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MDAC First Listen (part 00101100)

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Hello to all, and greetings from Denmark.
It's been awhile since I've posted on this forum, but have been looking in from time to time.

Greetings to John, hope you are well. I see that you are keeping busy :)

I have been messing around with my sovereign'ed +Toy'ed M-DAC and comparing it with a couple of other dacs. In this process, I have tried an Audioquest Jitterbug, just for fun, which is compatible with the other dac I have, but will not cooperate with the M-DAC for some reason.
I use it with a Macbook Pro and a 5 meter Audioquest USB cable.

In order for the M-DAC to switch from "inactive" to "ready" when the USB input is selected, I have to unplug and insert the USB cable several times. When it finally switches to ready, the Macbook only rarely registers it. I have yet to get any audio out of the M-DAC, when the Jitterbug is applied.

Does the Jitterbug include some kind of componentry (which is very limited) that is not compatible with the M-DAC?
As mentioned, the other dac I have, which is even powered by the USB bus, does not have any issues with the Jitterbug.

Thanks in advance.
 
HumbleBy(DK) said:
Hello to all, and greetings from Denmark.
It's been awhile since I've posted on this forum, but have been looking in from time to time.

Greetings to John, hope you are well. I see that you are keeping busy :)

I have been messing around with my sovereign'ed +Toy'ed M-DAC and comparing it with a couple of other dacs. In this process, I have tried an Audioquest Jitterbug, just for fun, which is compatible with the other dac I have, but will not cooperate with the M-DAC for some reason.
I use it with a Macbook Pro and a 5 meter Audioquest USB cable.

In order for the M-DAC to switch from "inactive" to "ready" when the USB input is selected, I have to unplug and insert the USB cable several times. When it finally switches to ready, the Macbook only rarely registers it. I have yet to get any audio out of the M-DAC, when the Jitterbug is applied.

Does the Jitterbug include some kind of componentry (which is very limited) that is not compatible with the M-DAC?
As mentioned, the other dac I have, which is even powered by the USB bus, does not have any issues with the Jitterbug.

Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...

I suspect the issue is with the 5m USB Cable - I'm pretty sure if you try a shorter cable and the Jitter Bug it will work OK.
 
misterdog said:
Its £ 20 plus £ 8 for a new lead if you don't wish to trash your original PS.

Hence expectation bias is 10 times lower than spending £ 300 on an aftermarket PS. :D

It has the element of DIY fun even if it only makes a small difference.
Click to expand...

It does indeed, but I have come across another bit of fun (?) which doesn't seem to have been reported so far.

I was getting irritated with losing power to my MDAC from the Calex, and of course I thought I must have lost one of my solder joints somewhere, maybe damaging the MDAC, etc., but no, all was OK. After a lot of messing around I found that the RS 9-pin lead I was using was working loose or even falling out of the back of the MDAC.

So, of course RS must be at fault? No, all the dimensions for shield and clip checked out, indistinguishable from the Audiolab plug. After a lot more poking around (the back of my system is pretty inaccessible), I finally realised that the problem is that the Audiolab socket is mounted inside the back panel, so that for plug and socket to mate and the clip to work, the plastic surround on the DIN plug has to go through the panel.

Audiolab's designer (who might that be?) has cleverly arranged that the panel hole is an exact (tight) fit on the DIN plug plastic surround, thereby providing useful extra support on a rather feeble connector. Unfortunately that means that any replacement plug must also fit, and so far as I can see there is no standard spec. for the diameter of that bit of plastic. The RS isn't a bad match, but at ca. 0.1mm larger diameter, there was no way that was going through the hole. Not surprisingly, it falls out when 'plugged' in.

One hour later, with some cautious filing with one of my wife's emery boards (she apparently doesn't want it back...), frequently checking with a vernier calliper, I have an RS connector which more or less fits, the dropout problem seems to be over, and maybe I can finally get on with some comparative listening.

Anybody else had this problem, or did I get an unusually fat RS plug? For those who have made more sophisticated LPS units and wired their own 9-pin plugs, have you had problems getting them to fit? Any with a longer shield would of course be fine.
 
