awkwardbydesign
Officially Awesome
Bear in mind that some studios use Van Damme cables (cheap and tough) and some use expensive cables. Not all professionals are equal.Whats the best solution? Whats used in the studio industry?
Bear in mind that some studios use Van Damme cables (cheap and tough) and some use expensive cables. Not all professionals are equal.Whats the best solution? Whats used in the studio industry?
I was wondering when Keith were going to point out this catastrophically fatal flaw in Nick's methodology....
On a serious note, Keith does have a point here, which is why I made sure to keep the height of my speakers unchanged before and after installing the OREA pucks (I did this by adding/removing plywood shims from under the speakers) . FR measurements showed my methodology was robust as there was no change in the before or after FR or waterfall measurements (by 'no change' I mean a change bigger than the intersample variations you get from repeated measurements, - the room is never energised the same way twice and trying to interpret changes in spectral decay with basic tools like a UMIK-1 and REW in the presence of external noise pollution is folly IME). Yet the improvement in the dynamic attack in the midrange was so obvious after installing the pucks I had to tweak my EQ settings as I found my speaker's presentation had become a too forward for my liking.
Fortunately it isn't impossible to do, and IsoAcoustics go round doing exactly this at shows. Worth a moment of your time. I doubt you will leave thinking there is no difference. Naturally you will not accept my word and will want to point out all the impossibilities of a fair test, but you really should try to have an open mind on this area. It might help you appreciate a spectrum is just that, and not the be all and end allThe most difficult problem is the time taken between listening with and then without the feet, the brain only remembers a presentation for a few seconds, hence Harman’s ‘shuffler’ replacing one pair of loudspeakers with another playing at exactly the same volume within four seconds , that is impossible to replicate at home.
So you couldn't measure it? Have you considered that it's your measuring that is unreliable, rather then what we hear? No, of course not.There would have to be enough structural vibration transmitted to audibly excite the floorboards, when we measured here ( suspended wooden floor) that was simply not the case.
Keith
In my case it was minutes, but yes I could be mistaken, hence taking measurements.The most difficult problem is the time taken between listening with and then without the feet, the brain only remembers a presentation for a few seconds, hence Harman’s ‘shuffler’ replacing one pair of loudspeakers with another playing at exactly the same volume within four seconds , that is impossible to replicate at home.
There would have to be enough structural vibration transmitted to audibly excite the floorboards, when we measured here ( suspended wooden floor) that was simply not the case.
If you placed a naked driver directly on the floor perhaps but that is one of the reasons loudspeakers have enclosures.
An audible resonance can only occur if the loudspeaker’s enclosure is storing energy at that frequency, it needs to be excited long enough and with enough amplitude to create the resonance, if the speaker were improperly designed that would be evident in the spectral decay plot.
FR is the bit we actually hear, the question is always of audibility, does a change make an audible difference.
They are all related Tony perhaps a little reading?If you actually had even the slightest grasp of what music was and how it works you’d realise how profoundly dumb that statement was. Real music happens at least as much in the amplitude and time domains, which none of your religious cult seem to know how to measure. The rest of us can obviously hear it!
Which studios use fancy cables? I’ll keep an eye out for their super recordings.Bear in mind that some studios use Van Damme cables (cheap and tough) and some use expensive cables. Not all professionals are equal.
They are all related Tony perhaps a little reading?
It is both of course, you can isolate to some extent the physical transmission but then there is still the airborne content, these devices are sold on the premise that they somehow ‘manage’ the internal vibration but they can’t, they can isolate the speaker from the floor, the question is does your floor vibrate enough to create an audible resonance.In my case it was minutes, but yes I could be mistaken, hence taking measurements.
All the speakers (small stand mounts up to big floor standers) that I have ever used in my lounge have set off the laminate floorboards into resonance when playing something like the Prodigy. My current loudspeakers do it the least. Feeling the cabinet at the same time exhibits no motion as the cabinets are effectively inert (a declared manufacturer design aim). So the energy that excites the floor must be either airborne or through the interface to the floor. My hypothesis and hence the experiment was to see if a constrained layer damping solution (measured in a test lab by the manufacturers to cut energy transfer by 20 dB from around 30 Hz up to 200 Hz) as part of the speaker to floor interface would reduce the energy transfer. Which as I described in an earlier post, it did. So it is possible for this to happen and maybe others have a similar problem to me.
That is not correct, the speaker has no need to store energy in the enclosure to set something in the room off into resonance (in my case the floorboards, in part through the speaker to laminate floor board interface), it just needs to put enough energy into the room, over a time period, in the frequency range that will set the resonance off.
I know that in my room it is both, that is why I treated my room years ago with Helmholtz Resonators to take resonant energy out around the resonant frequencies (the room modes). I have then added minor tweaks with some EQ, but it is the HRs that made the biggest difference for me measurement wise (noise and waterfall decay and RT60 improvements) and audibly.It is both of course, you can isolate to some extent the physical transmission but then there is still the airborne content, these devices are sold on the premise that they somehow ‘manage’ the internal vibration but they can’t, they can isolate the speaker from the floor, the question is does your floor vibrate enough to create an audible resonance.
It might.
Keith
Which studios use fancy cables? I’ll keep an eye out for their super recordings.
What cables do Abbey Road use?
The last bit sounds very right, but I don’t think were hard to convince -including some professionals - the George Martin history wasn’t the only reason.
Van Damme sounds very plausible to me, if later, but I’d just be guessing wildly - sorry.