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P&O Ferries Scandal

ks.234 said:
Many thanks, can you tell me where you got the info from about the correct person to contact so I don’t make the same mistake again
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https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...form-hr1-advance-notification-of-redundancies

"The Redundancy Payments Service (RPS), acting on behalf of the Secretary of State for Business, Energy & Industrial Strategy, collects the information and distributes it to the appropriate government departments and agencies who offer job brokering services and/or training services."

Which I interpreted as a BEIS responsibility. :)
 
I see GLP have at least noticed the situation (Twitter). Hopefully there will be something of more substance later.

Also looks like the government were aware this was coming, but said/did nothing (Twitter). As ever there is a lot on Twitter if you dig, but most is just gossip/opinion.
 
Tony L said:
I see GLP have at least noticed the situation (Twitter). Hopefully there will be something of more substance later.

Also looks like the government were aware this was coming, but said/did nothing (Twitter). As ever there is a lot on Twitter if you dig, but most is just gossip/opinion.
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Exactly! The Government is feigning surprise...
 
Richard Lines said:
... the shipping world - companies have been c******g on seafarers for decades
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A friend of mine was a sea captain. His employment conditions were appalling. Ships crews were completely changed out for cheaper labour when the opportunity arose.
Although he has now passed I never envied his job and being away from home for so long.
 
Tony L said:
The RMT needs to shoulder some blame for this mess too. They very actively promoted Brexit (RMT Brexit propaganda) which, as can be seen from the stark contrast between P&O behaviour in the UK and the EU, is clearly a factor here. Brexit likely isn’t the sole reason for this awful mess, but it is unquestionably a factor and the idiotic ‘Lexit’ left need to own their bit of it. They are looking remarkably stupid today IMHO.
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This is absolutely nothing to do with Brexit and would have happened whether we were in or out.
 
Cav said:
This is absolutely nothing to do with Brexit and would have happened whether we were in or out.
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Bullshit. Why are directly equivalent P&O/DP World employees still in their jobs within the EU? I know you’ll do absolutely anything to defend trade unions, but the RMT (and others) called this one hopelessly wrong. The simple fact is employment is better protected in the EU than it is in post-Brexit UK. How many jobs need to be lost before the penny eventually drops? The whole point of Brexit was to create a low wage low tax economy. That is what the people who paid for it were buying.
 
The General Election and the return of a Tory majority trumps anything that people thought they were voting for in the referendum. This is a Tory turd blocking the toilet, not the RMT's.
 
Even when we were in the EU it was easier to shed UK workers than say France or Germany. AFAIA employment law hasn’t changed since Brexit- ironically it doesn’t need to such has been the erosion of workers rights under the Tories. Trying to pin blame on the RMT is a bit OTT . Brexit has however placed power in the hands of scum port/ shipping owners as this now pathetic little island is fcuked without them.
 
From The Guardian -

274721741_10224127837396457_4991986410213522220_n.jpg
 
Suffolk Tony said:
From The Guardian -
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'Couldn't have happened' is the kind of naivety that people have, as I alluded to above. Failure to consult will just trigger the automatic 90 day compensation for unfair dismissal. Universities were doing it for years over the multiple termination of fixed term contracts (dismisals which may be fair or otherwise) - occasionally they have been forced to pay up by the Tribunal.
 
Suffolk Tony said:
From The Guardian -

274721741_10224127837396457_4991986410213522220_n.jpg
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Sorry, but as has been discussed upthread much the same law exists in UK legislation and has been broken. The issue isn’t about having laws, but adequate sanctions and enforcement. I can’t say if the EU has better enforcement, but they do seem to have a workforce more willing to take action. The problem in the UK is that public opinion is generally against a workforce taking action.

The P&O arrogance sits in a negative environment for worker rights that goes further back and is wider and deeper than just Brexit
 
ks.234 said:
The P&O arrogance sits in a negative environment for worker rights that goes further back and is wider and deeper than just Brexit
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Agreed, no one is disputing that, but the fact remains Brexit very actively continues this trajectory and it was clear it would at the time. Useful idiots like the RMT, McCluskey, Galloway, Hoey, Stewart, Mann etc etc who shovelled vast numbers of votes in the direction of Arron Banks, the ERG, Rees Moog and countless others who funded and will directly benefit from the low tax, low wage, low rights environment Brexit was designed to bring absolutely need to own some of that blame.

As ever, follow the money… Who paid for it? What exactly did they buy?
 
The forensic lawyer leading the opposition is surely highlighting the illegality of P&O as I write this from my local?

Starmer must by now be giving the Secretary of State a withering roasting for allowing P&O to ride roughshod over employment legislation ?
 
Tony L said:
Agreed, no one is disputing that, but the fact remains Brexit very actively continues this trajectory and it was clear it would at the time. Useful idiots like the RMT, McCluskey, Galloway, Hoey, Stewart, Mann etc etc who shovelled vast numbers of votes in the direction of Arron Banks, the ERG, Rees Moog and countless others who funded and will directly benefit from the low tax, low wage, low rights environment Brexit was designed to bring absolutely need to own some of that blame.

As ever, follow the money… Who paid for it? What exactly did they buy?
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Not disagreeing with any of that except that to focus on Brexit as the immediate cause is to ignore the wider and longer causes that include a public opinion that is against those protecting worker rights from which much much restrictive legislation has been founded
 
ks.234 said:
Not disagreeing with any of that except that to focus on Brexit as the immediate cause is to ignore the wider and longer causes that include a public opinion that is against those protecting worker rights from which much much restrictive legislation has been founded
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I’m not, I’m saying it is clearly a factor, not the immediate cause. My argument is that Brexit is a very obvious continuation of that trajectory and should have been obvious to all at the time, and especially obvious to those who claim to represent workers rights. I view the Labour MPs and trade union barons who no doubt funnelled thousands of votes to facilitate the wishes of Farage, Banks, ERG, the Tory oligarchy etc as absolute idiots. Just incomprehensibly thick.
 
Cav said:
This is absolutely nothing to do with Brexit and would have happened whether we were in or out.
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Tony L said:
The simple fact is employment is better protected in the EU than it is in post-Brexit UK.
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Brexit has no part in this. Unfortunately this is simply an extreme example of what has been going on in the shipping industry for decades.

Shoreside people simply don't see what is going on and shipping, by its very nature, is very spread out and collective action has always been difficult to achieve.

Last year BP issued a new contract for supply boat services out of Aberdeen. They have 4 vessels on near full time charter. At least two of these, on the old contract, had about 50% UK crew. The replacement vessels are crewed, in one case, by Ukranians and, in the other, by a combination of Russians/ Bulgarians. I know this because I've been on them conducting audits.

Regards

Richard
 
Richard Lines said:
Brexit has no part in this. Unfortunately this is simply an extreme example of what has been going on in the shipping industry for decades.

Shoreside people simply don't see what is going on and shipping, by its very nature, is very spread out and collective action has always been difficult to achieve.

Last year BP issued a new contract for supply boat services out of Aberdeen. They have 4 vessels on near full time charter. At least two of these, on the old contract, had about 50% UK crew. The replacement vessels are crewed, in one case, by Ukranians and, in the other, by a combination of Russians/ Bulgarians. I know this because I've been on them conducting audits.

Regards

Richard
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Sounds like a micrososm of industrial relations in the UK generally, albeit an especially brutal one.

It's an inevitable consequence of decades of anti-trade union legislation.
 
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