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What's all the aggression about in the audio room?

spacey said:
Are company like Naim, Meridian, ATC, Cyrus (plus hundered more) all waisting their time developing new products and technologies... should they sack everyone?
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Not if they're making sufficient profits from these new products. The market will decide if the products are 'worthwhile'.
 
At the risk of getting caught in the cross-fire here aren't ATC, for example, using components in their speakers that haven't changed in many years?

That dosen't mean that there is no R & D but that the relative advancement of such matters in the context of the law of diminishing returns, I assume, is bound to slow?
 
Teddy Ray said:
I view the recording process as creative. It is like painting, to use a bad analogy. mics, eqs, consoles, reverbs...these are all like colors or paintbrushes, with the songs being the canvas. the engineer/producer the artist.
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I know some exceptionally highly regarded tonmeisters and engineers who would choke on the arrogance of such a statement. Which is why I think it's better to walk away than to pander to the ego of a jumped-up console jockey with monumental delusions of grandeur.

I think this place could benefit from an 'ignore' button.
 
BlueEyes said:
At the risk of getting caught in the cross-fire here aren't ATC, for example, using components in their speakers that haven't changed in many years?

That dosen't mean that there is no R & D but that the relative advancement of such matters in the context of the law of diminishing returns, I assume, is bound to slow?
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Not really, the amps in my 25's are all new.. ATC have just introduced a newly designed CDP/DAC/Pre about 3 months ago.... They have a whole new line of active domestic monitors due out in the next few months :) and they're still developing a new HF unit.

Whos to say where design and development starts and stops; what makes someone qualified to do so!
 
BlueEyes said:
At the risk of getting caught in the cross-fire here aren't ATC, for example, using components in their speakers that haven't changed in many years?

That dosen't mean that there is no R & D but that the relative advancement of such matters in the context of the law of diminishing returns, I assume, is bound to slow?
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Yes. Audio is an extremely mature subject. A lot of the ground rules in loudspeakers date back to Rice/Kellogg in the 1920s, Olsen in the 1930s and 1940s and Vilchur in the 1950s. A lot of the engineering modelling systems hark back to the Eureka project in the 1970s and the design of MLS and FFT-based audio analysers in the 1980s.

To say as a result everything is all wrapped up is somewhat disingenuous though. There continues to be research into materials science for both drive units and cabinets, as well as more research into resonance and air-flow.

The 'all the science is finished' argument is ultimately a little nonsensical. You could say the same about automotive engineering; we are often driving round in 19th Century engineering concepts, but with 21st Century improvements.
 
the arrogance of such a statement.
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How is it arrogant?

And if colouring the recording process is arrogant, how is 'hifi' that colours the reproduction anything less than hubristic?

Paul
 
Raj, you and I know they have been developing the HF unit for as long as I can remember as they have a DAC/Pre.

Am I looking in the wrong place or has their CDP/DAC/Pre now disappeared from their website maybe as a result of needing more R & D?

As regards a new line where did you hear this as bearing in mind how slow they move forward, which I mean as a compliment and a belief in the integrity of their products, I am gobsmacked that they are making such a wholesale change?
 
BlueEyes said:
At the risk of getting caught in the cross-fire here aren't ATC, for example, using components in their speakers that haven't changed in many years?

That dosen't mean that there is no R & D but that the relative advancement of such matters in the context of the law of diminishing returns, I assume, is bound to slow?
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How many white hot technological developments are there in moving coil speakers? Doesn't seem to have been many/any paradigm shifts since my father was born. Paper cones will still cost you a fortune.
 
A dealers told me they have orders placed already :) It's been mentioned the R&D work done on the 25's has been trickled down to create this new additional range.
 
Alan Sircom said:
I know some exceptionally highly regarded tonmeisters and engineers who would choke on the arrogance of such a statement. Which is why I think it's better to walk away than to pander to the ego of a jumped-up console jockey with monumental delusions of grandeur.

I think this place could benefit from an 'ignore' button.
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Is it not the job of "tonmeisters" and engineers to not choke on the perceived arrogance of statements, we would be without alot of great music if they did.
 
Alan Sircom said:
Yes. Audio is an extremely mature subject. A lot of the ground rules in loudspeakers date back to Rice/Kellogg in the 1920s, Olsen in the 1930s and 1940s and Vilchur in the 1950s. A lot of the engineering modelling systems hark back to the Eureka project in the 1970s and the design of MLS and FFT-based audio analysers in the 1980s.

To say as a result everything is all wrapped up is somewhat disingenuous though. There continues to be research into materials science for both drive units and cabinets, as well as more research into resonance and air-flow.

The 'all the science is finished' argument is ultimately a little nonsensical. You could say the same about automotive engineering; we are often driving round in 19th Century engineering concepts, but with 21st Century improvements.
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Point taken. I was just making the point that there comes a point, presumably, where advancements become increasingly marginal until someone attempts to do something completely different which isn't necessarily better.

For example, ( opens can of worms ) = cd "replacing" vinyl.
 
spacey said:
A dealers told me they have orders placed already :) It's been mentioned the R&D work done on the 25's has been trickled down to create this new additional range.
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Wow, seen nothing on the internet?

Don't you mean trickle up?

I am surprised that if there are to be wholesale changes, mate, that they wern't first given to the professional monitors that the industry uses?
 
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