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What Brexit tells us

TheDecameron said:
One might argue that walking upright did that quite a long time before a transient economic model.
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One might also surmise that there probably weren't as many early humans about then as there are Chinamen now. Nor, I suspect, was the concept of poverty (or indeed wealth) one which enjoyed wide acknowledgement.
 
Sue Pertwee-Tyr said:
Thing is, properly and effectively regulated capitalism requires the regulator to have a long reach in this globalised world. That can be effective in the context of, say, the EU, but the UK going it alone is basically a signal that multinational companies will be able to run rings around what little regulation we intend to retain.
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Or in the context of, say, the EEC?
 
Seanm said:
40 years of growth have benefited 50% of Americans...slightly less than not at all.
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Yes as I've told you before:

The 'system' has failed a lot of people in the USA. They have now been promised a way of getting better prospects that makes sense to them. That's why they voted for Trump, everything else is peripheral.
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But there is nothing inevitable about it as the figures for China and France show. The system certainly needs adjusting. Politicians and economists really need to consider big infrastructure projects to create decent jobs for those at the sharp end of this present-day stagnant economy.
 
stephen bennett said:
You are right about lack of consolation, but it will a temporary blip. Eastern Europeans will also not be happy when automation replaces them too.

You do realise it's everyone who will be affected by this, right? Brexit won't stop the inevitable move to fewer well paid jobs in the future.


Stephen
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Don't get too excited about automation, there are many jobs that are either uneconomic to automate or the technology is not available to enable automation.
There will still be many jobs in industry for many years to come, unfortunately not in the UK.

Brexit or no Brexit there will be fewer well paid jobs, except for the 18% state workers who have not been hit by economic reality. Compound this with divorce, extended families, student loans, increased retirement age, poor government, poor career prospects for many, we are agreed on that point
 
Darth Vader said:
Note that 99% of businesses employ 0-249 people. We are still effectively a nation-of-shop-keepers but have moved with the times.

Cheers,

DV
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However the UK, by becoming a nation of small scale service industries, has a structural balance of payments deficit.

Sure you can have an economy based on small businesses, but most of them won't be exporting and will be reliant on large foreign corporations for any complex products they consume (domestic appliances, cars, electronic goods, pharmaceuticals).
 
gassor said:
Yes as I've told you before:



But there is nothing inevitable about it as the figures for China and France show. The system certainly needs adjusting. Politicians and economists really need to consider big infrastructure projects to create decent jobs for those at the sharp end of this present-day stagnant economy.
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So you are OK with massive government efforts to take up the slack in consumer income. You just want to do it with infrastructure jobs. But unless you 'ban the bulldozer,' you won't make very many jobs.

And how do you plan to fund a big-enough program? And what about when the infrastructure is all fixed-up?
 
sean99 said:
However the UK, by becoming a nation of small scale service industries, has a structural balance of payments deficit.

Sure you can have an economy based on small businesses, but most of them won't be exporting and will be reliant on large foreign corporations for any complex products they consume (domestic appliances, cars, electronic goods, pharmaceuticals).
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They are also incredibly vulnerable to banking (some of it quite predatory as the recent HBOS/Mills consultant prosecution shows), credit card transaction systems, landlords etc. They may well make up 99% of all businesses but the 1% (the big boys) turnover more than the lot of them put together.
 
DonQuixote99 said:
So you are OK with massive government efforts to take up the slack in consumer income. You just want to do it with infrastructure jobs. But unless you 'ban the bulldozer,' you won't make very many jobs.

And how do you plan to fund a big-enough program? And what about when the infrastructure is all fixed-up?
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Have a look at any building site to see how many people are working there. Then there are the suppliers, delivery firms, architects, the tool makers etc all earning extra and spending more. We have a severe shortage of good social housing which needs to be addressed., more hospital and schools etc. Ultimately business has to expand to make jobs long term, but that happens when there is demand in the economy.
 
TheDecameron said:
They are also incredibly vulnerable to banking (some of it quite predatory as the recent HBOS/Mills consultant prosecution shows), credit card transaction systems, landlords etc. They may well make up 99% of all businesses but the 1% (the big boys) turnover more than the lot of them put together.
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Many things seem to shake down quite naturally to something like the 80/20 rule. A 99/01 rule does suggest an imbalance in the system, doesn't it?
 
