Downsize multiple boxes to a single (Hegel H590) box?

[Amber Audio]

@badger748

Not seen these two integrateds mentioned, NAD M32 and Lyngdorf TDAI-3400. Both have option modules to add things like HDMI and replace with updated ones when things change. The NAD can do MM and MC whereas the Lyngdorf can’t. The Lyngdorf has very good Room Correction software and voicing aka tone controls plus built in streaming, NAD has the additional BluOS module for streaming.

I had a 14 box system Naim system for a while, moved to Aries G2 into TDAI-2170/2400 then over Xmas I moved to just a TDAI-3400 into a pair of Speakers, no vinyl over the holidays (so no chance of a knackered cart). QNAP NAS running ROON Core, local FLAC and Tidal. All controlled from a tablet. Simple, easy to use for everyone sounded great, all synced up to the SONOS in the other rooms.

Gus

 

[major-tom]

Strictly. I’ll have to take your word for that, as you’re a Hegel dealer you’ve obviously heard them side by side whereas Ive heard neither.
My point was really that the MF offers a hell of a lot for the money.

 

[vln]

TCP/IP over Ethernet has been a global standard for better than 20 years. The technology is actually much older than that. It will still be around 20 years from now. Today's DACs work with the same bitstreams as converters from the 70s and 80s.

Would you buy a streamer that is 20, 10 or 5 years old? How about a DAC?

This was a little tongue in cheek. I understand your point completely.

No worries. So was my comment about Hegel surely being able to convert their products to wireless operation in five years.

I have no idea. They are both niche technologies today, but they both have their fans. A technology like MQA could become very relevant with the stroke a pen, if the pen belonged to Spotify, Amazon, Apple etc.

I fully agree. But doesn't that strengthen the point of not locking yourself in with an all-in-one amplifier?

 

[Strictly Stereo]

Strictly. I’ll have to take your word for that, as you’re a Hegel dealer you’ve obviously heard them side by side whereas Ive heard neither.
My point was really that the MF offers a hell of a lot for the money.

Don't get me wrong, the Encore 225 sounds great and is hands down the most feature rich all-in-one system I have yet to come across.

 

[vln]

https://darko.audio/2018/10/a-short-film-about-the-hegel-h590/
That's a lot on money for a chinese built amp. Someone's making a big fat amount out of the £9K RRP.

Oh.

I agree - and if they don't even manufacture their stuff in house, i.e. are in control of it, it certainly raises questions about long term serviceability IMO.

 

[Cereal Killer]

And current QC also.

 

[PhilofCas]

People think it does sound better than 256. Otherwise why would they do it?

A winning hires streaming format should be coming. It doesn't make any sense that in 2019 Spotify, Apple and Amazon still offer streaming services with sound quality worse than Redbook. And I'm not sure that that winning hires format will be MQA based.

So, again, I think it's prudent not to spend a big sum in an all in one box that includes a streamer and a DAC.
And I'm not just thinking about 5 years down the road. I hope my integrated amp will still be in my main setup 20 years from now.

Hi Radamel, that would be because it’s perfectly fine for lots of people, I, myself, have pretty much only been using Spotify for the last 3 or so years, would say it’s been best years of my hifi/music/listening life.

All the best,

Phil.

 

[Strictly Stereo]

Would you buy a streamer that is 20, 10 or 5 years old? How about a DAC?

I bought a 5 year old streamer (Auralic Aries) just yesterday. I bought a 10 year old DAC (Naim DAC) last month. They both sound great and both of them are capable of handling all of the music I own, including the DSD. The streamer handled MQA content elegantly too, thanks to a free firmware update. I probably wouldn't buy a 20 year old DAC, but that's because it probably wouldn't have noise and jitter levels which are so far beyond audibility as to be inconsequential. A 20 year old DAC would still play the vast majority of my music collection.

No worries. So was my comment about Hegel surely being able to convert their products to wireless operation in five years.

You can connect a Hegel H590 or any other product with wired Ethernet to a wireless network using an inexpensive wireless bridge, like this one from Vonets...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Vonets-Ext...ocphy=9046436&hvtargid=pla-642485703960&psc=1

I fully agree. But doesn't that strengthen the point of not locking yourself in with an all-in-one amplifier?

Not if your all-in-one amplifier already supports full unfolding of MQA content, like the H590 does.

 

[Strictly Stereo]

Hi Radamel, that would be because it’s perfectly fine for lots of people, I, myself, have pretty much only been using Spotify for the last 3 or so years, would say it’s been best years of my hifi/music/listening life.

All the best,

Phil.

It also supports Spotify Connect.

