richardg
Admonishtrator
I always thought we weren't paying enough for the studios to turn the big pair on!
Audiophiles v sound engineers
- Thread starter Knipester
- Start date
moo-fi
pfm Member
Many of the large monitors are only ever used when clients are around or if a mix is causing real problems. As for volume levels, some of the old school producers listen at insane levels, but most current producers and engineers would walk out if the volume gets much over 85db (H & S and remember that our ears are our tools).
The other question I can comment on, is the choice of music does have a bearing on the monitor selection, but a mix should sound good on a wide range of speakers
The other question I can comment on, is the choice of music does have a bearing on the monitor selection, but a mix should sound good on a wide range of speakers
richardg
Admonishtrator
Ah big ones then.
The last studio I went in, which I absolutely loved, was Blank in Newcastle about 5 years ago. £150 a day and they really knew how to make a big sound.
Knipester
pfm Member
Thanks to those that have posted so far especially those giving really interesting insights Into the pro world which I have zero experience of.
I’m guessing when an artist performs their material it rarely if ever ends up sounding like the live take at the end users place. The microphone does it’s stuff, the three stages of production are then applied (as per previous reply) on different speakers/desks to a particular set of parameters the engineers wants (including their bias), then it’s purchased/streamed and played on a system owned by the audiophile/listener in a room completely different to where it originated from.
What chance do we have of replicating it or should we not even be trying and as mentioned earlier by BL we should just seek what appeals to our own tastes. I fear the danger there is we could be missing something from the recording that our taste in kit doesn’t resolve.
I’m guessing when an artist performs their material it rarely if ever ends up sounding like the live take at the end users place. The microphone does it’s stuff, the three stages of production are then applied (as per previous reply) on different speakers/desks to a particular set of parameters the engineers wants (including their bias), then it’s purchased/streamed and played on a system owned by the audiophile/listener in a room completely different to where it originated from.
What chance do we have of replicating it or should we not even be trying and as mentioned earlier by BL we should just seek what appeals to our own tastes. I fear the danger there is we could be missing something from the recording that our taste in kit doesn’t resolve.
I think a good proportion of pro active monitors are overkill for what most people need, unless you live in a barn/mansion.
12x 8 million jigawatt amps plus 18x drivers and Carlos Fandango this and the other, when I usually listen about 6-7 feet away at an average probably about 75db seems somewhat of a waste of time.
12x 8 million jigawatt amps plus 18x drivers and Carlos Fandango this and the other, when I usually listen about 6-7 feet away at an average probably about 75db seems somewhat of a waste of time.
Purité Audio
Trade: Purite Audio
Knipester, your speakers are designed to reproduce as closely as possible what is on the record, they are the choice of many mixing/mastering guys.
Keith
Keith
richardg
Admonishtrator
Your point about music being listened to on stuff far removed from what it was recorded on is why hifi doesn't make much sense to me.
Tony L
Administrator
Yes, very German and rather expensive! That’s my old pair of Musikelectronic Geithain RL-904s, I think they are about £6.5k new (I bought second hand for a fraction of that). The port-loading just didn’t suit my room so they didn’t stay long, other than that they were very nice. I seem far better off here either with huge full-range speakers like the Tannoys or sealed-box mini-monitors, though I’d love to try the RL901s. I’m not sure how much they are, around £11k IIRC, but I don’t know if that is for a pair or each!
richardg
Admonishtrator
They look like posh hifi.
Yes, very German and rather expensive! That’s my old pair of Musikelectronic Geithain RL-904s, I think they are about £6.5k new (I bought second hand for a fraction of that). The port-loading just didn’t suit my room so they didn’t stay long, other than that they were very nice. I seem far better off here either with huge full-range speakers like the Tannoys or sealed-box mini-monitors, though I’d love to try the RL901s. I’m not sure how much they are, around £11k IIRC, but I don’t know if that is for a pair or each!
ToTo Man
the band not the dog
On the other hand, given there are so many stages in the process in which things could get lost in translation, I am always impressed by how coherent much of my music library sounds regardless of the speakers I play it back on. I can only assume this is because the mixing and mastering engineers know their equipment very well and make subconscious concessions for any deviations from linearity as they work. Either that or it's all just pot luck!
sq225917
Bit of this, bit of that
https://www.flickr.com/photos/59684834@N08/9653863334/in/album-72157631239572604/
Guy measuring the kiis must have an awful room, this is at listening position with 1/8 octave smoothing.
Guy measuring the kiis must have an awful room, this is at listening position with 1/8 octave smoothing.
Purité Audio
Trade: Purite Audio
Surely they must have some bass below 500?
Keith
Keith
glancaster
In the silicon vale
As audiophiles though, I think we all at least pay lip service to the idea that high fidelity to source is going to get us a long way towards having the nice sound we want. Otherwise, we wouldn't call the boxes we have assembled a 'hi-fi'.
But yes, actually I have no idea how my system measures, and I don't really care. Given a choice between it, and one that measures better but sounds worse to me, I would stick with what I have.
The other thing about sound engineers is that, although I'm sure there are some very good ones who try to ensure the music they produce sounds great on a domestic hi-fi, there is a lot of music output now, particularly pop music, that was either badly produced or, more kindly, produced to satisfy a different set of goals. I almost feel that some of these people are the enemy, and that if they did a little less messing about it would sound better.
Kind regards
- Garry
Tony L
Administrator
Absolutely. The hard thing is interpreting the sound of an unfamiliar studio, and this is part of the role of the NS10s as they sound “that bad” everywhere and are close enough to you that the room plays little part. No matter what the measurists might allege all studio control rooms and main monitoring rigs sound very different, so it can be very hard for the customer to know what they are buying even if the engineer knows his rig well. I’ve been on both sides of this one. As a punter I always took a well recorded cassette of a few tracks to play through the main monitors just to get a handle on the monitors (I didn’t have a CD player back then). When I had my own little studio the monitors were pretty awful (budget constraints), but I knew them and could get good results.
mattgbell
Help the elderly and unwell!
The point has been well made that as far as speakers are concerned there is (and historically has been) quite a bit of crossover between pro and domestic.
What about sources, amps and so on? There’s a small (historical) crossover of reel-to-reel and some turntables (thinking mainly of DJ and broadcasting TTs such as the good Japanese direct drives and e.g. EMT). And I guess there’s also some crossover with the odd DAC (Benchmark, RME and a couple of others). But beyond that?
What about sources, amps and so on? There’s a small (historical) crossover of reel-to-reel and some turntables (thinking mainly of DJ and broadcasting TTs such as the good Japanese direct drives and e.g. EMT). And I guess there’s also some crossover with the odd DAC (Benchmark, RME and a couple of others). But beyond that?
Julf
Facts are our friends
Eh? Hum and noise is a major issue at the low signal levels involved with a TT. Balanced vs unbalanced has nothing to with the flexibility of cables, what makes you believe it has? Another advantage is avoiding ground loops - ever noticed that separate screw terminal for ground lead on phono amps?
Arkless Electronics
Trade: Amp design and repairs.
Always makes me grin to think of audiophiles wanting to eschew even tone controls and needing "source direct" etc etc when a typical mixing desk will put the signal through dozens of NE5532 op amps per each of the lets say 24 channels, each with usually 4 band or more parametric EQ, then they'll maybe want to put it through a compressor... and a de-esser, and maybe a plate reverb unit, then a multi band parametric equaliser... all before it's even been recorded... and then often similar gear again when it's mixed and mastered! Much of this fun is being ruined by digital work stations etc these days but you pay a huge premium to be doing it in one of the few studios remaining with loads of old school outboard and a R2R tape recorder.