paulfromcamden
Baffled
Absolutely - just one of the many reasons why I don't think I'd hack it at any of those professions.
Another "bad 'un" for Cressida?
- Thread starter Dogberry
- Start date
Absolutely - just one of the many reasons why I don't think I'd hack it at any of those professions.
Seeker_UK
Feelin' nearly faded as my jeans
If having the chance of a healthy late-middle and old age on a par with someone in not such a risky job is a a reward, then yes.
Andrew C!
Been around a while....
I read your comment as excluding other professions, either public or private sector. It makes perfect sense as a contractual agreement on commencement of work/career.Also the term retirement is misleading - you can leave with a pension after completing xxx numbers of years service - it is your choice - you are not forced out unless in very specific circumstances. Perhaps a better question is to as why, other than financial, that officers leave after completing their service?
I'm not sure what the 'issue' is?
I retired on a full pension after completing 30 years service. I was 49 years and 8 months old. That's what I planned for when I joined. I could have stayed, but chose not to - the job had had enough out of me in terms of front line operational duties - of which out of 30 years I estimate I did 28.5. (I do still work part time, as is my choice)
I would add that the pension system has now changed, and the benefits are not what they were. It could be argued this is a reason for the turnover of officers, and the graduated nature of the pension reforms not making it financially cost effective to stay?
An observation regarding pensions is that some look at 'what I'm going to get when I'm 68', as opposed to' what do I need now'...
paulfromcamden
Baffled
How many other professions allow you to retire on a full pension aged 49?
Ultimately these benefits are pretty much exclusive to the Public Sector, as a private sector worker I do struggle to get my head around it. I suppose those in the public sector think I'm rolling in cash, sadly not. We have a similar situation with senior medics who cant work past a certain date without being taxed to death; of course retiring young on a generous pension is something I can only dream of.
Whether this effects police recruitment is another matter of course.
Seeker_UK
Feelin' nearly faded as my jeans
Very few. Even if you are lucky to be in the Armed Forces on their 1975 pension scheme, they can only get a full pension at 51 and then only if you're an officer. Other ranks have to wait to 54.
Cav
pfm Member
Very few, I would imagine. Not sure what relevance that has to anything, though.
Barrymagrec
pfm Member
Seeker_UK
Feelin' nearly faded as my jeans
It was only a matter of time until we got around to this again. The Public Sector is not a closed shop and there was nothing stopping anyone from joining and enjoying that pension. Why did you choose to seek your fortunes in the private sector?
Cav
pfm Member
Public Service pensions, and other terms and conditions, are more favourable because their Trades Union negotiated them on behalf of members - and non-members. But, we are often told, Trades Union are an anachronistic irrelevance....
Sue Pertwee-Tyr
Accuphase all the way down
Also, public sector employees contribute quite a bit into these pension schemes. Especially the most favourable ones. Mrs P-T and I both work in the public sector, and both earn broadly the same, but her NHS pension is more generous than my Civil Service one. But her monthly take home pay is around £100 less than mine and that's all down to the pension deductions. Employer contributions are high too, which is why the pensions are good. There's nothing (apart from good old fashioned capitalist tight-fistedness) preventing private sector employers setting up similarly well-funded schemes.
I’m not really sure. I just ended up in role that I enjoyed & continue to do so. I’ve been pretty lucky so far apart from the pension bit.
Andrew C!
Been around a while....
I’m not sure. It was not something I researched at the time, not that it actually bothers me now. I didn’t join for that reason, although it’s very welcome. I would add that due to the graduation conditions on the new pension, the payouts for Federated ranks are commensurately less now than what they were.
None of this is a secret, btw. All this info is freely available with Google’s help.
paulfromcamden
Baffled
E="Seeker_UK, post: 4605050, member: 11042"]It was only a matter of time until we got around to this again. The Public Sector is not a closed shop and there was nothing stopping anyone from joining and enjoying that pension. Why did you choose to seek your fortunes in the private sector?[/QUOTE]
Surely the question isn't why do public sector workers get to retire on a pension that (hopefully) affords a reasonable quality of life - but why private sector workers are expected to squirrel away £1m plus to get the same benefits.