 

[AndyU]

Except that the extra box is his Roon Core server, which is a requirement in any Roon system. The Zenith also does double duty as a CD ripper. He went from six boxes down to two and now has a more capable and better sounding system than he had before. He's very happy.

The Zenith is another example of putting too much in one box and charging far too much for it. You can do a better job of ripping on any old pc, at least if you want your rips verified, and at least as good a job of storing rips on any old NAS or hard drive, and a better job of running Roon Core on the same pc/mac or a fancy one if you want to do a lot of DSP. Once again flexibility is both beneficial and good value for money.

 

[firedog]

I have more than a few DSD albums and use Tidal's MQA streaming.

Also some people are already upsampling to DSD 512...

Some people are doing it. Yes I know. I can also. My point was if you have a very good sounding setup that "only" does 96k or 1X DSD, the numbers game is unlikely to improve the sound. There are specific DACs that may sound their best at DSD 512 or some such, but they are the exception. As I said, If you like the sound of a DAC that doesn't accept extremely hi rates, no reason to worry about it. Just use it as it was intended(even if you need to downsample a DSD 128 file to DSD 64 - or a 192 file to 96 - horrors!) and you will be happy with the sound.

If you really like to play around programs like Roon and HQP let you play with sample rates, filters, and modulators. If you find what sounds best in your system, just run every thing at that setting. In most cases the differences are subtle; and different filters etc make just as much difference as sample rate. Getting a new DAC b/c some new format is available is crazy. Either your DAC sounds good to you or it doesn't.

The rest of it is a prime example of audiophilia nervosa and how audiophiles drive themselves crazy chasing some "number" that is pretty meaningless in real life. I seriously doubt in many cases the difference is audible if the listening isn't sighted.

 

[PhilofCas]

Hi Radamel, that would be because it’s perfectly fine for lots of people, I, myself, have pretty much only been using Spotify for the last 3 or so years, would say it’s been best years of my hifi/music/listening life.

All the best,

Phil.

It also supports Spotify Connect.

Sorry, not interested in the Hegel (well, I am, just far too expensive), my reply was purely in relation to Radamel querying why Spotify and others offer below CD quality in 2019.

 

[Purité Audio]

The real gains are at the other end of the replay chain.
Keith

 

[firedog]

People think it does sound better than 256. Otherwise why would they do it?

A winning hires streaming format should be coming. It doesn't make any sense that in 2019 Spotify, Apple and Amazon still offer streaming services with sound quality worse than Redbook. And I'm not sure that that winning hires format will be MQA based.

So, again, I think it's prudent not to spend a big sum in an all in one box that includes a streamer and a DAC.
And I'm not just thinking about 5 years down the road. I hope my integrated amp will still be in my main setup 20 years from now.

"People"? How many? The number of people upsampling to DSD 512 in miniscule in the extreme. Probably a few thousand in the entire world. Few DACs even accept it, and most HW can't do it without choking. Few have servers that can do it on the fly easily.

The only DAC I know of where users seem to all agree that DSD 512 sounds best is the T+A DAC 8 DSD - and it was specifically designed for that. But it doesn't do DSD 512 with either Apple or Linux sources. Most streamers are Linux based.

Even Lukasz the builder of Lampizator says there isn't any reason to go above DSD 256 for SQ (and his DACs can do real one bit pure DSD 512 conversion).

You really are describing a niche of a niche of a niche as if it something to be concerned about.

 

[AOM3]

ATC SCM40a, Bluesound Vault 2i and Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ would be my system for this this kind of dosh.

 

[radamel]

ATC SCM40a, Bluesound Vault 2i and Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ would be my system for this this kind of dosh.

The OP wants to keep his speakers. So I'd recommend he'd choose the best integrated amp for his speakers. I am more and more convinced that one should not evaluate speakers and amps separately but always as a combination.

After getting that right I'd recommend sorting the digital front end either with a streamer and a DAC or with a streamer DAC combo. A Mytek Brooklyn bridge could also be a good choice, especially with a good LPSU.

 

[Woodface]

Ultimately it will come down to SQ & whether the OP likes the amp. I do think a few are tying to piss on his choice here

 

[Strictly Stereo]

...Once again flexibility is both beneficial and good value for money.

...Unless you want to reduce box count, which is where this thread started.

 

[Musicraft]

ATC SCM40a, Mytek Brooklyn DAC+

A lovely combination

 

[AndyU]

ATC SCM40a, Bluesound Vault 2i and Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ would be my system for this this kind of dosh.

Yep, absolutely, a fantastically good system, and great value for money. A Benchmark or Chord DAC and no doubt others would fit also, as would other streamers. Still very low box count, but plenty flexibility, and once you have two ATC midrange units in your hi-fi, life enhancing.