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UK Election 2015 (part II)

Discussion in 'off topic' started by cooky1257, Apr 22, 2015.

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  1. Colin L

    Colin L LOU Attitude Adjuster

    I despair of anyone who thinks that the FTSE 1000 means anything to th real economy in a time of quantitative easing when money is practically given away at minimal interest rates and speculation is rife. Heard of a bubble Mick?

    The UK worker works for lower pay rates and for longer hours than practically anyone else in Northern or Southern Europe. The new jobs created are largely insecure and low paid - more than 50% of the welfare benefits paid by the government are to people in work whose wages are so shit they need top-up.

    UK productivity has crashed because companies arent investing because of the austerity programme, which has cost each and every family in the country £4k pa for no great result apart from fulfilling Tory dogma.

    But you're OK on your beach in Spain, so thats OK then.
     
  2. Greg

    Greg 2t5b

    Mick, "the medicine" you refer to is more "unmitigated disaster"
     
  3. Greg

    Greg 2t5b

  4. jackbarron

    jackbarron Chelsea, London

    Exactly.

    Jack
     
  5. Mullardman

    Mullardman Moderately extreme...

    In the context of the previous post, this is an irrelevant question. At best 'acceptable' levels of deficit are subjective/political decisions, with no absolutes. The answer, (if there is one) has no bearing whatsoever on the ludicrous Tory assertion that Brown single handedly caused the downfall of western civilisation as we knew it.

    Mull
     
  6. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    And we can put a cash number on it of at least £1500 per person or on average £5000 per household, these figures being very conservative ones from OBR to avoid issues with partisanship.

    It's hard to imagine what a Chancellor could do that would be worse than losing 5% of GDP through a policy experiment with *literally* no theoretical support. Thatcher's failed experiments with Monetarism is about the only possible candidate.
     
  7. Tigerjones

    Tigerjones Bagpuss

    In what form is this money we've all lost or not gained?
     
  8. Steven Toy

    Steven Toy L3 Toy

    This is an oft-repeated straw man. I am certainly not saying that Brown caused the crash. I am saying that a budget deficit during the boom made it difficult to apply Keynsian stimulus during the bust. It would be fair to say that we can blame the last Labour government for the need for any austerity measures since.
     
  9. Tony L

    Tony L Administrator

    As a matter of interest can you point to a time where any Tory government actually built up a surplus rather than just dishing out tax cuts to wealthy party backers etc? Tory economic prudence is a myth/100% cynical revisionism as far as I can tell. I can remember the boom/bust of the 80s very well, not that where I lived ever got to see any 'boom' (aside from some riots).
     
  10. bownose

    bownose pfm Member

    Postal ballot arrived. God, what a futile feeling this is. Of the selections (I'm loath to call it a choice) I see no elder tentacled gods, I see no equine sun princesses or their moody lunar god-sisters, there are no robots or machines of impeccable logic and beneficent intelligence, no elder beings from a long forgotten civilisation, no future time traveller warning us of the consequences, no worn out washed up musician hoping for a stab at the limelight and nose in the trough, no elevated amoeboid life form* and no scary clown in a top hat. Not even an anarchist who wants to kick it all down and doesn't care what happens after the remains have been kicked into dust.

    And no one even offered me a pony by way of a bribe. Ingrates.

    *Not even UKIP or the Tories

    I'm going back to bed. Wake me up when this is over.
     
  11. Bob McC

    Bob McC Living the life of Riley

    Here in Poynton we have to vote for a govt,., a county council and a town council on Election Day.
     
  12. Steven Toy

    Steven Toy L3 Toy

    There was a budget surplus at the time of the 1997 General Election.

    http://www.debtbombshell.com/britains-budget-deficit.htm
     
  13. ultrawomble

    ultrawomble Sith Lord

    I guess that means that working tax receipts are on the rise and in-work benefits payments are on the decrease. Or is it the other way round? ;)
     
  14. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    Expressing it in amount per household is just a way to make people understand how much money 5% of GDP is. You don't get a cheque / bill for the difference :)
     
  15. matthewr

    matthewr spɹɐʍʞɔɐq spɹoɔǝɹ ɹnoʎ sʎɐld

    Except that's not true. What made Keynesian stimulus difficult was a political climate that said WE ARE DOOMED! BOND VIGILANTIES! WE ARE GREECE! WE MUST REDUCE THE DEBT! All of which, to be impolite for a moment, was bollocks.

    Except that:

    a) It would not be fair.
    b) We didn't need Austerity at all.
    c) In fact Austerity made our economy and our debt position worse not better.
     
  16. Joe P

    Joe P certified Buffologist / mod

    Matthew,

    Is it fair to say that Osborne's austerity measures have cost the UK economy the equivalent of one very good line-level preamp perhaps on a bit of Mana with a cat pee deflector thrown in per household?

    I think people aren't quite getting this so perhaps a concrete illustration would help.

    Joe
     
  17. cooky1257

    cooky1257 pfm Member

    Per year...... when you factor in the drop in real incomes too, so it's cost us all the above, plus a nice pair of Tannoy Golds and valve amp.
     
  18. Darth Vader

    Darth Vader From the Dark Side

    Joe,

    Matthew missed out some important words:-

    "and the resulting slowdown may have cost 5% of GDP, or £1,500 for every man, woman and child in Britain".

    Nobody knows what would have actually happened.

    I may have had a win on the lottery last week but I didn't buy a ticket. That doesn't mean that I would have does it?

    Cheers,

    DV
     
  19. Tigerjones

    Tigerjones Bagpuss

    Are I see. Probably a poorly worded question. I can accept cash.
     
  20. notaclue

    notaclue pfm Member

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