I don't begrudge public sector workers their pensions.
Surely the question isn't why do public sector workers get to retire on a pension that (hopefully) affords a reasonable quality of life - but why private sector workers are expected to squirrel away £1m plus to get the same benefits.
I don't begrudge public sector workers their pensions.
Seanm
pfm Member
Really? Construction industry’s really dangerous, and scaffolding’s got to be one of the most dangerous in the sector. Police fatalities are pretty rare.
Seeker_UK
Feelin' nearly faded as my jeans
I was including the armed forces in that, and I think its also about the potential to go into harm's way.
[edit]
https://www.statista.com/statistics...In 2020, the mortality rate,in the Army at 34.
"In 2020, the mortality rate across all branches of the armed forces of the United Kingdom was 38 deaths per 100 thousand personnel. The mortality rate was highest among members of the Royal Air Force (RAF) at 45, and lowest among those in the Army at 34."
https://www.statista.com/statistics...wing-police-contact-causes-england-and-wales/
"In 2020/21 there were 191 police related fatalities in England and Wales,"
There were 137000 police officers (https://www.gov.uk/government/stati... at March 2021, there,the previous year of 5%.)
=137 deaths per 100 thousand.
https://www.constructionnews.co.uk/...ths-in-2020-top-five-year-average-08-07-2021/
39 construction deaths in 2020/21
UK construction industry is estimated at 1.4M workers. (https://www.ons.gov.uk/businessindu...industry/articles/constructionstatistics/2020)
= 2.7 deaths per 100 thousand.
So you are 50+ times less likely to die in construction as you are in the police.
Enfield boy
pfm Member
The "Great British Free Press" have done a great job fomenting jealousy about "Gold Plated Pensions". Possibly some of the excesses they print are true, many company directors receive pretty amazing pensions too. 30 years or so back it wasn't unusual for workers in many industries to receive defined benefit pensions of, typically, 40/60ths of final salary after 40 years service. The press have encouraged businesses to say these are not affordable and more and more businesses have gone to defined contribution pensions.
I was lucky, I worked for an organisation that used to offer a DB pension and got 25 years service before becoming a postie for a couple of years again DB, again no longer the case, that pension fund has changed twice in the 20 years since I left, each version less good than the previous. Then I did 18 years on the railway again DB but the govt keeps changing rules on deficits (which I understand are only there because most assets went to Railtrack/NR) and seem to have their beady eye on the pot like they did to the miners.
My point is decent pensions weren't that uncommon and very often they were found in jobs that actually didn't pay very well and were seen as a way of attracting staff long term. We are now in the "gig economy" and if they can have people doing "normal" jobs sniping at each other about "unearned" pensions it suits the Rees-Moggs and Johnsons and Murdochs of this world just fine.
Surely the question isn't why do public sector workers get to retire on a pension that (hopefully) affords a reasonable quality of life - but why private sector workers are expected to squirrel away £1m plus to get the same benefits.
I don't begrudge public sector workers their pensions.[/QUOTE]
I was lucky, I worked for an organisation that used to offer a DB pension and got 25 years service before becoming a postie for a couple of years again DB, again no longer the case, that pension fund has changed twice in the 20 years since I left, each version less good than the previous. Then I did 18 years on the railway again DB but the govt keeps changing rules on deficits (which I understand are only there because most assets went to Railtrack/NR) and seem to have their beady eye on the pot like they did to the miners.
My point is decent pensions weren't that uncommon and very often they were found in jobs that actually didn't pay very well and were seen as a way of attracting staff long term. We are now in the "gig economy" and if they can have people doing "normal" jobs sniping at each other about "unearned" pensions it suits the Rees-Moggs and Johnsons and Murdochs of this world just fine.
Surely the question isn't why do public sector workers get to retire on a pension that (hopefully) affords a reasonable quality of life - but why private sector workers are expected to squirrel away £1m plus to get the same benefits.
I don't begrudge public sector workers their pensions.[/QUOTE]
Seanm
pfm Member
Yeah…I dunno.
Seeker_UK
Feelin' nearly faded as my jeans
For reference, the CS pension was 40/80ths of final salary and could only draw it at 60.