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Was I expecting too much?

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I'm starting to feel sorry for the poor sod trying to make a living selling stuff on the Internet.

But on further reflection I think the whole issue hinges on one point:

Where these cables second-hand or did he make them up for you?
 
PaulMB said:
Blasphemy!

The dealer might have been more polite, of course, but I don't see that he did anything really bad. And certainly nothing intentional. He could not know for sure that you have a Naim amp and non-Naim speakers, rather than vice-versa, although he could have asked. If it had happened to me I would have either just used them as they are "reversed", or de-soldered and re-soldered. Which, by the way, is impossible with any "human" soldering iron, I ended up using a gas ring in the kitchen.
I don't think the dealer committed a crime serious enough to raise hell about. Were they new, made to order for you, or second-hand?
If new and bespoke you have a case, if second-hand not really.
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OT - but I'm LOL at the thought of someone re-terminating cable on a gas cooker :)

Richard
 
Upgrader, all opinions aside, if this is really bothering you I can swap the ends over for you FOC though 9M of A5 is bloody heavy so postage is expensive. If you want to pop them into me I'll sort them while you wait.
 
But on further reflection I think the whole issue hinges on one point:

It actually hinges on "audiophilia nervosa", and Naim themselves are not blameless here, as they are the ones who have propagated the myth that their speaker cables have the magical power of directionality.
 
I gave up with A5 because I couldn't even bend it never mind terminate it; horrid stuff, much better around
 
Not my business really, but as someone who often passes for a Naim nut, I'd say that:
a) the seller is IMO only responsible for bad manners, but I agree it was probably due to a bad day. I'd never want to know the thoughts of those we believe to be even the most kind, patient and dedicated sellers in the intimacy of their own heads at the idea of the paranoias we sometimes have with cables and tweaks, especially knowing what they surely must know that we don't.
b) I don't think that reversing the cables will have a noticeable effect. And after some time, when the memory of the wrong pointing arrows (which can be probably erased) will have gone, the mind will be in peace (as the ears are probably much sooner).

If a blind test could be done, problem solved: I honestly would challenge any Naim VIP to recognize the direction of the NAC-A5; but since it isn't, my only advice is, try to ignore the whole matter.

M.
 
Robert said:
Upgrader, all opinions aside, if this is really bothering you I can swap the ends over for you FOC though 9M of A5 is bloody heavy so postage is expensive. If you want to pop them into me I'll sort them while you wait.
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Robert that's a very kind offer sir but unfortunately I have sent the cables back to the dealer who has put them back up for sale.
 
upgrader said:
That may well be the case but if I know that everything is as it should be and still sounds not quite right then I know to look elswhere for any possible weakness.

But that's not the issue here, it's the dealers integrity, or lack of it.
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To be sure rhe dealer's customers relations left something to be desired ... but everyone has bad days. I think you were a tad unreasonable. If I was the dealer I would have bent over backwards to keep you a happy bunny. However accusing the dealer of lacking integrity would IMO be going too far.

Nic P
 
upgrader said:
I recently bought a 9mtr pair of Nac A5 speaker cables from a dealer on these very forums, there was a nice big photo showing Naim plugs at one end and banana plugs at the other.

I assumed (rightly or wrongly) that the black double pronged Naim plugs would be for connection to my Naim amp, and the banana's for the speaker end, but when they arrived I quickly realised that this was not the case and they were in fact terminated the opposite way round.
These were of no use to me in this configuration so I phoned the dealer and explained the situation who's response was "just cut the plugs off and re-terminate them yourself " or "don't you have a friend with a soldering iron" or "just take them to your nearest Naim dealer as I'm sure they will help you out" He also told me that he did not have the facility to re-terminate the cables himself.
I explained that none of his suggestions were practical for me without incuring considerable extra expense so he eventually agreed to have the cables back.

I paid £10 on top of the purchase price to have the cables sent out to me and discovered that it was going to cost me nearly £17 (with insurance) to send the cables back, so I rang the dealer again to ask if he would refund my original postage cost if I paid for the return. I thought this to be a fair proposal considering I did'nt feel entirely to blame for this mistake, anyway he agreed to this so you could say that we reached a gentleman's agreement and all would work out fine in the end.

2 days after he received the cables back I was sent this email.....


I have not refunded you the outgoing postage. As this was ordered in
error I am not legally obliged to and I am afraid that on a week where I
have been messed around by dozens of suppliers and buyers, I have my
business head firmly in place and don't see why I should give out gifts
of money for free. The naim right handed speaker connectors are just
that, loudspeaker connectors, and they are nearly always fitted to the
ends of NACA5 rather than the other way round so clearly the onus was on
you to understand and check this before you purchased.


Needless to say that I was not expecting this type of reply!


So what do you think, WAS I EXPECTING TOO MUCH?
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Yes, you are expecting too much. From the description, if your cables exhibit directionality there is something wrong with them or something seriously wrong with electromagnetic theory. EM theory may not be perfect but is a damn sight closer to perfection than any BS about speaker cable directionality. Just swap the fseckin things round next time!
 
Nic P said:
To be sure rhe dealer's customers relations left something to be desired ... but everyone has bad days. I think you were a tad unreasonable. If I was the dealer I would have bent over backwards to keep you a happy bunny. However accusing the dealer of lacking integrity would IMO be going too far.Nic P
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Yeah I would have to, and it would take me 5 mins to resolder the cables and any "HIFI dealer" who couldn’t do that is not a HIFI dealer he's a "salesman" out to make a fast buck, and there lies the problem in this industry:eek::rolleyes:.
Alan
 
337alant said:
Yeah I would have to, and it would take me 5 mins to resolder the cables and any "HIFI dealer" who couldn’t do that is not a HIFI dealer he's a "salesman" out to make a fast buck, and there lies the problem in this industry:eek::rolleyes:.
Alan
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The postage would probably remove any profit margin ... but your approach would have created a happy customer ... and happy customers create profits in the long term ...

Nic P
 
Sorry to be repetitive but:

Were these new? Did the dealer cut and terminate these cables to your specs? (Did he ask, did you say which ends?)

Or were they second-hand cables? (Did you ask him which ends?)
 
PaulMB said:
Sorry to be repetitive but:

Were these new? Did the dealer cut and terminate these cables to your specs? (Did he ask, did you say which ends?)

Or were they second-hand cables? (Did you ask him which ends?)
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The opening line of the OP is "I recently bought a 9mtr pair of Nac A5 speaker cables from a dealer on these very forums, there was a nice big photo showing Naim plugs at one end and banana plugs at the other.", so they were not made to the OP's spec.

Nic P
 
Thanks guys for all the replies, well most of them.

I will just say that I tend to agree with the first answer to my original post!!
 
Perhaps, but my tendency is to appreciate that if I buy second hand I buy at my risk. If he didn't deliver the item in the photo or it was clearly knackered and the photo didn't show this then you are right, he is a twat.
If on the other hand, you got delivered what is in the photo then that is your look out. He offered to take ten item back, so you would not be out the item cost of a useless piece of kit (although others have commented on a perfectly useful work around) but to ask him to pay for the postage is actually a bit rich.

The dealer might not have been the most diplomatic in the world, but actually I think it is you who is being the twat in this instance.
 
If someone agrees to refund postage, and then doesn't after the item has been returned, there is only one person at fault. If you don't want to refund postage then you don't agree to it.

That's all there is to it.
 
That is a fair comment, stick to what you agree to is only right. My rant was based on silly expectations. Ok they are both at fault IMO.
 
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