AR Sound
- Thread starter bob atherton
- Start date
Muttley2
pfm Member
Bob, I have joined pink fish and added my review that was pulled. The AR website is great and I am ordering a Green 5 to link the Pre to the power supply. Oh happy days. These cables really are the best upgrade I have heard in over 20 years of buying hifi. I though the powerline was good these cables in my opinion are better.
dave
Plywood King
Gentlemen,
Please understand that many of the negative comments will come from owners like me who have a box full of Naim Beating Add-Ons™ (mostly cables) which at best, improve many aspects of the sound from a hifi standpoint but lose the fundamental bits ultimately degrading the system to merely ordinary performance. Forgive me for being a tad pessimistic.
On the bright side, I do agree with Rasher and believe it's in everyone's best interest (including Naims) to allow and even encourage discussion of the Rest of The World on their forum.
regards,
dave
Please understand that many of the negative comments will come from owners like me who have a box full of Naim Beating Add-Ons™ (mostly cables) which at best, improve many aspects of the sound from a hifi standpoint but lose the fundamental bits ultimately degrading the system to merely ordinary performance. Forgive me for being a tad pessimistic.
On the bright side, I do agree with Rasher and believe it's in everyone's best interest (including Naims) to allow and even encourage discussion of the Rest of The World on their forum.
regards,
dave
sq225917
Bit of this, bit of that
let's get real here for a minute.
it's wire, unless it's bulk LCR are hugely different you are imagining it.
End of story.
Welcome to sighted bias...
if it improves bass or treble then it would only take a second to do a frequency sweep to verify that. I'm sure the manufacturer will be along in a second to do just that....
he'll be the first manufacturer of cables who ever did if he does.
it's wire, unless it's bulk LCR are hugely different you are imagining it.
End of story.
Welcome to sighted bias...
if it improves bass or treble then it would only take a second to do a frequency sweep to verify that. I'm sure the manufacturer will be along in a second to do just that....
he'll be the first manufacturer of cables who ever did if he does.
dave
Plywood King
SQ,
It's a *scientific fact the US government maintains a cloud of mind-controlling gas over this country at all times just so I can hear the differences in cables and beat all blind dems.
regards,
dave
*there can be no other explanation, therefore, it must be a scientific fact.
It's a *scientific fact the US government maintains a cloud of mind-controlling gas over this country at all times just so I can hear the differences in cables and beat all blind dems.
regards,
dave
*there can be no other explanation, therefore, it must be a scientific fact.
RustyB
Registered Ginga
manicatel
pfm Member
Well,
I'm a cable sceptic. Never spent any money on stuff other than what came in the box & NACA5, Oh & a cable or two from Flashback.
But SO many people have said the hi-line was a "no-brainer" for my CDX2/XPS2 that I am/was willing to give it a go on a loan from my local dealer.
Now, another CDX2/Hi-Line owner mate of mine has just got a couple of AR leads, so I'm off over to his place to see if I can hear a difference between the standard lead, HiLine & AR lead.
£500 for a lead is a stretch for me, hey even £80-90 is more than I've spent before, so we'll see.
I'll go in with an open mind & give it a go. Kinda hoping I won't hear any difference, as then I'll be able to start thinking about adding another TPX1, or maybe a TPX2, or maybe a better phono stage, or.......................................................
Got to stop NOW!
Matt.
I'm a cable sceptic. Never spent any money on stuff other than what came in the box & NACA5, Oh & a cable or two from Flashback.
But SO many people have said the hi-line was a "no-brainer" for my CDX2/XPS2 that I am/was willing to give it a go on a loan from my local dealer.
Now, another CDX2/Hi-Line owner mate of mine has just got a couple of AR leads, so I'm off over to his place to see if I can hear a difference between the standard lead, HiLine & AR lead.
£500 for a lead is a stretch for me, hey even £80-90 is more than I've spent before, so we'll see.
I'll go in with an open mind & give it a go. Kinda hoping I won't hear any difference, as then I'll be able to start thinking about adding another TPX1, or maybe a TPX2, or maybe a better phono stage, or.......................................................
Got to stop NOW!
Matt.
Peter Stockwell
Back for more ...
2 * Green 5's in the pipeline for me, apart from the Hiline that'll be mostly AR sound cables in my system. I'd take the Hiline challenge too, but currently my CD player is indisposed. Maybe I'm not legit, my 'cap is not a naim 'cap.
bob atherton
pfm Member
Peter, you may well have something here. My *cap isnt a Naim one either, its a TeddyCap. As you know I was more than a little impressed with what the AR Green has done to my system
It could be that there is some very special synergy with AR Sound cables and TeddyCaps. After all they are both from the place where some dude turned water into wine.....
Peter Stockwell
Back for more ...