When enabled, the AV bypass feature allows for an analog audio signal to go through the some modified MDACs, and the future MDAC2, as is: the MDAC acts then as a straight wire (ok, the signal goes through relays, and some single end to balanced conversion may take place using only passive components). This feature is automatically enabled when the MDAC2 is switched off and when the headphone unit is active.

This allows to insert the MDAC between a preamp (or AV surround processor) and amp(s), and do as if the MDAC weren't there when it is not used.
 
HumbleBy(DK) said:
Hello to all, and greetings from Denmark.
It's been awhile since I've posted on this forum, but have been looking in from time to time.

Greetings to John, hope you are well. I see that you are keeping busy :)

I have been messing around with my sovereign'ed +Toy'ed M-DAC and comparing it with a couple of other dacs. In this process, I have tried an Audioquest Jitterbug, just for fun, which is compatible with the other dac I have, but will not cooperate with the M-DAC for some reason.
I use it with a Macbook Pro and a 5 meter Audioquest USB cable.

In order for the M-DAC to switch from "inactive" to "ready" when the USB input is selected, I have to unplug and insert the USB cable several times. When it finally switches to ready, the Macbook only rarely registers it. I have yet to get any audio out of the M-DAC, when the Jitterbug is applied.

Does the Jitterbug include some kind of componentry (which is very limited) that is not compatible with the M-DAC?
As mentioned, the other dac I have, which is even powered by the USB bus, does not have any issues with the Jitterbug.

Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
I'm using a jitterbug in between a Mac mini and mdac with a half metre Audioquest cable. There are no problems.
 
I stared to get weird clicking noises with my Mac Mini & Mdac when I upgraded to El Capitan OSX and I've had to switch to optical instead of USB..

Maybe I should be checking out a Jitterbug ?
 
Bob L said:
Anybody else had this problem, or did I get an unusually fat RS plug? For those who have made more sophisticated LPS units and wired their own 9-pin plugs, have you had problems getting them to fit? Any with a longer shield would of course be fine.
Click to expand...

I admire your patience and ingenuity to fix this problem. With the MCRU Linear PSU the plug fits fine...but there is a large separate instruction sheet warning the owner that the pins are thin and delicate and unless the plug is aligned properly its very easy to bend or break a pin...take care:)
 
Boozyuzi said:
I stared to get weird clicking noises with my Mac Mini & Mdac when I upgraded to El Capitan OSX and I've had to switch to optical instead of USB..

Maybe I should be checking out a Jitterbug ?
Click to expand...

Sadly this will not help, Apple have played about there USB drivers - so the Jitter Bug will not help :(
 
I also have a question which is probably very dim, but it has been bugging me for a long time .... so here goes:

Some people here are in for more than one FDAC with a master - slave configuration in mind. I don't understand how one would use this. I sort of understand that the master unit will provide the clocking for the data stream before the DAC conversion, but I can't see why you would want to send that to another slave-FDAC (perhaps that's in another room/system or somehow connected to another CD/Bluray source?)... I'm wondering if I'm missing anything by just going for a single master unit.

Anybody wish to explain? especially the practical use of Master-Slave FDAC set-ups.

Cheers:)
 
timola said:
With the MCRU Linear PSU the plug fits fine...but
Click to expand...

It costs £ 330 more.

The Linear power supplies have shown to offer little upgrade in Sound Quality
by all accounts, maybe 1 or 2 %.

So why pay over 50% of the cost of the original product.?

For £ 360 you can buy an Auralic Aries Mini, which offers improvement over my Win 8.1 laptop and by many accounts the Mac Mini.

Removing the +5v (red) lead from the USB cable also offers a small improvement, and costs almost nothing.

Next tweaks include increasing the capacitance in the Calex power supply from the stock 1000uF to 4700uF, and using a SS USB drive rather than a spinny disk for the Mini.
 
misterdog said:
It costs £ 330 more.

The Linear power supplies have shown to offer little upgrade in Sound Quality
by all accounts, maybe 1 or 2 %.
Click to expand...

Agreed! .... maybe 3% on a good day.:)

Good luck with the cap upgrades ..... don't you just love soldering and mimicking John....I do!
 
