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Clapton’s new single

We need a graph, sort of like the political compass thing. x axis would be artistic merit, y axis would be 'goodness' (ie not a wife-beater, racist, child abuser). There seems to be a bizarre mixing of the two here: 'Not only is he a racist, his music is derivative shite'.

I think Jimmy Page's failures as human being probably far outweigh Clapton's. I don't have much time for either of them musically.
 
Tony L said:
I’m not arguing about white blues and jazz musicians in the slightest. I can cite countless great examples (Bill Evans, Gill Evans, Art Pepper, Stan Getz, Dave Brubeck, Gary Burton etc etc right through to say Nik Bärtsch and Emma Jean Thackray today). You will find all these and more very substantially represented in my record collection. None of these people were racists/far-right white supremacists, they were/are all part of a truly forward looking multiracial music scene. FWIW I don’t know why you cite Charlie Watts.

For clarity and context here is Eric Clapton’s speech to an audience at Birmingham in 1976:

“Do we have any foreigners in the audience tonight? If so, please put up your hands. So where are you? Well wherever you all are, I think you should all just leave. Not just leave the hall, leave our country. I don't want you here, in the room or in my country. Listen to me, man! I think we should vote for Enoch Powell. Enoch's our man. I think Enoch's right, I think we should send them all back. Stop Britain from becoming a black colony. Get the foreigners out. Get the wogs out. Get the coons out. Keep Britain white. I used to be into dope, now I'm into racism. It's much heavier, man. F*cking wogs, man. F*cking Saudis taking over London. Bastard wogs. Britain is becoming overcrowded and Enoch will stop it and send them all back. The black wogs and coons and Arabs and f*cking Jamaicans don't belong here, we don't want them here. This is England, this is a white country, we don't want any black wogs and coons living here. We need to make clear to them they are not welcome. England is for white people, man. This is Great Britain, a white country, what is happening to us, for f*ck's sake? Throw the wogs out! Keep Britain white!”

Source: Wikipedia.

I’ve obviously had to ‘bleep’ some of that to scrape it through the site swear filter and there is a lot of hugely ugly racist and offensive content remaining that I would normally remove on sight (and ban the poster), but folk do need to know this and it fits entirely with the political context of this thread.

As I stated upthread had this been a general Clapton thread in the music room discussing Cream, Derek & The Dominoes etc I’d have sat on my hands and not posted as it really isn’t my job to tell people what music to like. Similarly when it comes to an RIP thread I just won’t post. Given it’s here in off topic in an obviously political thread, and that he’s still even now ranting ugly conspiracy theory (albeit a different shite) then I’ll happily shine a bright spotlight on his past. It all helps add context to his current anti-vaccer position.
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Wow! Shit! Thanks for sharing! I didn't know anything about this! Was there ever any apology?

Was there a big response?

Please go easy on me, the speach happened some time before I was born! :)
 
Monitor Gold 10 said:
Wow! Shit! Thanks for sharing! I didn't know anything about this! Was there ever any apology?

Was there a big response?

Please go easy on me, the speach happened some time before I was born! :)
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Unfortunately there is no recording, I think. The words often quoted are a summary of what someone / some people heard...or am I wrong here?
 
Monitor Gold 10 said:
I didn't know anything about this! Was there ever any apology?

Was there a big response?
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I’ll leave others far more knowledgeable to state Clapton’s ‘side’ and later apparently changing opinions, but there was certainly a big response/reaction. His racist outburst was the spark that lit the fire that was the Rock Against Racism movement (Wikipedia). For that I thank him. That changed the trajectory of UK protest music and even politics in many ways. It is IMHO pretty much impossible to overstate the importance of RAR. This movement shaped so much of punk, new wave, ska, two-tone, indie etc and helped change a generation’s mindset. That generation was mine.
 
Tony L said:
Morrissey is another, I’ve not wanted to play a Smiths record (and I was a fan) since he outed himself as a Britain First supporter etc.
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I think people change over time. I'm not quite the same person I am now as I was aged 16. I still adore The Smiths but Mozza's later discography all went to the charity shop a while back.
 
paulfromcamden said:
I think people change over time. I'm not quite the same person I am now as I was aged 16. I still adore The Smiths but Mozza's later discography all went to the charity shop a while back.
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I can’t see my Smiths collection (including a fully signed 1st album) ever hitting the charity shops, I do still really like it as a body of work. I just don’t feel like playing it right now!

