advertisement


When is a spring not a spring ? When it’s a polymer Insole

MartinC said:
Amazingly despite the post office estimate of a month the insoles arrived today! Hopefully will have some time this weekend to try them out. I haven't really looked into how they fit but imagine it's pretty self explanatory.
Click to expand...
Have you had a chance to install them?
 
John said:
9qxqnud.jpeg
Click to expand...
I noticed your arm-board is slightly offset towards the top plate (Khan?), just like mine. I wonder if that is because the location of the suspension bolts are slightly out of kilter.
 
James said:
I noticed your arm-board is slightly offset towards the top plate (Khan?), just like mine. I wonder if that is because the location of the suspension bolts are slightly out of kilter.
Click to expand...

That is an old photo taken before I really think I had the springs dialed in. The relative location of the armboard from when it was dialed in with springs I found agrees with how it’s situated now with the In-Soles. I used Allen wrenches to determine the gaps on either side of the armboard and came up with 2mm on the top plate side and 4mm on the plinth side.

Does a perfectly setup Keel have 3mm gaps on each side? That of course will vary depending on how the springs are centered with the suspension bolts. If you’re using In-Soles they should be perfectly centered unless the suspension bolts on a Linn top plate have play or are not level. Definitely some variables involved.

It appears that the Klimax LP12 on Linn’s website shows a similar gap to mine.
https://www.linn.co.uk/us/turntables/klimax-lp12
 
FWIW, my LP12 arm board also has a slightly smaller gap on the top plate side than on the plinth side. This is how it’s been for as long as I can remember. The gap between the front of the arm board and the plinth is the same as the gap between the top plate and the arm board. Gotta say, my LP12 has never sounded as good as it now does with the In-Soles installed.
 
I really hope there’s a way In-Soles can continue to be made available. I feel blessed to have been in on the last batch sent out by John R before his passing. Circumstances have been such that I’ve also been able to listen many more hours upstairs on my Big Tannoy’s which are located in a very quiet part of my home. My LP12 has never sounded better and I can’t think of a Linn upgrade that would correct the fundamental issues the springs cause. It’s really like having an entirely new turntable.
 
It's very sad to hear of John's passing. I had ordered a set, but they remain unfulfilled - not that this is any sort of issue in the circumstances.
 
RichardH said:
It's very sad to hear of John's passing. I had ordered a set, but they remain unfulfilled - not that this is any sort of issue in the circumstances.
Click to expand...
I'm in a similar situation. I did send a message, with my condolences and suggesting I'd be happy to cancel and be refunded, but I suspect nobody is dealing with it now John is no longer with us. I sympathise with his loved ones, these things are never nice. I know it's only £36 and I'll write it off rather than make a fuss, but I've just started the eBay process for cancelling and refunding. I think this can happen without any involvement at the seller's side so hopefully it just gets dealt with, without bothering the family at all.
 
I have a theory that my stock Linn belt will stay in newer shape and degrade at a much slower rate with the In-Soles in place. The movement of the platter on startup or when removing/placing records on the sprung LP12 causes stretching of the belt multiple times during a listening session. This does not happen with the In-Soles in place so the belt should perform as new for a long time.
 
And hopefully my blue belt from MikeP will too, although I have no idea what it is made of. Maybe it´s an elastomer too. judging from its apparent effect on the noise floor.
 
It is very interesting seeing this one play out. I remember getting a ton of pushback when I pointed out the LP12 design was not rotationally stable decades ago. The combination of a high centre of gravity and standing on very compliant springs far beneath that point ensures it is never still. I still like the LP12 a lot, it works well despite this. I also find it highly amusing that the TD-124 effectively had a Keel and polymer insoles way back in 1957! Nothing is ever new in audio!
 
Grabbed this photo of a Klimax level deck upgraded to TA Stiletto, TA Skorpion and Audio Silente Mushrooms. No more springs.

O9Oe7CY.jpg
 
I believe the Silente mushrooms cost two or three times as much as JohnR’s Insoles. What is really interesting is that there are people who report results using just the Linn grommets minus the springs so anyone can try them for free. That would be a turn up for the book.
 
Interesting comment. I was expecting the insoles to be very squishy, but they are fairly firm. Not as firm as the spring grommets but I think that would be an interesting test to try grommets on their own vs grommets + springs
 
Chris said:
I believe the Silente mushrooms cost two or three times as much as JohnR’s Insoles. What is really interesting is that there are people who report results using just the Linn grommets minus the springs so anyone can try them for free. That would be a turn up for the book.
Click to expand...

Not much difference in price. Taken from LinnArts website:
https://www.linnarts.se/

Linn Spring Kit 250 SEK

Analogue Innovations INSOLES (Bobbins) Kit 650 SEK

Analogue Innovations INSOLES (Bobbins) Kit for 3rd parties Alu topplate 1 095 SEK

Audio Silente Silicone Mushrooms Kit for std SS topplate 850 SEK

Audio Silente Silicone Mushrooms Kit for 3rd parties Alu topplate 1 250 SEK
 
So don’t buy Insoles via Sweden. I bought mine direct from JohnR last summer, inc. UK delivery for 30 quid. In any case I believe Lennart doesn’t have any Insoles at the moment and therefore recommends the mushrooms anyway. Who knows what will happen with AI. Fingers crossed.
 
Tony L said:
It is very interesting seeing this one play out. I remember getting a ton of pushback when I pointed out the LP12 design was not rotationally stable decades ago. The combination of a high centre of gravity and standing on very compliant springs far beneath that point ensures it is never still. I still like the LP12 a lot, it works well despite this. I also find it highly amusing that the TD-124 effectively had a Keel and polymer insoles way back in 1957! Nothing is ever new in audio!
Click to expand...

I found the thread and the push back, may have been cognitive dissonance and the lack of an alternative solution that caused an irrational trigger.

It will be interesting to see how open minded folks will be to giving In-Soles(if they can still get them) or the Audio Silente mushrooms(which appear to work equally well or better) a try. It’s probably a small percentage of LP12 users who own a jig and work on their deck so it’s unlikely to catch on. The thought of having to undo the deck to reset it up with springs is something that would discourage most folks from giving them a try. I know I wasn’t looking forward to that knowing how much effort it took to get the springs adjusted to my liking. When disassembling the springs I actually identified the location of each one as they were removed and put them in separate baggies with the thought they would be reinstalled.

I don’t see Linn dealers bothering to sell them or encouraging their customers to give them a try unless Linn comes up with their own alternative. I do give credit to LinnArts who is a Linn dealer and quite active on Facebook. He sells quite an array of 3rd party components for the LP12. The above photo was taken from a deck he was working on. Certainly eliminating the springs does simplify, speed up and takes a bit of the mystery out of setting up a LP12.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.


advertisement


Back
Top