EIffel said:
When enabled, the AV bypass feature allows for an analog audio signal to go through the some modified MDACs, and the future MDAC2, as is: the MDAC acts then as a straight wire (ok, the signal goes through relays, and some single end to balanced conversion may take place using only passive components). This feature is automatically enabled when the MDAC2 is switched off and when the headphone unit is active.

This allows to insert the MDAC between a preamp (or AV surround processor) and amp(s), and do as if the MDAC weren't there when it is not used.
Click to expand...

Thanks EIffel so wont be used by me as I do not have an AV processor or separate pre amplifier.
 
misterdog said:
Removing the +5v (red) lead from the USB cable also offers a small improvement, and costs almost nothing.

Next tweaks include increasing the capacitance in the Calex power supply from the stock 1000uF to 4700uF, and using a SS USB drive rather than a spinny disk for the Mini.
Click to expand...

As soon as I have tried shortening the modified RS cable, and heard what that does, I will try to open up the Calex and look at changing capacitors. Even with the long cable, there is an improvement, perhaps at the "1%" level, but a definite plus.

As for SSD, I did that a while back and it was an improvement, but I don't use it any more because I really like the sound from the RAMDisk + SDHD combination. RAMDisk is clunky, but I got used to it, and my SSD is far too small to take my library anyway. I'm hoping somebody reports on using the 2014 Mini with the PCIe card, see post 586 at:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f...t-your-speakers-18159/index24.html#post374395

That could get over the problems of RAMDisk, but the place for discussion of that is at CA- sorry for the distraction here....
 
misterdog said:
It costs £ 330 more.

The Linear power supplies have shown to offer little upgrade in Sound Quality
by all accounts, maybe 1 or 2 %.

So why pay over 50% of the cost of the original product.?

For £ 360 you can buy an Auralic Aries Mini, which offers improvement over my Win 8.1 laptop and by many accounts the Mac Mini.

Removing the +5v (red) lead from the USB cable also offers a small improvement, and costs almost nothing.

Next tweaks include increasing the capacitance in the Calex power supply from the stock 1000uF to 4700uF, and using a SS USB drive rather than a spinny disk for the Mini.
Click to expand...

Let us know how you get on with the caps, take some pics too if you can. Have you ordered some? What did you go for?

I made my RS cable about 0.5 meter straight away as I put the Calex next to my MDAC.
 
JohnW said:
I'm not sure what you mean by DSP filters as the MDAC has no DSP - sound quality as very dependent upon system and personal preferences, almost every MDAC I've had here in for repair is set to one of the Optimal transient filters - I've seen one with Minimum Phase.
Click to expand...

Ah, I was under the impression that the M-DAC's non-native filters were implemented in DSP. Anyway, what I mean is the filters that aren't built into the SABRE DAC.

On a neutral system, I really feel the treble roll-off of the optimal transient filters just sounds too dull. Minimum phase, on the other hand, sounds a little too glary and strident. I was surprised to find that the most listenable DSP filter was optimal spectrum, and I was even more surprised when I found the built-in SABRE filters sounded better still! These filters appear to 0.2dB quieter, which will probably make them sound worse to most people. I initially preferred the fuller sounding midrange of the non-bulit-in filters, but this also made them more prone to chestiness, and the lighter midrange balance of the built-in filters also makes it sound more open and transparent. Plus the bass definitely sounds more even with the built-in filters, although this could be very room and system dependent.

I know you've said you think time domain accuracy is more important than frequency domain accuracy, but I guess for me the opposite is true. And with the slow roll-off filter, you can have your cake and eat it too anyway, as it is excellent in both the frequency domain and the time domain.
 
timola said:
I also have a question which is probably very dim, but it has been bugging me for a long time .... so here goes:

Some people here are in for more than one FDAC with a master - slave configuration in mind. I don't understand how one would use this. I sort of understand that the master unit will provide the clocking for the data stream before the DAC conversion, but I can't see why you would want to send that to another slave-FDAC (perhaps that's in another room/system or somehow connected to another CD/Bluray source?)... I'm wondering if I'm missing anything by just going for a single master unit.

Anybody wish to explain? especially the practical use of Master-Slave FDAC set-ups.

Cheers:)
Click to expand...
It's for use as an active digital crossover with separate D/A conversion for each drive unit.
 
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