I’m a Bowie fan too, and he was obviously a prick at times, though he did successfully reverse-out a very long time ago. By being such an outspoken anti-vaccer it looks like Clapton is still rooted in the uglier conspiracy theory extremes of the political right at least to some degree. I’ve never been interested in his music so I have no idea where he resides on racism, xenophobia or right-wing nationalism today. Hopefully he has learned something and made amends. I assume so given some real blues legends have since shared stages with him.
 
Tony L said:
I can’t see my Smiths collection (including a fully signed 1st album) ever hitting the charity shops, I do still really like it as a body of work. I just don’t feel like playing it right now!

I’m a Bowie fan too, and he was obviously a prick at times, though he did successfully reverse-out a very long time ago. By being such an outspoken anti-vaccer it looks like Clapton is still rooted in the uglier conspiracy theory extremes of the political right at least to some degree. I’ve never been interested in his music so I have no idea where he resides on racism, xenophobia or right-wing nationalism today. Hopefully he has learned something and made amends. I assume so given some real blues legends have since shared stages with him.
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From what I've scanned (low res, not in detail), Clapton reportedly experienced adverse reactions to his AstraZeneca jabs, and his bitching off about it landed him in alignment with the Anti-vax crowd, which he appears to be now capitalizing on, despite him being fully vaccinated, and, presumably, them not. I suspect that the anti-vaccination brigade will be looking forward to the last track of Clapton's yet to be released album, 'Breakthrough'.
 
Craig B said:
From what I've scanned (low res, not in detail), Clapton reportedly experienced adverse reactions to his AstraZeneca jabs, and his bitching off about it landed him in alignment with the Anti-vax crowd, which he appears to be now capitalizing on, despite him being fully vaccinated, and, presumably, them not. I suspect that the anti-vaccination brigade will be looking forward to the last track of Clapton's yet to be released album, 'Breakthrough'.
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And the one after that ? Followthrough.
 
Tony L said:
FWIW I don’t know why you cite Charlie Watts.
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This was indeed a rather shaky one - I took Charlie Watts as an example for a universally popular musician, especially these days when we miss him, who never gets criticised for making a fortune out of recycling another culture's music. In truth, he did it just the same way as Clapton did, and countless others along the way. Sixty years later though, it appears that much of this cultural appropriation has turned into a win-win for many of the actors involved, and I dare say this controversy has lost a lot of relevance by now.
Tony L said:
For clarity and context here is Eric Clapton’s speech to an audience at Birmingham in 1976:[etc.]
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Erm, yes. Indeed. I didn't know the whole text, I had to look away after a few lines. On the other hand, Tony, if I remember well, you own quite a few classical records made by people who behaved far more controversially during WWII, and this for several years rather than just one or two bad hair days. There are more than you think, only recently did I discover that even wonderful French pianist Alfred Cortot had a questionable stance regarding the Vichy government. All those people had various motivations for their behaviour, some more convincing than others, and in comparison it appears that Clapton is not one of the more dangerous guys. Oh and there are also some very famous non-white musicians who talked rubbish on some days, their non-whiteness being no excuse IMO. Everyone has to make his own judgment, to me the time factor has to be counted in.
 
What’s amazing is his fear of a medically approved vaccine that’s been given without issue to tens of millions of people when he was addicted to alcohol and drugs for 20 years, consuming three bottles of brandy a day and regularly injecting contaminated street heroin direct into his veins.
 
Just checked out the lyrics. It’s non-specific whingeing, Victor Meldrew style. I notice the borrowed concept from HMHB about the light at the end of the tunnel being the light of an oncoming train, but it may be unconscious rather than plagiarism.
 
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Joe Hutch said:
I notice the borrowed concept from HMHB about the light at the end of the tunnel being the light of an oncoming train, but it maybe unconscious rather than plagiarism.
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To be fair, your man can’t claim authorship of that one either - as I’m sure you know really.
 
TheDecameron said:
What’s amazing is his fear of a medically approved vaccine that’s been given without issue to tens of millions of people when he was addicted to alcohol and drugs for 20 years, consuming three bottles of brandy a day and regularly injecting contaminated street heroin direct into his veins.
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Apparently he gets his information re the vaccines from the good denizens of YouTube, which obviously makes all the difference.
 
Marchbanks said:
To be fair, your man can’t claim authorship of that one either - as I’m sure you know really.
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Indeed. What’s fun is spotting where Nigel steal his lines from. Leadbelly is an obvious fave of his lyrically, but there’s often musical ‘quotes’ too, of the ‘blink and you’ll miss them’ variety.
 
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