VALVE/TUBE SOUND
- Thread starter MikeMA
- Start date
Steven Toy
Accuphase newbie
Mellow = pipe 'n slippers. No thanks!
Mullardman
Moderately extreme...
Steven Toy
Accuphase newbie
If I told you I would have to kill you*.
*Or attempt to alter fundamentally your entire approach to evaluation of high fidelity reproduction of recorded music. I know this would be completely futile.
dave
Plywood King
Serge,
Fish-like shape.
Joe
Mmmm...pass the hush puppies, tarter sauce and sweet tea friend.
Robert
Tapehead
TdP nailed the answer on this.
What you can do with valves you can do with transistors. Depending on what exactly you are trying to do, it can be easier or harder, simpler or more complex depending on which technology you choose.
That's his view and I think it's ultimately correct given a talented designer and little limit on resources.
My view is that if you figure cost, efficiency and ultimate transparency into the picture, SS always has the potential to win-out over tubes. If you simply desire transparency there is no case for using tubes over SS. If you want niceness, or what is effectively a flavoured take on things then tubes can be subjectively better.
IME bad tube amplifiers usually still sound perfectly listenable, whereas bad SS amps usually grate on the ear. The distortions produced by a less than wonderful tube amplifier seem less bothersome subjectively than those from poor SS. Bloody difficult to build a poor SS amp today though.
What you can do with valves you can do with transistors. Depending on what exactly you are trying to do, it can be easier or harder, simpler or more complex depending on which technology you choose.
That's his view and I think it's ultimately correct given a talented designer and little limit on resources.
My view is that if you figure cost, efficiency and ultimate transparency into the picture, SS always has the potential to win-out over tubes. If you simply desire transparency there is no case for using tubes over SS. If you want niceness, or what is effectively a flavoured take on things then tubes can be subjectively better.
IME bad tube amplifiers usually still sound perfectly listenable, whereas bad SS amps usually grate on the ear. The distortions produced by a less than wonderful tube amplifier seem less bothersome subjectively than those from poor SS. Bloody difficult to build a poor SS amp today though.
Arkless Electronics
Trade: Amp design and repairs.
Agreed.
Loads has been said about the 'flavoring' a valve amp can have, but what's even more important in my limited experience with SS vs. valve is, that what 'I" have heard, valve amps always produced a more realistic sound picture with loads of space around the musicians' which "i" never heard from SS amps.
I've used to have a valve amp with tyranny (still got it in storage) and speakers with crossovers (still got them in storage as well). Now I have moved on to tranny-less valve (OTL) amps and (almost) crossoverless speakers.
That's a totally different sound again.
I've used to have a valve amp with tyranny (still got it in storage) and speakers with crossovers (still got them in storage as well). Now I have moved on to tranny-less valve (OTL) amps and (almost) crossoverless speakers.
That's a totally different sound again.
tomek
pfm Member
We havd already all kind of discussions like all cables , all dacs, all power amplifiers have the same sound....
Tubes can sound very different. IMHO generally old tubes from the fifties have the best sound.
My Favourite is Telefunken followed by Valvo and Mullard. IMHO they are worlds between old a new produced tubes.
Here is my collection of ecc83/82 and some others :
In my opinion the key to a good sounding system is one nice tube pre.
Tubes can sound very different. IMHO generally old tubes from the fifties have the best sound.
My Favourite is Telefunken followed by Valvo and Mullard. IMHO they are worlds between old a new produced tubes.
Here is my collection of ecc83/82 and some others :
In my opinion the key to a good sounding system is one nice tube pre.
bottleneck
pfm Member
+ 2
tomek - Im getting rid of a load of ecc82 ecc83 in the classifieds. make a cheeky offer!
Steven Toy
Accuphase newbie
Any JAN Philips Green Label?
MikeMA
pfm Member
When I started this thread I was thinking more in terms of power output tubes than small signal tubes, though similar arguments apply to each.
As an example of what I was trying to get at, it seems to be a commonly held view that EL34s have a smooth open mid-range and top at the expense of a bit of slackness in the bass, while KT88s have tighter bass at the expense of a less smooth mid-range and top. Similar claims are made for other tube types as well. My question is: is this a consistent characteristic of the tube type independent of the circuit it is in, or not?
As an example of what I was trying to get at, it seems to be a commonly held view that EL34s have a smooth open mid-range and top at the expense of a bit of slackness in the bass, while KT88s have tighter bass at the expense of a less smooth mid-range and top. Similar claims are made for other tube types as well. My question is: is this a consistent characteristic of the tube type independent of the circuit it is in, or not?
pure sound
Trade: manufacturer/distributor
I'd say not. Much depends on the working point chosen ie current passing & impedance seen by the valve along with the quality of the transformer loading them.
MikeMA
pfm Member
That is pretty much the conclision I came to simply after experimenting with bias settings.
Arkless Electronics
Trade: Amp design and repairs.
I have loads of Mullard military ECC82's if it's of interest.... All new and boxed.
They have the ministry of defence type code CV4024 and are not branded Mullard.... just have MOD markings... They are Mullard though. Still in bulk pack addressed to "Officer Commanding, 14MU, RAF Carlisle, Cumbria" !
gassor
There may be more posts after this.
I might be interested in 4 x ECC83s, can you let me know when you put them up for sale?