Bob,
It's a good possibility that Avi uses TeddyCaps, I've never asked him directly. He appears to be snowed under, he's says he needs a week to get to my green 5s.
I never used my Green 4 with a Naim Cap, but I believed it brought more clarity to the system.
It's a good possibility that Avi uses TeddyCaps, I've never asked him directly. He appears to be snowed under, he's says he needs a week to get to my green 5s.
I never used my Green 4 with a Naim Cap, but I believed it brought more clarity to the system.
I think you've nailed it there. It's just different.
I guess in the end it's personal choice, but personally I wouldn't buy an Alfa Romeo and then stick a Halfords spoiler on the back, no matter what it did to the handling. I guess I'm just a purist. But....we have to try these things and see for ourselves - mainly because it's fun.
Naim components have been designed with those cables as part of the system. They aren't an afterthought.
Which cables would they be.? Could they be the cables that for many years, they said couldn't be improved upon or - could they be the ones they just invented costing many times the price of the originals.?
I think we should be told....
Personally, I'd love to buy a Bugatti, and then put a Halfords spoiler on the back. Just to make a statement.
Les
See you cannot, even yet after all these years, resist a snide comment against Naim. You just perpetuate the image of being a tad bitter.
To be frank, the cost from Naim on interconnects and speaker cable is more than reason and if you want a Hiline, the choice is yours, no one is being forced.
Regards
Mick
seagull
Seabird flavour member
The Hi-line was designed to work with the CD555 if I remember correctly.
It was found to improve CD players further down the range. Because of this, the hi-line was sold as a separate item for existing Naim CDP owners. What is wrong with that?
When it was launched I went to a Naim evening at the local hi-fi shop and heard the demo on a CD555 with hi-line and a lavendar interconnect and also on a CD5X. The difference in both cases was not small.
It was found to improve CD players further down the range. Because of this, the hi-line was sold as a separate item for existing Naim CDP owners. What is wrong with that?
When it was launched I went to a Naim evening at the local hi-fi shop and heard the demo on a CD555 with hi-line and a lavendar interconnect and also on a CD5X. The difference in both cases was not small.
Jo Sharp
Pulls on doors marked push
To be fair Les, I don't think Naim ever said that they couldn'tbe improved. I do recall them saying that the cables they supplied were the best that they had been able to source at that time
Jo
Peter Stockwell
Back for more ...
There was, in my view, a strong inference that they been there, done that, etc and if they couldn't find anything better then nothing better existed. You'd have to trawl the naim forum for pre Hiline posts, though.
scottyhammer
pfm Member
Hi All,
As some of you are probably aware i usually post on the naim forum occasionally and seeing this thread i thought i would share some findings here with you all seeing as this thread was pulled.
Let me just say that i have owned naim gear for over 30 years and love what they bring to the party especially amps / power supplies.
Ive been a naimite all this time because frankly have not heard anything else that floats my boat in the way that naim gear does.
Im also not going to naim bash on here just because i can and in truth this is not what its about.
I purchased a new hi-line in 2006 to go between the cdx2 and 82 which i had at the time and was perfectly happy, i then changed my 82/180 amps for 282/250.2 and thats when my problems started which were highlighted on the naim forum.
thinking that it was probably a dodgy connection on a lead or somethig trivial i played around with the leads untill i discovered that i could quite noticably change the sound just by fiddling with the hi-line cable dressing.
The sound has remained pretty good except on certain thrashy rock type music (zepp) for example.
I was even almost tempted to downgrade to a 282/200 pairing and also tempted to out the cdx2 and get a cheaper cd player and spend the savings on upgrading the LP12 as that sounds superb.
And this is the wierd thing the vinyl side of the system has always sounded great compared with the cd side of things.
Anyways i decided to give the AR cables a try.....and im glad i did for the cost they are absolutely superb value but the sound....well i cant believe it...they have sorted the harshness problem overnight - im getting more detail lushious bass and silky acoustics in other words its opened up the sound as if a veil has been lifted.
After a weeks playing i put the hi-line back in today and lets just say that the hi-line is now on ebay.
My conclusions are that the hi-line was somehow holding back some of the music in "my" system and i must repeat "my" system thats a fact and im not trying to tell everyone to rush out and buy ARs cables because its all about system matching and tweaking every last detail out of what you have got.
My system of: cdx2/282/250.2/hi-cap/allaes seems very well matched to me now and im very lucky to have sorted my system issues in this manner and i appreciate that the ARs are not going to be so successful in every system out there but i must say that at £150 for the Yellow 1 + Green 4 to me its a no brainer.....if they didnt work i would have sold them on at little or no loss and kept the hi-line which is a good product but ultimatly didnt work as well for me.