It would be interesting to see how much of the "1%" is made up by global companies. If any significant number of them walk, there isn't a cat's chance in hell of small start ups making up the loss. Brexit is taking us to uncharted territory- can you think of a parallel?
 
gassor said:
. We have a severe shortage of good social housing which needs to be addressed., more hospital and schools etc. Ultimately business has to expand to make jobs long term, but that happens when there is demand in the economy.
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All true but when that demand kicks in its for products not made in the UK, which hammers the current account defecit with the rest of the world.
 
Sue Pertwee-Tyr said:
Many things seem to shake down quite naturally to something like the 80/20 rule. A 99/01 rule does suggest an imbalance in the system, doesn't it?
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The UK has a banking and stock market system that favours big companies taking over medium companies. This benefits the banks and other Tory donors
Europe generally has various arcane protections against this.
 
Darth Vader said:
Thats just as silly as saying only those with an IQ above a certain value are allowed to vote. If so where do you set that IQ level?

Democracy is that the views of all the people are represented not just the chosen few.

Cheers,

DV
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Disagree, it'll be 20 years before the full effects of the vote will be felt, those OAP's wont be around most likely. We already know how those with higher IQ's voted anyway
 
Let's cut the crap and stop all this debate and talk of 'democracy'. What we need is a civil war. Brother against sister. Family against family. Proper bloodshed. Last one standing.

We are no more evolved biologically or socially than 1650 or 1860.

Let's fight.
 
tqineil said:
Disagree, it'll be 20 years before the full effects of the vote will be felt, those OAP's wont be around most likely. We already know how those with higher IQ's voted anyway
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Frankly thats rubbish what do you mean by "those with higher IQ's". Since the average is fixed at 100 maybe an academic IQ of 125+? That would eliminate around 90% of the population. Nobody knows how people voted. I suspect that it'll be a lot less than 20 years to see the effects of leaving the Common Market/European Community. Note how that latter has been changed to European Union. Thats says it all really conning the general public slice by salami slice.

At the end of the day no one has a crystal ball and all this doom mongering is just that spreading doom and again conning/manipulating the public.

So how would you rate one of my friends a retired Comprehensive school Head and how would he have voted?

PS the stock market FTSE100 has risen 30% over the last year and those of us with investments have a big smile on our faces.

Cheers,

DV
 
A theory from a plasterer this week was that Labour MPs were no closer to the workers than the Tories. They both recruit from universities and have very little life experience or real world work experience. In the past they would have come from the areas they represent, had life experience and worked in those areas.
 
Darth Vader said:
Frankly thats rubbish what do you mean by "those with higher IQ's". Since the average is fixed at 100 maybe an academic IQ of 125+? That would eliminate around 90% of the population. Nobody knows how people voted. I suspect that it'll be a lot less than 20 years to see the effects of leaving the Common Market/European Community. Note how that latter has been changed to European Union. Thats says it all really conning the general public slice by salami slice.

At the end of the day no one has a crystal ball and all this doom mongering is just that spreading doom and again conning/manipulating the public.

So how would you rate one of my friends a retired Comprehensive school Head and how would he have voted?

PS the stock market FTSE100 has risen 30% over the last year and those of us with investments have a big smile on our faces.

Cheers,

DV
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Most student s and graduates voted Remain I've read elsewhere.

Most of the FTSE 100 trades in $$$'s - hardly surprising it's risen then... enjoy the spoils
 
tqineil said:
Most student s and graduates voted Remain I've read elsewhere.

Most of the FTSE 100 trades in $$$'s - hardly surprising it's risen then... enjoy the spoils
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So you don't know! You just accept something that you have read. A bull led by its nose. And they are young and inexperienced. My own 22 yo voted to stay..... Doh!

The FTSE 100 effectively gives confidence in the performance of the World.

I would encourage anyone who wants to invest for their future after they have saved enough to support themselves for 3 months to go into investments within the stock market. Banks are just rip off merchants laughing all the way home to... their banks.

Cheers,

DV
 
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