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Election night 2019 / aftermath

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Sorry Tony I did not realise you were so thin skinned. Rereading what I had written I cannot see anywhere where I personally attacked you as a person or for what you have written on your forum. It was a general point made to address a number of individuals who post regularly on your forum who are quite aggressive and insulting towards other posters who do not share their world vision. I am truly surprised that you have not noticed this.

I am not blind drunk nor am I particularly intelligent despite a teaching certificate, a B.Ed Hons degree and a Masters degree in Digital Microelectronics to my name. I bow to your superior intelligence. I voted Green because I think Green issues are a bigger issue than Brexit not for me but for my children and my grandchildren.
 
SteveT said:
Sorry Tony I did not realise you were so thin skinned. Rereading what I had written I cannot see anywhere where I personally attacked you as a person or for what you have written on your forum. It was a general point made to address a number of individuals who post regularly on your forum who are quite aggressive and insulting towards other posters who do not share their world vision. I am truly surprised that you have not noticed this.

I am not blind drunk nor am I particularly intelligent despite a teaching certificate, a B.Ed Hons degree and a Masters degree in Digital Microelectronics to my name. I bow to your superior intelligence. I voted Green because I think Green issues are a bigger issue than Brexit not for me but for my children and my grandchildren.
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One of the things that many of us don't like about Johnson is that he doesn't give a damn about climate change or environmental issues. I'm glad you voted Green, as I did, but for those who voted Johnson believing what he said, well, they may end up a tad disappointed...
 
SteveT said:
I voted Green because I think Green issues are a bigger issue than Brexit not for me but for my children and my grandchildren.
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On that I certainly agree with you, though I am also convinced green priorities will be far harder to achieve within the economic and social decline Brexit and its accompanying English nationalism represent. They are not unconnected issues to my eyes. I’m prepared to bet this is amongst the first spending and regulation to be kicked into the long grass once things start to get strained.

PS Climate science denial and the hard-right tend to go hand in hand, so the further we move in that direction the worse things will get.
 
roman said:
Above all the Russians want to see brexit done, it weakens us and it weakens Europe. Labour and libdem offered a way out.
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Not at all, if you mean its weakens us from a security and militarily perspective, as BJ is committed to NATO whereas Corbyn.....
 
vuk said:
i did know this, just shocked at how extreme it is, especially considering the size of this false "landslide".
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Even worse when you consider that 15+ million didn't cast their vote at all.
That's 1 million more than the total votes for the Tories.

Tactically voted, but made no difference in my locality - Tory with 23K majority over Labour.
 
Tony L said:
PS Climate science denial and the hard-right tend to go hand in hand, so the further we move in that direction the worse things will get.
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This. And the johnson's no show at the climate debate is hardly indicative of a pm who's worked it out and need to communicate his solution with a passion, is it.
 
Ohh Jeremy - Corbyn.

Manifesto needed a bit more prol appeal whatever that is.

But thanks for the hard work you put in.

Jo Swinson. Valiant effort for a newbie. Easy to see, in hindsight, where that went wrong.
 
Mike Reed said:
Well, wisdom would be a strong contender as well here, but if you've lived and worked for 40/50 years and haven't anything to show for that, then something's gone wrong. Assets are a natural end product of a working life. Who wouldn't want to protect these?
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I agree, up to a point. Some people are simply greedy, and feel they should prosper from society without ever contributing their fair share. They see the world only in terms of givers and takers. Others are better able to connect a rise in taxes to the benefits they provide. To state the obvious, we all benefit from improved infrastructure, reduced homelessness, lower crime rates, support for the arts, and so on.
 
Alex S said:
Hope they got some first time buyer help with that.
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Perhaps the question should be whether they will actually bother to live in said house, what with London's reputed reputation as the money laundering capital of the world.

Blo-Jo wouldn't want to compromise that now, would he? Even it is only 'reputation'.
 
Sue Pertwee-Tyr said:
I don't see Corbyn's LP policies as anachronistic, nor 'economic nonsense'. They were, AIUI, clearly costed (which is more than you can say for the Tories' manifesto pledges).
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Costed but there are two things that spring to mind.

Bailing out the WASPIs was thrown in after the manifesto and that was an unfunded £58Bn.

Secondly, I suspect the costings were balanced at their most optimistic. That tax revenue would be in the top end of projected receipts and that all projects / initiatives would be delivered to PCT; a lot of things would have to slot into place for this to work out. I suspect that the people putting the figures together actually believed that with Labour at the tiller, massive public capital programmes wouldn't suffer all of the (non-political) issues that were always a part.
 
Tony L said:
I am amazed you did not know this. It is the primary reason so many of us vote Lib Dem or Green as both stand for replacing the hopelessly biased and rigged FPTP with a proper proportional democracy. The UK is actually nearer Saudi Arabia or Iran politically than a proper democracy as implemented in much of Europe. We are a monarchy with a totally dysfunctional electoral system and the far right (Conservative Party) is about to set fire to the few human rights and civil liberties we previously had enshrined in EU law.
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And you made all of these objections to our electoral system in '97 after Blair's landslide having obtained 0.1% less of the vote than Johnson. Good on you Tony.

I am no fan of FPTP either but I recognise it does usually produce decisive Government for a 4/5 year period whereas Germany for example has just spent 11 months in negotiations after their last election to produce a government and since the end of WW2 Italy's last less than 12 months.
 
Wow, I haven’t even read a quarter of this thread.
Quite shocked to find it on here to be honest.
Some good points and some total nonsense.
Certainly interesting to read different opinions though.
 
Minio said:
Jo Swinson. Valiant effort for a newbie. Easy to see, in hindsight, where that went wrong.
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As the two main parties are at their furthest extremes at present the centre was only ever going to narrow as folk voted against whichever of the two dinsaurs they hated the most. She was also hugely damaged by her time in coalition. The LDs will be insane to select anyone from that coalition era as a replacement. They are very lucky to have Layla Moran as an option; sharp, articulate, and young/fresh enough not to be tainted by the party’s past at all.
 
thebigfredc said:
And you made all of these objections to our electoral system in '97 after Blair's landslide having obtained 0.1% less of the vote than Johnson. Good on you Tony.
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Yes. Other than some tactical voting here and there I have voted Lib Dem all my life as I have always grasped the electoral system simply doesn’t work, and therefore the first priority is to change it for one that does. I voted for Blair in ‘97 as it was necessary to get the Tories out, but went back to the LDs immediately after that (Iraq was a factor too).

PS I voted Green this time as I didn’t rate Swinson much and my area is a Labour basket case anyway, so really you are only voting to save someone’s deposit, not for political representation. It is basically a waste of my time turning out.
 
If it wasn't for Brexit it's likely Labour would have won! I'm reckoning that most people in the likes of Blythe and Sedgefield who voted Tory did so not because they hated Labour but because they are stupid enough to want Brexit to happen no matter what.... it's of course the same reason why the Brexit Party got so many votes in normally staunch Labour areas!
 
Tony L said:
It has happened many times before, either Conservative or Labour can often get absolute control for 4 years with around 40% of a low turnout. It is not democracy.
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Incorrect, it has not happened many times before....its happened every time since 1945 as no party has achieved 50% of the popular vote. Labour had every opportunity to change our voting system between 97 and 2005 but having had a taste of power they thought they could rule forever.
 
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