Regards, Scotty
As some of you are probably aware i usually post on the naim forum occasionally and seeing this thread i thought i would share some findings here with you all seeing as this thread was pulled.
Let me just say that i have owned naim gear for over 30 years and love what they bring to the party especially amps / power supplies.
Ive been a naimite all this time because frankly have not heard anything else that floats my boat in the way that naim gear does.
Im also not going to naim bash on here just because i can and in truth this is not what its about.
I purchased a new hi-line in 2006 to go between the cdx2 and 82 which i had at the time and was perfectly happy, i then changed my 82/180 amps for 282/250.2 and thats when my problems started which were highlighted on the naim forum.
thinking that it was probably a dodgy connection on a lead or somethig trivial i played around with the leads untill i discovered that i could quite noticably change the sound just by fiddling with the hi-line cable dressing.
The sound has remained pretty good except on certain thrashy rock type music (zepp) for example.
I was even almost tempted to downgrade to a 282/200 pairing and also tempted to out the cdx2 and get a cheaper cd player and spend the savings on upgrading the LP12 as that sounds superb.
And this is the wierd thing the vinyl side of the system has always sounded great compared with the cd side of things.
Anyways i decided to give the AR cables a try.....and im glad i did for the cost they are absolutely superb value but the sound....well i cant believe it...they have sorted the harshness problem overnight - im getting more detail lushious bass and silky acoustics in other words its opened up the sound as if a veil has been lifted.
After a weeks playing i put the hi-line back in today and lets just say that the hi-line is now on ebay.
My conclusions are that the hi-line was somehow holding back some of the music in "my" system and i must repeat "my" system thats a fact and im not trying to tell everyone to rush out and buy ARs cables because its all about system matching and tweaking every last detail out of what you have got.
My system of: cdx2/282/250.2/hi-cap/allaes seems very well matched to me now and im very lucky to have sorted my system issues in this manner and i appreciate that the ARs are not going to be so successful in every system out there but i must say that at £150 for the Yellow 1 + Green 4 to me its a no brainer.....if they didnt work i would have sold them on at little or no loss and kept the hi-line which is a good product but ultimatly didnt work as well for me.
Regards, Scotty
manicatel
pfm Member
Hi Dave
Don't see you round here often!
Interesting & balanced views, good reading.
I appreciate your "my music/my system" caveat, but your system is a classic, well balanced Naim system, not an odd-ball mish-mash (like mine maybe?).
Anyway, I remember reading of your frustration when you upgraded the amps & agree that your CD replay (with Led Zepp) was not as nice to listen to as your lovely LP12.
A few people here have said of the AR leads " wait a week or two, then plug the HiLine back in" inferring that you may then prefer the HiLine after all.
Good to know you are happy with the system, I'll look forward to hearing it soon & then play around with mine a bit!
Cheers
Matt.
Don't see you round here often!
Interesting & balanced views, good reading.
I appreciate your "my music/my system" caveat, but your system is a classic, well balanced Naim system, not an odd-ball mish-mash (like mine maybe?).
Anyway, I remember reading of your frustration when you upgraded the amps & agree that your CD replay (with Led Zepp) was not as nice to listen to as your lovely LP12.
A few people here have said of the AR leads " wait a week or two, then plug the HiLine back in" inferring that you may then prefer the HiLine after all.
Good to know you are happy with the system, I'll look forward to hearing it soon & then play around with mine a bit!
Cheers
Matt.
When I listened to some Linn speakers at a dealer once it became apparent very quickly that he and I were listening to two very different aspects of the same sound. What he heard was detail and timing and what I heard was a mid-range honking effect.
Since then I've come to realise that I like things far more treble biased than most people and where I hear sparkle and life, others hear tinnyness. I guess this isn't going to reach any real conclusion other than on an individual basis.
There is one other factor that people are forgetting, and that is that we are comparing brand new cables to probably in many cases oxidised copper cables that could be up to 15 years old. It isn't quite a fair comparison - Hi-Line comments excepted. That's going to make a difference.
I think Naim should have argued their case instead of making it another taboo subject. It just looks defeatist to me, and I'm sorry about that because I feel they have a case to argue with. They used to be approachable, and that was a lot of the attraction in the first place.
Since then I've come to realise that I like things far more treble biased than most people and where I hear sparkle and life, others hear tinnyness. I guess this isn't going to reach any real conclusion other than on an individual basis.
There is one other factor that people are forgetting, and that is that we are comparing brand new cables to probably in many cases oxidised copper cables that could be up to 15 years old. It isn't quite a fair comparison - Hi-Line comments excepted. That's going to make a difference.
I think Naim should have argued their case instead of making it another taboo subject. It just looks defeatist to me, and I'm sorry about that because I feel they have a case to argue with. They used to be approachable, and that was a lot of the attraction in the first place.