classical vinyl again. My big mistake at this time was thinking that digital recordings would automatically be better, which was of course nonsense, and I've got some right old toss as a result, and now the majority of my purchases now seem to be older recordings.
palp
I completely understand the joys of collecting analogue vinyl (and the strokeable box sets & lovely librettos with readable typefaces)and also your point about analogue warmth (or colouration or whatever), but this Decca box shows that we really can have it all. In fact if every mini-sleeve was 'laminated with Clarifoil' then life would be completely perfect.
For me (and, I suspect Basil) once I had heard a classical CD, then really, that was it. So obviously superior in so many ways that I never bought classical vinyl again. My big mistake at this time was thinking that digital recordings would automatically be better, which was of course nonsense, and I've got some right old toss as a result, and now the majority of my purchases now seem to be older recordings.
palp